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Clutch won't disengage after new install - Ideas?

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Clutch won't disengage after new install - Ideas?

Postby ttermyna » 26 Jan 2010, 00:21

I'm stumped. New clutch, pressure plate, throwout/slave installed this past weekend in my 1999 V70. Flywheel was resurfaced, machinist told me he took off close to 20,000ths of an inch. Everything went back together fine, initially I was worried when I couldn't get any clutch pedal feel but after some reading here >>> http://www.jimrothe.com/volvo/clutch_bl ... html#volvo
and the purchase of a motive bleeder, that problem has been solved.
After the hydraulic line was pressure bled, I attempted to put the car in gear. The synchos engaged slightly and the car tugged forward, but not nearly enough to really move it. The VADIS software shows some models with a self adjusting clutch mechanism which appear to need compression, but the clutch which was installed/replaced on the car was not this type. My mechanic friend and I are at a loss but have these ideas:
1) The machinist seemed to indicate 20,000ths of an inch on the flywheel is a good deal of metal. Apparently the flywheel was "cupped" which he said is typical due to heating for thinner dual mass flywheels. Does this amount seem unusual? Should spacers be used behind the flywheel?
2) Is there any sort of adjustment on the pressure plate which we may have missed?
I would like to get an idea of what this might be before we resort to tearing everything out again. Thanks in advance>>>Troy
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Re: Clutch won't disengage after new install - Ideas?

Postby vegasjetskier » 26 Jan 2010, 01:24

Are you sure you have all of the air out of the hydraulic line?
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Re: Clutch won't disengage after new install - Ideas?

Postby Ozark Lee » 26 Jan 2010, 01:51

Are you sure the clutch disc was installed back in the proper orientation? There is a front and back side.

The reason I ask is that I once put a new clutch into a 740 backwards and it behaved very much as you describe.

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Re: Clutch won't disengage after new install - Ideas?

Postby FCPGroton » 26 Jan 2010, 01:54

+1

It sounds like the clutch disc it backwards or the line has a lot of air in it. I would try and bleed the line first and see if that helps the issue. If it doesn't, you will need to pull the transmission out and check the clutch itself.
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Re: Clutch won't disengage after new install - Ideas?

Postby ttermyna » 26 Jan 2010, 02:39

Thanks for the responses all. Will try to bleed a few more times before we go back in. Will post what I find. I had hoped to make a "how to" out of this little project but at this point it's more like "how not to".
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Re: Clutch won't disengage after new install - Ideas?

Postby ttermyna » 28 Jan 2010, 00:06

Update:
Clutch was bled again, still no dice. Dropped transmission, clutch disc is installed correctly. Has anyone here ever needed to shim the flywheel after resurfacing? Does anyone know how much travel the throwout bearing should have?
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Re: Clutch won't disengage after new install - Ideas?

Postby cattledog » 28 Jan 2010, 00:14

Does the pedal "feel" normal.
Never heard of shimming a flywheel, nor would I recommend, if it's that bad, replace.
We used to back bleed saab clutch slave cylinders off of the front brake caliper.
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Re: Clutch won't disengage after new install - Ideas?

Postby larryh » 28 Jan 2010, 00:26

is the cluch fork ok? i had a cracked/bent fork in a truck of mine. acted similar
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Re: Clutch won't disengage after new install - Ideas?

Postby vegasjetskier » 28 Jan 2010, 00:38

ttermyna wrote:Update:
Clutch was bled again, still no dice. Dropped transmission, clutch disc is installed correctly. Has anyone here ever needed to shim the flywheel after resurfacing? Does anyone know how much travel the throwout bearing should have?


You shouldn't have to shim it. They took 20 thousandths off of the entire flywheel surface, right?

I helped my stepson put a new clutch in his Ford pickup and it took forever to get it to work. The master cylinder was mounted at an angle and an air bubble got stuck at the top. We bled it for 4 straight hours and couldn't get it to work. Finally I had to take the piston out of the cylinder (from inside the car) and fill it with fluid to eliminate the air bubble. Then it worked. I don't know if the Volvo design is similar or not.

If you're sure there's no air in the line, then I suspect that the new clutch disk is too thick or you have the wrong pressure plate.
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Re: Clutch won't disengage after new install - Ideas?

Postby ttermyna » 28 Jan 2010, 00:52

Pedal feel is normal, or what i suppose is normal (bought the car with the clutch on the way out and it was really stiff.) It feels more resistant than the wife's S40, but less than it was. As far as bleeding off the brakes, isn't the system separate from the clutch (two part reservoir?) Thanks for the responses.
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Re: Clutch won't disengage after new install - Ideas?

Postby ttermyna » 28 Jan 2010, 00:59

@ vegasjetskier:
The clutch was purchased as a kit, manufactured by LUK. This was also the make of the previous clutch (which i believe is the original) I don't know if the throwout was branded. Master cylinder suggestion is a thought.
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Re: Clutch won't disengage after new install - Ideas?

Postby ttermyna » 28 Jan 2010, 01:33

Apparently the slave cylinder did not put out any fluid when the bearing was depressed. Could this be a sign of blockage after the bleeder valve? Is it possible that air could be trapped in the slave?
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Re: Clutch won't disengage after new install - Ideas?

Postby cattledog » 28 Jan 2010, 03:03

Yes they are two seperate systems, but here's what you do, and I'll bet you've got air in the system.
Run a clear tube from the drivers side bleeder screw to the bleeder screw on the clutch slave cylinder, open both bleeders and s-l-o-w-l-y push down on the brake pedal and release several times, close the bleeders and try the clutch pedal again. Tell us what you find.
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Success!

Postby ttermyna » 06 Feb 2010, 21:34

Wanted to post an update:
Problem is resolved, turns out I DID have a self adjusting clutch. And it required adjusting. The Luk clutch I used is identical to the one in the picture here: http://forums.swedespeed.com/zerothread?id=130534
The user who posted it says this pressure plate "bolted up", no adjustment needed. Mine however needed to be compressed and the inner plastic "ramps" rotated. VADIS shows a special tool for this, i simply borrowed a three jaw puller from autozone (its free, i believe it was the larger 3 ton version) Just to be on the safe side, before installing the transmission I hooked up the slave cylinder and pressurized the system to 20 PSI. Then slowly compressed the throwout/slave several times till no bubbles appeared in the master cylinder. After disconnecting the hydraulic line, i stoppered the end of the slave with the protective plastic cap it was shipped with (if you do it this way, leave the cap on loose before trying to mate the transmission. I didn't and it was impossible)
We also bled off the caliper as cattledog suggested. I didn't get to check it until Friday afternoon as the car was no start (Speed sensor died, it appeared to be crushed when we first took it out. Guessing the jostling after having the tranny out twice finally killed it) and the passenger side inner CV bearing cage exploded and tore up the joint innards. Finding the right axle was a nightmare. Erie Vo-Vo came through and got me a new one within two days for $95 shipped. Many thanks go out to them. Really glad this is finally over, though I've got the abs/tracs light on now (guessing i banged something up doing the clutch) and the flame trap needs to be cleaned asap. Thanks to everybody for your responses.
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