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How to read 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage with an ELM327

Help, Advice and DIY Tutorials on Volvo's extremely popular car line -- Volvo's 1990s "bread and butter" cars -- powered by the ubiquitous and durable Volvo inline 5-cylinder engine.
1992 - 1997 850, 850 R, 850 T5-R, 850 T5, 850 GLT
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How to read 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage with an ELM327

Postby esl_97_850_T5 » 25 May 2013, 14:27

Contrary to conventional wisdom here and on other Volvo sites, the mileage of the 1996 and 1997 Volvo 850 cars can be read from the COMBI (Instrument Panel computer) using an ELM327 device. It does not require a Volvo Scan Tool (VST) or other high cost scanner.

If you have an ELM327 v1.4 or higher, and if you can already use the ELM327 to communicate with the Volvo 850 to obtain the emission diagnostics DTCs via the ELM327 commands:

>0100
>0101
>03

then you should be able to read (the raw data containing) the mileage(s) with the following commands:

>ATZ
>ATL1
>ATE1
>ATH1
>ATAL
>ATKW0
>ATTA 13
>ATIIA 51
>ATWM 82 51 13 A1
>ATSI
>ATSH 84 51 13
>B90300
>B90400

If you cut and paste those commands and the ELM327's responses -- most especially the B90300 and B90400 commands and their responses -- into the "Paste Volvo 850 communication here" box at:

http://jonesrh.info/volvo850/kwpd3b0_interpreter.html

It will attempt to interpret the communication and display (what is thought to be) the "Vehicle Mileage" and the "Mileage at Service Light Reset".

It could be that I've misinterpreted the meaning of those 2 mileages and that they need to be added together to come up with the "Vehicle Mileage". You'll just have to try it and see.

Keep in mind that these two mileages do not include any "lost miles" that were impossible to record because the ABS module was not supplying a proper speed signal to the COMBI. It could be that some of the other B9nn data can be used to estimate those "lost miles".

[Note: I use the term ECU to generally refer to "electronic control unit", ie, all the car's computers or computer-like modules, rather than the more common usage as "engine control unit" to refer strictly to the engine's computer.]

For lots more information on how to retrieve all the COMBI's (ie, ECU 51's) B9nn data, suggestions how it might be interpreted, and ideas on how to guess the "lost miles", refer to:

http://jonesrh.info/volvo850/elm327_reads_volvo_850_mileage.html

or check out all the pages and .rtf files that feed from my "Volvo 850 OBDII" portal:

http://jonesrh.info/volvo850/index.html

I think you'll find stuff there that is, as of today 2013-05-25, found nowhere else on the net. It should answer a great number of your questions about how to communicate with 1996-1997 Volvo 850 non-engine ECUs.

There's enough information there -- even now, with the portal only partially complete -- so others can see how to add 96-97 Volvo 850 non-emission diagnostics capabilities to existing mass produced scan tools and/or standalone software packages that utilize either an ELM327 based device or a VAG/COM KKL like device.

If you dig into the FAQ, you'll probably find how to also -- with the ELM327 -- read and clear DTCs for the ABS (ECU 01), COMBI (ECU 51), SRS (ECU 58), AW 50/42 Transmission (ECU 6E), Power Seat Left (ECU 2E), and Power Seat Right (ECU 2F).

Eventually, I'd like to figure out how to properly clear the 3 Service Reset Interval limits in order to do a Service Light Reset, in addition to updating the B904 mileage that seems to be the Mileage at Service Light Reset.

In the near future, I'll focus on adding more interpretation capability to kwpd3b0_interpreter.html. It may occasionally be temporarily broken, since I do live testing. However, in those situations the interpreter should be working again within an hour or less.

I'll tentatively plan on checking this thread every week or so (if I have internet access). It would be nice to get some feedback on my various hypotheses of what the ECU 51 B9nn data means. The best way for me to get the feedback is for you to add easy-to-see, explanatory comments to the ELM327 logs that you submit for automatic, quick interpretation at:
http://jonesrh.info/volvo850/kwpd3b0_interpreter.html
And this thread is the other obvious feedback vehicle.

Questions I'd like to get answered

The following are the questions I'd like answered using crowd source data from 1996-1997 Volvo 850 (and 1998-1999 S70/C70 family) owners:

1. Does B903 reflect the Total Vehicle Miles (minus "lost miles")? Or must B903 and B904 be added together?
2. How does B90A factor in to a dealer (ie, VST) reported mileage, if any? Does it "manipulate" the mileage at all?
3. Does B90A reflect Months Vehicle Speed Signal is Missing (from the ABS)? Or is it an Hours figure like the author of Brick-Diag suggests?
4. Is B901 the Country Code? What values do you see for B901 data besides A4 hex = 164 decimal, which presumably means USA?
5. What other values are there for B905, besides 10 hex (which I'm assuming implies 16000 kilometers)?
6. Do all owners see a value in B905 which tends to equate to kilometers, even when they own a vehicle manufactured for the US and other non-metric country?
7. Do all owners see B906 (1/4 Days since Service Light Reset) and B904 (Mileage at Service Light Reset) correlating very highly with the last known Service Light Reset a) as recorded in a CarFax, if pre-owned at that time, or b) as your accurate (to the exact day +/- 1) maintenance records indicate, if you owned the vehicle at the time of the Service Light Reset?
8. Does anyone have experience with recording B903, B904, B905, B906, B907, B908, and B909 soon before and soon after the Service light begins its illuminating after at least one of its Service Reminder Interval limits have been reached? If so, that would help to establish more confidence that:
a) B903 and B904 are used to see if the B905 limit is reached,
b) B906 is used to see if the B907 limit is reached, and/or
c) B908 is used to see if the B909 limit is reached.
9. Does anyone have a B90B value other than FF hex? If so, have you ever had any ABS problems that caused the speedometer to act flaky? Another way to word this is question is: Does B90B mean "MANIPULATED=YES"? If not, what does it mean?
10. Another B90B question. This one to determine if it really is used to indicate whether the Turbo gauge exists in your dash. If you have a Turbo gauge, does your B90B value = FF hex? If you do not have a Turbo gauge, is your B90B value = 00?
11. Does everyone see 3 values in B90C that can be interpreted as temperatures that reflect the bottom tick mark, 1/3 position, and 1/2 (horizontal) position of the Temp gauge?
12. Does anyone see how any of the B9nn data can be interpreted as 5000 / 7000 RPM?
13. What does B90D mean? Is it something relating to "Speed Warning"? Have you ever had a "Speed Warning"? If so, what are your ECU 51 DTCs as shown when using the AE0100 command instead of a B90300 command? [The DTCs come after the "xx 13 51 EE 01" and before the checksum byte, ie, the last hex byte displayed. At least that's how they would appear if ATH1 was used to show the headers.]
14. For B90E, does everyone see either C3 hex = 195 or CD hex = 205? If not, what do you see?

Reason I started a new thread

I've chosen to start a brand new thread relating to the 96-97 Volvo 850 mileage reading from the COMBI, since this one should be more ELM327 oriented.

There's already the good jimmy57 2011-10-25 22:45 post's instructions in the
http://www.matthewsvolvosite.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=43723&p=212426#p212488
"How do I retrieve the correct mileage on 1996 850" thread that details how to read the mileage using the VST.

And there's already takane2's "Playing with the OBD-ii... got the mileage?" 2010-03-24 thread relating to how to supposedly read the 96-97 850 mileage by pulsing OBDII pin 7 with a flashing LED tool. But I strongly distrust and disapprove of the "takane2, OBDII pin 7, flashing LED tool" hack, since it causes -- 100% of the time -- a brand new ECU 51 DTC 06 on my 1997 Volvo 850 T5 with Motronic 4.3. I never got takane2's method to work. It might work for Motronic 4.4, but considering that this is a 3 year old thread and very few people have successfully used takane2's method to read their 1996-1997 850 mileage from the COMBI, I'd suggest avoiding it, avoiding any possible damage it might do, and using the method of reading ECU 51 B903 and B904 mentioned here.

And, lastly, there's the "How to read your actual miles from the ECU" thread on how to read the Volvo 850 mileage on the pre-96 Volvo 850. That one's covered very thoroughly. But it's for pre-1996 cars and doesn't have anything to do with the 1996-1997 cars that this thread is focused on. So the pre-1996 cars should be off limits in this thread.

I'm not certain how applicable this 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage reading approach is to the later, 850-like, 1998-1999 S70/C70, etc. cars.

My view is that this thread should be very ELM327 Volvo 850 (and maybe S70/C70, etc, if they apply) focused. I see it as a place to discuss not just the COMBI's mileage, and not just the COMBI's B9nn data and A5nn data, but all the 850 ECUs communication via the Volvo 850's keyword D3B0 protocol. So it could also include discussion of reading and clearing those ECUs DTCs, and how the DTCs that appear in the keyword D3B0 protocol messages relate to those 3 digit codes that appear in the Volvo literature. I wouldn't mind if it also included examples of ELM327 OBDII emission diagnostics communication.

How to read and clear DTCs for ABS, COMBI, AW 50/42, SRS, and Power Seats

At present, the best place on my site to see how to read and clear DTCs is at:

http://jonesrh.info/volvo850/volvo_850_obdii_faq.rtf

Request to incorporate into other scanners and scanning software

I would love for this ELM327 info to be incorporated into Brick-Diag, since Brick-Diag seems like the most promising, seemingly affordable software with some VST-subset functionality. And I would love for the mileage reading and even the ELM327 capability to be merged into Vol-FCR. And, I would love for the mileage reading and non-emission diagnostics DTC reading and clearing to be incorporated into the (already ELM327 capable) Android Torque app.

But, if it isn't and/or if you just don't have the money to pay for them, then with the above minimal ELM327 commands (at the top of this post), an affordable ELM327 based device, and the info at the pages feeding from http://jonesrh.info/volvo850/index.html, you should be able -- on your own -- to read the mileage, read the DTCs, and reset (at least some of) the DTCs for the 1996-1997 Volvo 850 ABS, COMBI, SRS, AW 50/42, and Power Seats.

Thanks

This is my thanks to the many fine contributions at Matthews Volvo Site that have been indispensable when debugging some problems that I've had on my 1997 Volvo 850 T5.

I'm also deeply indebted to rkam for his very useful description of the Motronic 4.4 protocol in the very first post of his "Diagnose and communication" thread at ECUPROJECT.COM:
http://forum.ecuproject.com/showthread.php?1664-Diagnose-and-communication
Without that description, I have doubts whether my Volvo 850 OBDII portal would exist today. That Motronic 4.4 protocol is the one I call the Volvo keyword D3B0 protocol (or sometimes refer to it as KWPD3B0 or KWP6227). Its high level command set possibilities (that rkam clearly lists) is the same basic protocol used by the 1996-1997 Volvo 850 ABS, COMBI, SRS, AW 50/42, and Power Seats.

I'm also thankful for the Brick-Diag Kombi screens posted at:
http://gallery.volvo-welt.de/v/daniel2345/05.07.2009-0.0.0.32/
They were helpful in interpreting the COMBI B9nn data.

And, last but not least, I'm very thankful for the excellent ELM327 product and the very thorough ELM327 data sheet at:
http://www.elmelectronics.com/DSheets/ELM327DS.pdf
It is an easy to understand manual.

Enjoy.
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Re: How to read 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage with an ELM327

Postby matthew1 » 25 May 2013, 17:43

ESL, this is an outstanding post. I've had a bluetooth ELM327 for several months, but haven't found time to play with it.

I'm going to Sticky this for a couple days so that all our 850, S70, V70, C70 & V70-XC Forum (1992-2000) users have time to see it.
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Re: How to read 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage with an ELM327

Postby jreed » 27 May 2013, 11:49

This is one of the most inspiring posts I've seen! Thank you. I have a lot of reading to do to get up to speed. My previous car-communication efforts have been pretty limited (a commonplace off-the-shelf OBDII code reader and a little homebrew LED+switch code reader for reading and clearing the ECC codes which I wrote up here: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=50443#p251189 ). I'm looking forward to studying this material and getting more involved. Thanks again!! :)
1997 855 GLT (Light Pressure Turbo) still going strong. Previous: 1986 240 GL rusted out in '06, 1985 Saab 900T rusted out in '95, 1975 Saab 99 rusted out in '95, 1973 Saab 99 rusted out in '94
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Re: How to read 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage with an ELM327

Postby esl_97_850_T5 » 12 Jun 2013, 09:25

For those of you who may have had problems getting the ELM327 setup and communicating via Hyperterminal (or some other terminal emulator), I've done several things:

1. Added a page to assist in getting the ELM327 drivers and simple scanner software setup on WinXP. Some of it will be applicable to later Windows versions. That page is based on some excellent, already existent instructions elsewhere on the net. I've simply added my spin to them, and included a section of how I recovered from my initial failed attempts at ELM327 setup when following the instructions from the vendor. Hopefully, the page will help you get to the point where you can run OBDII emission diagnostics via the ELM327. Much of the info on that page is actually applicable to many types of vehicles. It isn't Volvo 850 specific. The page is titled "How to Setup an ELM327 on WinXP" and resides at:

http://jonesrh.info/volvo850/elm327_setup_on_winxp.html

2. Added some details in the Volvo 850 OBDII FAQ on how to setup Hyperterminal for communicating to the Volvo 850 via an ELM327. You can access the FAQ via http://jonesrh.info/volvo850/index.html in its Volvo 850 OBDII portal pull-down menu, where there is a Volvo 850 OBDII FAQ link. The FAQ is an .rtf file at present.

Search the FAQ for the question: Q. How do I setup Hyperterminal on WinXP to talk with and record the ELM327 conversation? Something in that question's answer might help you.

3. Updated all HTML pages or .rtf files which feed from the Volvo 850 OBDII portal pull-down menu, including some of what I've learned while experimenting with the Realterm terminal emulator. I'll be adding more on Realterm in the coming days, since it appears to be the most promising route to quickly automate (or semi-automate) the scanning of the Volvo 850 (without resorting to building a program from scratch).

4. Added yet another page, titled "ELM327 Commands to Scan a Volvo 850" and residing at:

http://jonesrh.info/volvo850/elm327_volvo_850_scan.html

that has two lists of ELM327 commands and Volvo 850 destined requests.

- The "full blown scan" list which: a) scans all the Volvo 850 "OBDII port 7 accessible" data that I know about involving the COMBI, SRS, ABS, AW 50-42, and Power Seats, b) scans the OBDII emission diagnostic data, and c) includes all DTCs from both of those sets.

- the "quick summary scan" list which simply: a) scans to see any DTCs, either emission diagnostic DTCs, or DTCs from the COMBI, SRS, ABS, AW 50-42, and Power Seats, and b) scans the COMBI's B9nn and A5nn data.

Those two lists are outstanding "cheat sheets" for driving the ELM327, either interactively or via some sort of program control, to communicate via the Volvo special keyword D3 B0 protocol.
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Re: How to read 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage with an ELM327

Postby esl_97_850_T5 » 08 Sep 2013, 16:07

Here's another 1996-1997 Volvo 850 comm via ELM327 tip...

How to read/clear SRS DTCs on a 1996-1997 Volvo 850 using an ELM327.

Contrary to conventional wisdom:

1. The SRS DTCs can definitely be read by ELM327 devices.
2. At least some of the SRS DTCs can be cleared by ELM327 devices and stay away for months.

To read and clear SRS DTCs on a 1996-1997 Volvo 850 with an ELM327 device, use a terminal emulator such as Hyperterminal, Realterm, etc., issue the following commands once the ELM327 prompts with ">". Follow each command by pressing the Enter key. Do not enter the lines with the "------" dashes or "**" asterisks. They are simply explanations.

ATZ
ATL1
----- Be sure to always follow an ATZ command with ATL1.
ATE1
ATH1
ATAL
ATKW0
ATTA 13
ATIIA 58
ATWM 82 58 13 A1
ATSH 84 58 13
------ The commands above involving "58" are unique for ECU 58 (SRS).
** The next command may take up to 5 seconds, since it causes
** the ELM327 to perform a Slow Init to establish ISO9141-2 comm.
AE0100
------ Read the SRS DTCs (after performing Slow Init).
AF0100
------ Clear the SRS DTCs.
AE0100
------ Read the SRS DTCs.

Then when you're finished:

A00000
------ Tell SRS to stop communicating with you.
ATPC
------ Tell the ELM327 to cease sending the KeepAlive (A1) messages.

If you want to look at the Freeze Frames before clearing the DTCs, you'll have to determine the DTCs in the response to AE0100, then include Freeze Frame commands for them. For example, if you had 3 SRS DTCs: 03 02 04, then the Freeze Frame commands:

AD0200
AD0300
AD0400

would need to be issued before you issue the AF0100 (Clear DTCs) command, else the Freeze Frame data may be erased.

To interpret the SRS DTCs:

1. Using Volvo 850 keyword D3 B0 protocol interpreter. This is the easiest way to me. It involves a simple copy from a terminal emulator display (or its capture log file) of anything you want interpreted, then pasting that into the Paste Volvo 850 communication here box at jonesrh.info/volvo850/kwpd3b0_interpreter.html. Be sure to click in the box before pasting, then after the paste, click Interpret and wait a few seconds for the results on a page titled "Volvo 850 keyword D3 B0 protocol interpreter results". It will have a box titled "Gleanings" which will show the interpretations, the line which it interpreted, and usually 1 line preceding that one. Note that the interpreter requires that the lines to be interpreted are left-aligned, which is how they would essentially always appear in the ELM327 log. Its OK to take the easy route and just do a "Select All" and copy the entire log file's contents, as long as it isn't more than 20000 characters.

2. Download volvo_850_obdii_faq.rtf and search for the question "How do I use the ELM327 to read/clear my DTCs for ECU 58 (SRS)?". Also search for the 1st two lines containing "EE 01". The paragraph that those two lines are in has a very useful ABS example which clearly shows, by example, how to extract the DTCs. Finally, search for the SRS specific "58 EE 01" lines. After looking at those examples a little bit, you'll begin to be able to visually look at a message and mentally extract the DTCs from it. This mechanism will apply equally well to the DTC responses for COMBI, SRS, ABS, AW 50-42, and the Power Seats.

3. Peruse the COMBI's AE0100 description for another cursory explanation.

Similar command sequences can be used for the COMBI and Power Seats if you substitute their ECU #s in the 3 lines above that contain "58".

To read/clear COMBI DTCs and look at its Freeze Frames for DTCs 02, 05, and 06:
ATZ
ATL1
ATE1
ATH1
ATAL
ATKW0
ATTA 13
ATIIA 51
ATWM 82 51 13 A1
ATSH 84 51 13
AE0100
AD0200
AD0500
AD0600
AF0100
AE0100
A00000
ATPC

To read/clear Power Seat Left DTCs:
ATZ
ATL1
ATE1
ATH1
ATAL
ATKW0
ATTA 13
ATIIA 2E
ATWM 82 2E 13 A1
ATSH 84 2E 13
AE0100
------ You'll always have an ECU 2E DTC 14.
AF0100
AE0100
A00000
ATPC

To read/clear Power Seat Left DTCs:
ATZ
ATL1
ATE1
ATH1
ATAL
ATKW0
ATTA 13
ATIIA 2F
ATWM 82 2F 13 A1
ATSH 84 2F 13
AE0100
------ You'll always have an ECU 2F DTC 14.
AF0100
AE0100
A00000
ATPC

Then with further adaptation to use the AE01 / ATBD combo and AF01 / ATBD combo, you can read up to 12 DTCs for the ABS and AW 50-42 and you can clear their DTCs.

To read/clear ABS DTCs:
ATZ
ATL1
ATE1
ATH1
ATAL
ATKW0
ATTA 13
ATIIA 01
ATWM 82 01 13 A1
ATSH 83 01 13
AE01
------ This will read the DTCs, but they won't be displayed for some reason.
ATBD
------ This will display the DTCs if it is issued immediately after the AE01's NO DATA response.
AF01
------ This will attempt to clear the DTCs, but its response won't be displayed for some reason.
ATBD
------ This will display the AF01's response if it is issued immediately after the AF01's NO DATA response.
AE01
ATBD
------ Works same as previous AE01 / ATBD.
ATSH 82 01 13
A0
------ Tells ABS to stop its communication link.
ATPC
------ Tells ELM327 to stop sending the KeepAlive.

To read/clear AW 50-42 DTCs
(same comments as for ABS apply):
ATZ
ATL1
ATE1
ATH1
ATAL
ATKW0
ATTA 13
ATIIA 6E
ATWM 82 6E 13 A1
ATSH 83 6E 13
AE01
ATBD
AF01
ATBD
AE01
ATBD
ATSH 82 01 13
A0
ATPC

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Re: How to read 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage with an ELM327

Postby marshappynation » 12 Sep 2013, 12:56

We have bought a 1996 Volvo 850, non-turbo, with a broken odometer. We fixed the odometer by replacing the tiny plastic cog. We now want to get the correct mileage without resorting to a dealer. Our ELM327 should arrive Saturday. We know nothing about car computer diagnositics but esl's instructions look complete and legible. So hopefully you will hear from us again soon. We are loving our new old car. :D Thank you all.
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Re: How to read 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage with an ELM327

Postby rspi » 12 Sep 2013, 13:28

Does anyone know if the ScanGauge 2 is capable of doing the commands listed above? There are a lot of settings and different things that can be done with it.
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Re: How to read 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage with an ELM327

Postby esl_97_850_T5 » 12 Sep 2013, 20:45

rspi,

I've perused the ScanGauge II User Manual which is downloadable from their site.

It appears to me that the ScanGauge II is using OBDII mode 01 commands to retrieve the typical OBDII emission diagnostic data (like any OBDII scanner does). So they are almost certainly using mode 03 and 07 to retrieve the OBDII emission diagnostic DTCs and pending DTCs, respectively, and mode 04 to clear the DTCs. So it should probably be able to do all the OBDII commands that I apply to at least some of the Volvo 850s: 0100, 0101, 03, 07, 04, 0103, 0104, 0105, 0106, 0107, 010C, 010D, 010E, 0110, 0111, 0112, 0113, 0114. And it might do a few more 01xx commands.

If some of those aren't handled automatically by the ScanGauge II, then you can set them up as X-Gauges using the same examples provided in their User Manual, but simply substituting the proper commands above near the end of a line where you see 0100 and 0105 in their User Manual's 686AF10100 and 686AF10105 examples.

I strongly suspect the answer to your "Does anyone know if the ScanGauge 2 is capable of doing the commands listed above?" question is: "No". I don't know of any way to access the Vehicle Mileage with functional addressing and OBDII PIDs like the ScanGauge II uses. And I'll be surprised if the ScanGauge II can do the ISO9141-2 (like) physical addressing connection to ECU 51 using Tester 13 then read the ECU 51 B90300 data.

However, to be sure, you might try the simple Custom Command example I listed in paragraph "1b" below or the X-Gauge example prototype listed in paragraph "1a" below.

Or better yet, you should ask the makers of ScanGauge II using their form at MORE GAUGES FOR FREE, or using their Contact Us link.

I would suggest asking the following very specific questions (or, more simply, just direct them to this specific post and ask them to answer the questions in this post):

1. It is known that an ELM327 can read the 1997 Volvo 850 T5 vehicle mileage from the Instrument Panel with the following command sequence:

>ATZ
>ATL1
>ATE1
>ATH1
>ATAL
>ATKW0
>ATTA 13
>ATIIA 51
>ATWM 82 51 13 A1
>ATSI
>ATSH 84 51 13
>B90300

1a. So is it possible for me to use the following ScanGauge II X-Gauge settings to retrieve that Vehicle Mileage?

GAUGE: Vehicle Mileage
TXD: 845113B90300 (I'm assuming checksums are not included in TXD)
RXF: 04F905030000
RXD & MTH can also be setup to effectively expect message in form:

851351F903xxyycs

where yy = high order, xx = low order,
then yyxx hex = nnnnnn decimal, and
nnnnnn * 10 = the Vehicle Mileage.

Example: with xxyy = 7530,
3075 hex = 12405 decimal, and
12405 * 10 = 124050 = Vehicle Mileage
(minus miles lost when ABS not sending speed signal).

1b. Or is it possible to at least retrieve the raw hex data representing that Vehicle Mileage by inserting the checksum and sending the Vehicle Mileage request to ECU 51 as the following Custom Command:

845113B90300A4

thereby enabling the ScanGauge II user to have the functionality of the ScanGauge II, yet be able to also use it to retrieve the raw data for Vehicle Mileage, which can then be manually calculated as shown in 1a?

2. Will the ScanGauge II automatically perform the ISO9141-2 style 5-baud Slow Init of ECU 51 and allow the non-standard keywords D3 and B0? For example, will it allow the following initialization sequence to appear when transitioning from 5-baud to 10400 baud:

51 55 D3 B0 4F AE (ELM327 default ATS1 style)
or
5155D3B04FAE (ScanGauge II style, and ELM327 ATS0 style)

either via something which is functionally like the ELM327's explicit ATSI command or the ELM327's implicit Slow Init based on the value in the ATIIA command (eg, ATIIA 51 in our example)?

3. Is there any way to get the ScanGauge II to automatically send one of the following two KeepAlive variants to ECU 51 every 3-4 seconds?

82 51 13 A1 (or, with the checksum, 82 51 13 A1 87)
84 51 13 A1 00 00 (or, with the checksum, 82 51 13 A1 00 00 87)

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Re: How to read 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage with an ELM327

Postby esl_97_850_T5 » 14 Sep 2013, 19:00

Someone submitted the following input 2-3 hours ago to kwpd3b0_interpreter.html, but it wasn't interpreted:

f9 03 7c 3a

Since that looked like a probable ECU 51 (COMBI) Vehicle Mileage response, I decided to try this again, both as submitted -- without the headers and checksum -- as well as with the headers and checksums, since the interpreter expects for keyword D3 B0 protocol communication to include the headers and checksums. I've also thrown in some explanatory comments (which are ignored by the interpreter). The results from the Volvo 850 keyword D3 B0 protocol interpreter results page are listed:



ELM327 said:
-- This was submitted earlier today.
-- Notice that it does not have the header (which contains the ECU #) or checksum.
-- Nothing was interpreted for that input in the Gleanings section below,
-- since the interpreter of responses to ECU 51 B903 requests (ie, an ECU 51 F903 response)
-- could not derive the ECU # from a non-existent header.
f9 03 7c 3a

-- The next submission is the same info but with the header and checksum included
-- [they are automatically created by issuing the ELM327 ATH1 command
-- sometime between the last ATZ command and the B90300 Vehicle Mileage request].
-- Notice that this response does get interpreted since the header and checksum are included.
85 13 51 f9 03 7c 3a 9b


Gleanings:
-- Notice that this response does get interpreted since the header and checksum are included.
85 13 51 f9 03 7c 3a 9b
------ Vehicle Mileage..........................149720 miles




To whomever submitted the "f9 03 7c 3a", I'm curious what tools you used to retrieve this info? ELM327? Terminal emulator? Program? What produces the lower case hex without the headers and checksum?

The reason that the interpreter presently expects the headers is to differentiate an ECU 51 (COMBI) F903 from an ECU 2E or 2F (Power Seats) F903. But since the ECU 2E/2F F903 are longer than the ECU 51 F903, I'll try to make the interpreter to be more intelligent and infer the ECU 51 from such a "f9 03 7c 3a", "F9 03 7C 3A", "f9037c3a", "F9037C3A" style response, where "7C 3A" (regardless of case, and with or without one single space between the 2-digit pairs) are whatever your vehicle mileage is. It should be available in a few hours.

In any case, your Vehicle Mileage is: 149720 (miles or km, as the case may be), minus anything lost, if any, while the ABS module did not supply the speed signal.

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Re: How to read 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage with an ELM327

Postby marshappynation » 15 Sep 2013, 02:50

Hi, We are the ones who entered the F9 03 7C 3A into the interpreter. It is only lowercase because I was typing it off a piece of paper! I converted the number to decimal and multiplied by ten before remembering your interpreter and thought I'd see what happened when I entered it in. Unfortunately this was the result of our first run where we did not remember to check the B90400 so we shut down the software and tried it again later in the afternoon for the results I reference below. The reason this is unfortunate because I can't say why it didn't show the headers, etc. I thought I had entered the commands the same way both times.

Here are the details of what we did:

We received the ELM327 from VTooLand which we ordered off Amazon and after some difficulty have the proper drivers installed (CP210x and the version of PL2303 which came with our unit, somehow different from the version on totaldiagnostics.com, which did not work) and have it communicating with our 1996 Volvo 850 wagon using Realterm. OBD anything is entirely new to our experience, but with this helpful thread we appear to have successfully determined our mileage. The result of 149720 is basically what we expected so we assume we did this correctly.

We entered the commands as described previously int his thread then entered the "b" lines in the following order:
B90300
B90400
B90100
B90a00
B90500
with the following gleanings:
85 13 51 F9 03 7C 3A 9B
------ Vehicle Mileage..........................149720 miles
85 13 51 F9 04 D5 39 F4
------ Mileage at Service Light Reset...........148050 miles
84 13 51 F9 01 24 06
------ Country Code (possibly)..................36 = Unknown. You know the country?
85 13 51 F9 0A 00 00 EC
------ Months Speed Signal Missing (possibly)... 0 (months, possibly)
84 13 51 F9 05 10 F6
------ Service Reminder Miles (or Km)........... 16000 [might mean 10000 miles, which ~= 16000 km]

The correct mileage total does appear to be only the B903 number and not the sum of the B903 and B904.

Thanks for this excellent thread, we would have been quite lost without it.
Ginny & Steve
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Re: How to read 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage with an ELM327

Postby esl_97_850_T5 » 20 Sep 2013, 19:32

Ginny & Steve,

Super. Glad to see you've waded thru getting your ELM327 drivers setup, got Realterm installed, retrieved your mileage, and explored some other COMBI items.

As you've discovered, It doesn't matter what order you issue the ECU 51 B9xx00 requests, as long as you've got all those ELM327 AT commands setup beforehand, including the ATSH 84 51 13.

My guess on your original attempt to read the mileage is that you, in the process of getting everything setup, probably re-issued an ATZ after you had the ATH1 setup. Normally, an ELM327 will have its Programmable Parameters setup to default to the equivalent of ATH0, so an ATZ will effectively reset to a headers off state (since that's what most people use to access the OBDII emission diagnostics). Or maybe you unplugged the ELM327, or somehow issued one of the commands which reestablishes the defaults. At least now you can recognize the difference in the output and know how to toggle the headers / checksums output on and off (with ATH1 and ATH0).

How did you do the recent Service Light Reset? Vol-FCR? Draper Reset Tool? Visit to the dealer? Prior owner did it? Or what?

Has your ABS ever stopped delivering the speed signal to the Instrument Panel? If yes, was it longer than one month?

The response to someone from Netherland's B901 is A2 hex = 162 decimal.
The response to my B901 is A4 hex = 164 decimal.
The response to your B901 was 24 hex = 36 decimal.

I'm beginning to think that B901 is not the Country Code, since we're both from the USA and we don't have the same value for B901. But there's not enough examples yet to infer anything useful.

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Re: How to read 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage with an ELM327

Postby marshappynation » 04 Oct 2013, 14:08

Esl, We haven't done a service light reset yet. We only recently bought the car and the light was not on, it just had a broken odometer. Can service light reset be done with the equipment we have if and when we need to turn it off?

Also, as far as we know our ABS has not stopped delivering the speed signal. Like I say, we haven't had the car long, but we picked the old owner's brain and he was pretty detailed about the car's history.

Ginny & Steve
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Re: How to read 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage with an ELM327

Postby esl_97_850_T5 » 12 Oct 2013, 13:06

Subject: How to read 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage with an ELM327

marshappynation wrote:...Can service light reset be done with the equipment we have if and when we need to turn it off?

Also, as far as we know our ABS has not stopped delivering the speed signal...

Ginny & Steve


Ginny & Steve,

Thanks for the feedback. Sorry for the delayed response. I purposefully delayed responding in order to:

a) finish adding updates related to volvo850diag v0.5, and
b) explore getting the Service Light Reset procedure going for us ELM327 users.

volvo850diag v0.5 was released 2013-09-24.

Since you already have Realterm on your system, I strongly suggest you download the latest volvo850diag from volvo850.zip and use it as your mechanism of running Realterm. You'll never again have to use the cumbersome, slow "copy" from the Realterm Terminal pane when needing to cut information for pasting in kwpd3b0_interpreter.html or elsewhere. Instead you copy from the automatically generated, volvo850diag-driven, Realterm logs (created in the RT_ELM327_LOGS_DIR directory) and paste content from those logs into kwpd3b0_interpreter.

To answer your question, I'm 99% confident that your ELM327 could be used to perform the Service Light Reset procedure. However, I don't yet know how to do it, since I don't know what the message exchange is. And, apparently, nobody is willing to make this public, but instead insists upon charging for the feature and/or holding the info on the communication exchange close to their chest.

But I have been able to change the B905, B907, and B909 values -- the ones that I think are the Service Reminder Interval limits (that the counters are compared against). This was done using B805xx, B807xxyy, and B809xxyy requests, respectively. [See B90500, B90700, and B90900 for some details on these limits.]

After first reprogramming one of them to its existing value and getting a positive ack, I then reprogrammed all of them to be double their existing values using the following sequence:

  1. Display volvo850diag.html (v0.5 or higher) with Internet Explorer.
  2. Press Enter or click Start Realterm.
  3. Click ATZ Setup for ECUs 51/58/01/6E/2E/2F.
  4. Press Enter or click ECU 51 Setup button.
  5. Press Enter or click ECU 51 Read DTCs button.
  6. Press ECU 51 Full Scan in order to record the COMBI's present B9xx data.
  7. Click in the Realterm Terminal pane.
  8. In order to reprogram the limits to the highest ones that appear in Brick-Diag v0.0.6.6 Free Beta's
    Instrument Cluster / Service tab's 3 drop-down lists on the right-hand side of that tab.

    • miles? or kilometers? = ~20000 mi or 32000 km
    • time (months) = 24
    • engine operation (hours) = 1000
    Type the following, being very careful to type the B8 requests accurately,
    and including the B9 requests only if you want to immediately check your results.

    >ATSH 84 51 13
    >B80520
    >B90500
    (optional)
    >ATSH 85 51 13
    >B807400B
    >B9070000
    (optional)
    >B809E803
    >B9090000
    (optional)

    If all those commands / requests are issued, the results should look like:

    >ATSH 84 51 13
    OK

    >B80520
    83 13 51 F8 05 E4

    >B90500
    84 13 51 F9 05 20 06

    >ATSH 85 51 13
    OK

    >B807400B
    83 13 51 F8 07 E6

    >B9070000
    85 13 51 F9 07 40 0B 34

    >B809E803
    83 13 51 F8 09 E8

    >B9090000
    85 13 51 F9 09 E8 03 D6

  9. Press ECU 51 Full Scan in order to record the COMBI's reprogrammed B9xx data.
I then reprogrammed all of them to be slightly higher than my existing Service Reminder Interval counters, then reprogrammed them to have very high limits which involved a hex 'F' in the high nibble of the high byte. I was hoping that raising the limits high enough would cause the Service light to go out, but, unfortunately, when the car was restarted my Service light was still lit. Apparently, there is an electronic latch for the Service Light, such that once the light is lit the first time after exhausting one of the Service Reminder Interval limits, it will not go out until the the Service Light Reset procedure is performed properly.

I think I know functionally what has to be done for the Service Light Reset:

  • B906 has to be zeroed.
  • B908 has to be zeroed.
  • Maybe B90A is zeroed, then incorporated into an update to B903 to account for an estimate of "lost" miles when the speed signal was missing.
  • B904 has to be set to the present B903 value.
  • The Service Light has to be extinguished.
Use of B808xx and B808xxyy commands to change the Engine Hours counter (B908) generated "7F B8 12" errors, no matter what values were used. My guess is the counters can not be zeroed with B8xx requests, and/or a PIN or special code is necessary (possibly contained in the request or possibly provided in another type of request), and/or other keyword D3 B0 protocol requests are necessary (eg, maybe B0xx, B1xx, or B2xx). I prefer not to experiment with any of these approaches since I'm totally clueless what to try and have fear of exhausting some sort of retry limit and end up disabling my Instrument Panel.

It would be nice if someone would make public the Service Light Reset message exchange info. It's probably discernable by monitoring, with an OBDII-to-OBDII Y-splitter, one of the tools that perform Service Light Resets. But the legality of the monitoring / publishing should be considered.

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Re: How to read 1996-1997 Volvo 850 mileage with an ELM327

Postby esl_97_850_T5 » 12 Oct 2013, 21:26

Congratulations to the user that got their Total Mileage (B903) and Miles at Service Light Reset (B904) interpreted on 2013-10-10 ~23:30 EST.

I see you also tried to read and clear your ABS DTCs, but there were problems.

I think a lot of users will make the same mistake (that you apparently did). I certainly made that mistake often when first experimenting doing Volvo diagnostics via the ELM327. So I'm going to fuse your two attempts to read/clear ABS DTCs into a teaching example here so both you and other users know what to do when they are issuing the ELM327 commands / keyword D3 B0 requests interactively and need to read a response by using an ELM327 ATBD command.

Example: ECU 01 (ABS) Read DTCs / Clear DTCs / Read DTCs where ATBD specified too late to show either the DTCs read or the completion status of the Clear DTCs request.

The following commands were issued accurately, as listed prior in this thread underneath the To read/clear ABS DTCs heading in my 2013-09-08 post:

ATZ
ATL1
ATE1
ATH1
ATAL
ATKW0
ATTA 13
ATIIA 01
ATWM 82 01 13 A1
ATSH 83 01 13
AE01
ATBD
AF01
ATBD
AE01
ATBD
ATSH 82 01 13
A0
ATPC


Your terminal emulator logged:

>ATZ
?

>ATL1
OK

>ATE1
OK

>ATH1
OK

>ATAL
OK

>ATKW0
OK

>ATTA 13
OK

>ATIIA 01
OK

>ATWM 82 01 13 A1
OK

>ATSH 83 01 13
OK

>AE01
NO DATA

>ATBD
05 82 01 13 A1 37 F4 BF 13 A1 85 F4 01

>AF01
NO DATA

>ATBD
05 82 01 13 A1 37 F4 BF 13 A1 85 F4 01

>AE01
NO DATA

>ATBD
05 82 01 13 A1 37 F4 BF 13 A1 85 F4 01

>ATSH 82 01 13
OK

>A0
NO DATA

>ATPC
OK

>

Most ELM327 devices will probably be garbled before the ATZ / ATL1 sequence is completed. On my ELM327, the ATZ response includes "ELM327 v1.5" instead of the "?" like in your case. Other users should be aware of those differences in the ATZ response.

It looks to me like you did a good job issuing the commands / requests, other than the ATBD commands were issued too late.

You did not use an ATSI command between the ATWM and the initial ATSH command, like you did when retrieving the mileages. But since your response was NO DATA instead of UNABLE TO CONNECT, I'm guessing the communication link was successfully established when the AE01 implicitly caused the ELM327 to initiate communication.

The NO DATA response is what you always expect from ECU 01, ECU 6E, and in fact all the KWPD3B0 ECUs when there are less than 6 hex digits that are sent to the ELM327. The ELM327 always adds a total of 4 bytes to whatever you send it when using the ISO9141-2 protocol -- it prepends a 3-byte header and it appends 1-byte checksum. If you specify 6 hex digits, they are translated to 3 bytes, then the ELM327 sends 7 bytes -- 3 header bytes, 3 data bytes (specified with the 6 hex digits), 1 checksum byte. Requests totaling 7 bytes are of the standard ISO9141-2 length, and the ELM327 will display their responses. If you send 8 or more hex digits, it will be translated to 4 or more bytes. Those requests will total >= 8 bytes. The prior issuance of the ATAL command is required to properly handle the responses generated when issuing > 7-byte requests. However, related to this reasoning, when you send a 4-digit hex or 2-digit hex request to the ELM327, it is translated into a request with a total length of 6 bytes or 5 bytes, respectively. The responses to those < 7-byte requests will not be displayed, even though those responses are received by the ELM327. When you issue < 6 hex digits (eg, for AE01 or AF01), the ELM327 ATBD command is subsequently required to see up to 12 bytes of the response that have been saved in the ELM327's 12 byte buffer (that contains the latest request or response). But to see the response to the 4-hex digit Read DTCs (AE01) or Clear DTCs (AF01) requests, the ATBD must be issued before the next KeepAlive (A0) is issued by the ELM327.

In your case, it appears very likely that you waited longer than 3 seconds before issuing the ATBD command, and/or your ELM327 device has been programmed with its ATPP parameters to use a shorter KeepAlive timer than the standard 3 second default. I did this -- waiting too long -- often in the beginning, and still do occasionally when entering things interactively.

The way that you can tell that you were too late is to examine the ATBD buffer. The first byte is the length of meaningful data in the buffer. In your case, it says the 5 following bytes are the message: 82 01 13 A1 37 (and all the remaining bytes in the ATBD buffer are garbage). Knowing that the first 3 bytes of the KWPD3B0 messages are the header and the last byte of a KWPD3B0 message is the checksum, we interpret that 5-byte message as follows:

  1. 82 implies there are 2 bytes in the message after the 3-byte header.
    [You always subtract hex 80 from the first byte of the header to see how many bytes follow the header.
    For example, if the first byte of the header was 8F, then 0x8F - 0x80 = 0x0F = 15 bytes would follow the 3-byte header.]
  2. 01 implies ECU 01 (ie, ABS) [at least it does for my 1997 Volvo 850 T5].
    The 2nd byte of the KWPD3B0 header (and any ISO9141-2 style header) is the destination, ie, intended receiver.
  3. 13 implies the tester id 13 (specified by the ATTA 13 command for ELM327 v1.4 or greater).
    The 3rd byte of the header is the source, ie, sender.
  4. A1 is the keyword D3 B0 protocol's KeepAlive request.
  5. 37 is the checksum.
So we see this "82 01 13 A1 37" message is actually the latest KeepAlive which was sent by the ELM327 before the ATBD command was issued.

You simply need to issue the ATBD command as quickly as you can after getting the ">" prompt from the ELM327, so that the ATBD buffer will display the ECU 01 (ABS) response to the AE01 request, before it is overwritten by the next KeepAlive.

The same thing applied when you issued the AF01 and the subsequent AE01 recheck of the DTCs. You issued the ATBD too late in both those cases -- as judged by the fact that the ATBD buffer contains a KeepAlive request sent from the ELM327 to the ABS.

The bottom line is: You really haven't checked anything! However, I'd bet that you did likely clear the DTCs, at least temporarily. So some of the original DTCs might now be cleared.

The ATSH 82 01 13 / A0 sequence commands ECU 01 to terminate the comm link.
The ATPC commands the ELM327 to terminate the comm link. The ATPC will cause the ELM327 to stop sending the KeepAlive.

Note: The first AE01 and its response may occasionally include the BUS INIT: ...OK phrase as follows:

>AE01
BUS INIT: ...OK
NO DATA

Usually, that does not occur. At least, it rarely does for me. Normally, I only see the BUS INIT: ...OK phrase only after issuing an ATSI.

Lessons to be learned:

  1. When talking with ECU 01 (ABS) and ECU 6E (AW 50-42), issue ATBD after AE01 and AF01 as soon as you can after the > prompt reappears. The ATBD must be issued before the KeepAlive timer expires (default is 3 second) which causes the ELM327 to send another KeepAlive (A1).
  2. Lengthen the KeepAlive timer. For example, the timeout period can be lengthened from 3 seconds to slightly over 4 seconds using the ELM327 command ATSW CC. There's also a way to lengthen it permanently by using the ATPP commands.
  3. Use volvo850diag to issue the commands for you so all the timing is automatically correct.
volvo850diag, a more automated solution

It should be mentioned here that the above problems of not issuing the ATBD fast enough after the AE01 request to ECU 01 or ECU 6E can be eliminated by using a program to issue the commands. Since you're using Windows, I'd suggest downloading/installing the free Realterm terminal emulator, then downloading/extracting the latest, free volvo850diag.zip distribution, then running the "local" version of volvo850diag.html (extracted from volvo850diag.zip v0.5 or higher).

Follow the instructions in the Requirements and First Time Use sections of volvo850diag.html. You should only have to do this step the very first time. Its important that you either define the RT_ELM327_LOGS_DIR environment variable or else be content with using a temporary directory for the automatically generated log files.

To read/clear the ABS DTCs with volvo850diag / Realterm / ELM327, you would basically do:

  1. Use Internet Explorer to display volvo850diag.html.
  2. Allow ActiveX and answer Yes to a couple more questions relating to ActiveX.
  3. Press the Enter key or click Start Realterm.
  4. Move the Realterm and volvo850diag windows so you can see them simultaneously.
  5. Move the Realterm Terminal pane vertical scroll bar to the bottom (so you see the latest communication exchange).
  6. Click ATZ Setup for ECUs 51/58/01/6E/2E/2F.
  7. Click ECU 01 Setup.
  8. Press Enter or click either Read DTCs or ATSI (since ATSI commands have already been seen to work with your ELM327). The Read DTCs is the default, it is quicker, and it obviously accomplishes the first thing that you wanted to do, so that's probably the better choice.
  9. Click Read DTCs (if you had clicked ATSI in the previous step).
  10. Read the messages that appear in the volvo850diag window underneath the row of ECU 01 buttons and respond accordingly.
  11. If the ATBD response (in Realterm's Terminal pane) is "06 83 13 01 EE 01 86...", then there are no ABS DTCs, so you're done checking ABS DTCs.
  12. Otherwise, if the ATBD response is "xx yy 13 01 EE 01...", then # of DTCs = xx (remember its in hex) - 6, yy = 0x83 + # of DTCs, and the DTCs immediately follow the EE 01. Remember, these are raw 2-digit hex DTC codes, not the 3-digit decimal DTC codes that we are all used to in the Volvo literature.
  13. If # of DTCs > 0, then click the ECU 01 Clear DTCs button.
  14. Then click the ECU 01 Read DTCs button (or the ECU 01 Quick Scan or Full Scan buttons).
  15. Check again for "06 83 13 01 EE 01 86..." or "xx yy 13 01 EE 01..." after the ATBD command which follows the AE01 request, as mentioned in steps 10-12, and respond accordingly.
  16. Repeat as deemed necessary depending on the state of your ABS.
  17. In volvo850diag, click Cleanup.
  18. Click Close Realterm.
  19. Optionally, submit the log's contents to kwpd3b0_interpreter.html. It should tell you the # of DTCs, the raw DTC codes, and it may be able to interpret some of the raw DTCs codes into the well known 3-digit Volvo DTC codes.
  20. Follow the remaining Cleanup instructions.

There's some more discussion of ABS DTCs in the Volvo 850 OBDII FAQ under the question Q. How do I use the ELM327 to read DTCs for an ABS module (ECU 01) which has the common problem of flaky solder connections?

Hope this finds its intended recipient that had tried to read/clear their ABS DTCs.

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