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01 V70 ABS Failure: Module NOT the problem! help?

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01 V70 ABS Failure: Module NOT the problem! help?

Postby Jtnb » 21 Dec 2010, 03:14

Hello all,

I have an 01 v70 with the usual lights combo that suggests the ABS module has gone bad. (ABS service required, plus the ABS lights, STC light, etc.)

I removed the module, resoldered all contacts and resealed. Replaced in the car to no avail. Doubting my repair, I sent the module to Matty Moo who regularly makes this repair. He resoldered what I had already resoldered, tested the unit in a 99 V70 and had no lights, no issues. When I received the module back from him, I installed it, triple checked all connections and I'm back where I started. ABS Service Required, ABS light, STC light. Odo not working, nor cruise. Trip odo is all dashes.

This suggests that the ABS module is not the issue. I have the following relevant error codes:

ECM-A02B Communication, control module for ABS-faulty signal
CEM-1A5F Communication with ABS control module Signal missing
ABS-0070 Pump motor faulty signal
ABS-0080 Control Module faulty signal

Any thoughts on where to go next?

My local Volvo experts confirm that the module is the usual suspect in this case. Is it possible that neither Matt nor I were able to repair the soldering issue? Or that something else within the module failed? Should I look elsewhere in the ABS system or should I pay four hundred dollars for a new module?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Jonathan in Branford, CT
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Re: 01 V70 ABS Failure: Module NOT the problem! help?

Postby JRL » 21 Dec 2010, 12:43

The first thing to do is try another (known good) module
Process of elimination
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Re: 01 V70 ABS Failure: Module NOT the problem! help?

Postby Jtnb » 31 Dec 2010, 19:00

OK, folks. I've been working with Matty Moo on this, and as has been said elsewhere he's a real stand-up guy. He's sent me two computers to try to sort this problem. I have now installed three different computers, including:

#1. The original, which both Matt and I have resoldered.
#2. An AWD version that's ABS/TRACS. Didn't solve the ABS prob and added the BRAKE FAILURE: STOP SAFELY ASAP.
#3. Another ABS/STC computer, but without matching model numbers, possibly from an earlier model year.

See photo below for images and details on the three computers.

Matthew (the MVS guy) has had a similar problem with his dad's S80 and that issue was sorted with a new CEM.
A local volvo shop here had a similar car recently where the same symptoms presented and they changed the computer three times before finally discovering that the car's battery had two bad cells. That fixed the ABS problem!

So...

1. Perhaps I have not adequately diagnosed the ABS problem, since neither of the two replacement computers had matching numbers.
2. Perhaps the computer is bad, but not in a way that resoldering can help.
3. Perhaps I have a CEM or battery problem as described above.

Would folks here agree that the next step is to try an ABS computer with the same part number? Does anyone have experience with these mismatch issues? A lot of the conversation from Ozark Lee and Matty Moo focuses on earlier model cars than my 01 V70.

Again, grateful for any thoughts.

Jonathan in Branford, CT

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Re: 01 V70 ABS Failure: Module NOT the problem! help?

Postby Matty Moo » 01 Jan 2011, 00:23

I'll add to it.

The 8619538 module works on other pre-CEM cars with no problem. But, the other STC modules don't want to work on CEM cars with the 8619538 module. No idea why either.

I've had no problems like this on the non-CEM cars. You can put an AWD module on a pre CEM car with STC and it will work, along with the regular STC module.

Another thing to note, the 8619538 module is soldered differently than all of the other Teves MK20 modules. You can open one up and see zero cracking on any of the pins, even using a magnifying glass. The only cars I've seen this module on is the CEM cars.
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Re: 01 V70 ABS Failure: Module NOT the problem! help?

Postby gchardy » 05 Jan 2011, 16:54

Jonathan,
Before plunging in on the ABS system with a light / warning, I have seen on two occasions personally where the ABS light illuminates when brake wear has been the issue. A change of the brake pads, squeeze out the calipers and the ABS light extinguishes. Pull the wheels and inspect those brakes and hopefully all will be good. Good luck!
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Re: 01 V70 ABS Failure: Module NOT the problem! help?

Postby Jtnb » 07 Jan 2011, 01:42

OK, here's an update. Problem still exists.

Bought a remanufactured ABS unit from BBA Reman in Taunton, Mass. That's a known good unit. Same exact part number. I now owe them my unit as a core. Did the changeover (I can now do it in about 9 minutes.)

NO CHANGE!

Even with the re-built computer I still have the array of idiot lights: ABS, STC, ABS Service Required. Does anyone have any thoughts?

Graham, I will take a look at the brakes. I think the fronts are pretty far gone. Was planning to deal with pads and rotors when the weather warms up again... march or april. Might have to accelerate that process.

Any further thoughts on this would be most helpful.

Jonathan
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Re: 01 V70 ABS Failure: Module NOT the problem! help?

Postby Matty Moo » 07 Jan 2011, 08:42

Start with the cheapest fix first.

Have your battery load tested. Not just tested, but tested under load. Most places do it for free.

Get out the meter and see if you have any voltage drop across any cables. Check all your ground connections.

Problem is, you have a CEM code. When you first sent me that I was leery and foresaw a potential headache. Another problem is that you can't just throw a used CEM at it.
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Re: 01 V70 ABS Failure: Module NOT the problem! help?

Postby JamieP » 21 Jan 2011, 02:23

Hoping you have this fixed now, but for what it's worth...
After a recent dealer recall on our 2002 V70 XC the ABS light came on as we left the dealership...
About a week later the voltage regulator faults appeared and consequently a replacement alternator were required - not I add - at the extortionate price the dealer quoted. The ABS warning lights went away once the Alternator (c/w new voltage regulator) and battery were installed...
Not promising anything, but as mentioned before - there's cheaper places to look than ABS module replacement...
I wasn't around at the time - of the fault - but I would have tried just the $30 voltage regulator rather than the $200 + alternator to be honest...
Check out the forums for the correct tests to check these out and Good Luck...
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Re: 01 V70 ABS Failure: Module NOT the problem! help?

Postby jimmy57 » 21 Jan 2011, 06:54

I have begun to see two pump motor issues: 1. the wire insulation falls off the short two wire lead from pump. I have not had a car with a code but in handling the module I have gone to unplug the pump and the wires were already missing pieces of the insulation and copper was visible.
2. I dealt with a 2001 S60 that had a dead pump motor. Would set codes intermittently for the pump motor after repair to module and module repair was rechecked and the problem continued. The motor was test run and ran twice and then the third time it did not until the motor was tapped. Apparently worn out or stuck brushes.
#1 might cause the ABS module to go down at times and set codes like are seen in that car. The pump is variable speed controlled on MK20 and is powered through transistor circuit so it would not necessarily blow a fuse even if shorted but may drop voltage within circuitry of ABS module and take it offline until network "sleeps" several minutes after key off and last door or hatch closed. The wires may have been fine until handled for module changes.
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Re: 01 V70 ABS Failure: Module NOT the problem! help?

Postby Jtnb » 23 Jan 2011, 15:46

Thanks for the additional thoughts here, folks. I'm still in the thick of the problem. Here's my plan.

I have replaced the module with a rebuilt one from BBA reman. That made no difference. My next plan is to replace rear pads (and clean up ABS sensors) and pads and rotors on front. This is, by many accounts, not likely the problem, but it needs doing anyway and it will eliminate another (remote) possibility.

The other recommendation I have from a Volvo mechanic (independent) is to go ahead and replace the pump itself with one from a wrecker's yard. I do also have a little leak around the pump somewhere, so again, this will need doing at some point. When it's out I can get a better look at wiring.

By the way, I took the car to an Auto Zone and had the charging and battery system checked by three separate machines, in and out of the car. The results were a little inconsistent, but the voltage shows high enough and the battery passed the load test. Charging system appears to be working, so I'm not super suspicious of the battery or alternator.

I like the sound of the 2001 S60 problem described by Jimmy57 above. If that's my condition I'll be in good shape with a boneyard pump. It'll give me a chance to renew fluid and purge the lines at the same time.

My local trusted mechanic has been discouraging me from bringing the car to him, saying that the things I can do to sort the problem will be the same ones he would do and i can avoid the hourly labor. I have a great mechanic.

I'm interested in your input on the following topics.

1. Is there general agreement that going after the pump is the next step?
2. Has anyone done the job and do you have any advice to offer?
3. Any recommendations on wrecker's yards to use? I'd like one that can be very specific about the year, make, model, numbers, etc.

and... any idea how to subscribe to this thread so I get an email when there's a new posting rather than having to check this site frequently?

Thanks all,

Jonathan
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Re: 01 V70 ABS Failure: Module NOT the problem! help?

Postby Matty Moo » 24 Jan 2011, 06:52

Jonathan.

I wouldn't pull the pump. I'd test it first. Take an Ohmmeter to it and see if the windings are open or shorted to ground. You can put 12v to it to see if it works.

I've never changed one out, but it doesn't look like something that is easy or fun.

there's a subscribe button at the bottom of the page. You have to look for it, it doesn't really stick out.
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Going to replace the ABS pump (01 V70). How to do it?

Postby Jtnb » 13 Feb 2011, 17:47

Reached the end of all the tests I can think of.

Ordered up a used ABS pump assembly. Includes module and is guaranteed to work. $150 from Erie Volvo.

I'm going to tackle replacing the ABS pump and while I'm at it I'll do pads and rotors all around and flush and replace brake fluid.

The pads and rotor work isn't intimidating. Done it lots on multiple 240s. But I've never messed with an ABS pump. Can't seem to find any good info online (here or elsewhere) for replacing the ABS pump. Anyone out there have any resources? Is there a manual that has this procedure? I have no shop manual, but could look for the Haynes...

Thoughts?
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Re: 01 V70 ABS Failure: Module NOT the problem! help?

Postby jimmy57 » 13 Feb 2011, 18:15

two brake lines in from M Cyl., 4 lines out to wheels. Keep up with removed lines as they go back where they came from. The pump assy. is on a bracket and access is not great but not the worst either. Hose from air cleaner to turbo will need to be removed. The battery will have to be disconnected and the electrical box under hood on driver side has two bolts. One is under rear of air cleaner on inner fender and the other is hidden under the cables that meet in rear of that box on the stud that is part of box. Remove the two cables and the bolt is down in hole next to stud. Box slides towards engine and comes out. Use WD-40 liberally on connector and then it should come off (i guess you already passed that point...)
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Re: 01 V70 ABS Failure: Module NOT the problem! help?

Postby Jtnb » 17 Feb 2011, 04:15

UPDATE and another ISSUE.

Spent the day in the shop. Thanks to a friend I had access to a lift and a warm shop!

Replaced pads and rotors all around. Front brake hoses were cracked and dodgy, so I replaced them as well.

Replaced ABS pump and module with identical unit from Erie Volvo. Bled the entire brake system, purging until bubbles were gone and clean fluid issued forth. (two asides: 1. I wish I'd bought the blue brake fluid, not because it's cool, but because it would have been a lot easier to see when I was into new fluid. Next time I could switch back and it would be equally clear. 2. BIG plug for the Motive Brake Pressure Bleeder. With that and the lift, one-man purging was a snap!)

Packed everything back together, dropped the car and got it outside for a test. Started up and !!!!!!!!! ABS and STC lights cleared! They're gone! I may be the one in a hundred, but it appears that my fault code was CORRECT. My ABS pump was bad.

BUT

I now have BRAKE FAILURE: SERVICE URGENT. Also pedal sinks a little. By the time this had presented itself I'd been in the shop all day and couldnt' deal. Drove the half mile home with one hand on the e-brake. All's well, but I'd sure appreciate any advice people have about where to start again in the morning. Can't give the car back to wifey like this. ABS failure was better.

SO.

1. I remember having BRAKE FAILURE: STOP SAFELY ASAP before. Now it's SERVICE URGENT. Does that mean anything? Does one of them outrank the other in degree of badness or component that's likely to be failed?

2. Any thoughts on where to start looking?

Thanks for all the support here on this forum.

Jonathan
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