Fuel Pump / Insert Questions [1997 Volvo 850 GLT]

Help, Advice and DIY Tutorials on Volvo's extremely popular car line -- Volvo's 1990s "bread and butter" cars -- powered by the ubiquitous and durable Volvo inline 5-cylinder engine.
1992 - 1997 850, 850 R, 850 T5-R, 850 T5, 850 GLT
1997 - 2000 S70, S70 AWD
1997 - 2000 V70, V70 AWD
1997 - 2000 V70-XC
1997 - 2004 C70
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1997volvo850
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Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 4:39 pm
Year and Model: 1997 Volvo 850
Location: New York

Fuel Pump / Insert Questions [1997 Volvo 850 GLT]

Postby 1997volvo850 » Sun Aug 05, 2012 5:37 pm

I'm trying to decide whether to replace the fuel pump assembly or just the insert. I think I've narrowed
down the problem to the fuel pump. The car turns over but doesn't start.

I've been assuming the fuel pump turns on in key position II before the starter is engaged. I can't hear
the pump in my working 850 so maybe this information is incorrect.

I installed the fuel pump relay from my working 850 into the dead 850 and get the same behavior -
turns over but doesn't start.

When I remove the blue cap from the end of the fuel line and press the valve there is no gas at all.

This seem a good indication that my fuel pump is bad.

Questions:

How long does it normally take to perform this repair with a 1) replacement unit 2) pump insert. Is dealing
with the insert significantly more work? The Haynes manual only describes replacing the entire unit, not replacing
the insert. Estimated time of completion would be a great addition to the Hayes manual and online tutorials.

Replacement parts: At FCP Groton the replacement "unit" assembly is $389. They list several inserts: a Hella
insert marked (OEM) for $74.99, a Bosch insert for $80.99. There is also an Bosch pump for $126 with the same
picture as the insert (one must be wrong) so I'm trying to determine the difference between the $80 and $129 Bosch
parts. Finally, at Advanced Auto Parts, they have an Airtex pump insert (E8643) for $129.99 that is supposed to
be an exact fit. I suppose the local dealer is an option for the insert and pump but I'm hoping to avoid going there.

What are the potential complication to this task? Is there significant downside to attempting this repair?
Like damage to the fuel lines resulting in hundreds of dollars of addition repairs. The pressure fittings on top look
tricky to me.

Right now my vehicle is in a parking lot about five miles away. I could have it towed but I need to decide
whether to tow it home (I fix it) or somewhere else. Right now I'm thinking I should be able to perform this task
in the parking lot with either the entire unit or the insert. Since I'm taking my tools with me a list of tools and
detailed instructions might be useful. Search returns a lot of related threads on fuel pumps and fuel pump relays
but I haven't found the cook book recipe I'm looking for. If replacing the insert is complicated I could remove it
and bring it home to work on.

This is really the first time one of our 850s has died completely. Our original 850 is still running strong though
I may start to look for a spare fuel pump in the junk yard for future use. Others recommend a spare fuel relay so
I will likely pick one up.

Any help is appreciated.

Thanks


OE Numbers
9480152, 69693, H75011571, 0580453420, 0580314067

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1997volvo850
Posts: 315
Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 4:39 pm
Year and Model: 1997 Volvo 850
Location: New York

Re: Fuel Pump / Insert Questions [1997 Volvo 850 GLT]

Postby 1997volvo850 » Mon Aug 06, 2012 6:28 am

I went to check out our car this evening. My wife managed to get it started once since
the fuel pump apparently died so she asked to try to start it (she said she might get lucky)
and It started right up.

I tried starting the car several times over two hours the day before and did not get gas at the schroeder
valve (blue cap).

Since I also have an intermittent problem with the ignition (head lights and instrument lights don't come
on unless I bring the key back a hair) I'm wondering if these problems are related.

I'm still thinking fuel pump but thought I'd mention the issue with the ignition. So far no responses to my
original post looking for advice on fuel pump assemblies versus inserts.

Thanks in Advance

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JimBee
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Re: Fuel Pump / Insert Questions [1997 Volvo 850 GLT]

Postby JimBee » Mon Aug 06, 2012 8:59 am

I haven't done the insert so I don't know how tricky it is. I guess it depends on your skill level. Call sales/techs at IPDusa.com, also a trusted sponsor of this site for a better sense of what you're getting into and how to decide on the brand. They've helped me quite a bit. Then you need a way to get the toothed retention ring off the top of the pump. One poster here found that a pliers sold for changing an oil filter works on that. Otherwise, you'll need to drive it loose with a hammer and screw driver, which jars it pretty hard and is probably not a good idea.

First, though, relays are known to fail on these cars. You can remove the 103 relay and use a paper clip to jump across pins 87 and 15 — I think. Confirm that by searching on this site before you do it. It could be a failed relay. If the car starts and runs continuously with the jumper in place, it's the relay. That's a two minute repair once you get the relay.

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rmmagow
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Year and Model: V70 1998
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Re: Fuel Pump / Insert Questions [1997 Volvo 850 GLT]

Postby rmmagow » Mon Aug 06, 2012 3:07 pm

Electrical portion of the ignition switch? And the relay. If it started once after this failure, I'd be more inclined to think the ign. switch is a problem since you mentioned turning it a hair etc. The electrical part of the switch replacement is pretty straight forward I think.
1998 V70 AWD 228K - Daily Driver
1985 Mercedes Benz 300D - 197K Off Road For Now Brakes Failed
1998 S70 135K - FOR SALE
2003 GMC Sonoma - 114K - POS
1958 Mercedes Benz 220S 66K Original and never to be restored.
2006 Saturn ION 5-Speed - 150K Son's weird little easy to fix car

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erikv11
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Re: Fuel Pump / Insert Questions [1997 Volvo 850 GLT]

Postby erikv11 » Mon Aug 06, 2012 4:06 pm

Because the first post said you swapped in a working pump and it still wouldn't start (did I read that right?), I would say a bad relay is more likely than bad fuel pump. There is a fuel system relay and there is a fuel injection relay. The former fails more often.

The car definitely has a faulty electrical portion of the ignition switch. I'd fix that right away and first, no matter what. It is very uncomfortable to be driving down a dark stretch of highway and have all headlights and dash lights go out. As it gets worse, the car will start doing other weird things. Very unsafe IMHO and in my experience. And maybe replacing it will fix the fuel problem!
'95 T5-R 854 | m4.4 | 180 k
'96 NA 855 | 131 k
'98 V70 GLT | 15g turbo, T5 tune & injectors | 258 k
gone: '96 NA 850 210k, '98 NA V70 182k, '98 NA S70 174 k

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1997volvo850
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Joined: Thu Feb 18, 2010 4:39 pm
Year and Model: 1997 Volvo 850
Location: New York

Re: Fuel Pump / Insert Questions [1997 Volvo 850 GLT]

Postby 1997volvo850 » Wed Aug 08, 2012 1:33 pm

I installed the fuel pump relay from my working 850 into the dead 850 and there was no change
in behavior. This leads me to suspect the fuel pump (or possibly ignition switch).

Given the need to sometimes "wiggle" the key in order to get the headlights to come on I'm thinking to
replace the "electronics" portion of the ignition first. Seems the ignition switch does impact the fuel
pump activation.

I've spent quite a bit of time looking for more details. Is there is nice diagram of the ignition available?
Does anyone know the part number for the electronic portion of the ignition switch?

Another thread mentions a few hours to replace the tumbler and yet another only 15 minutes to replace
the electronics portion of the ignition.

Replacing the tumbler looks like a nightmare (and expensive). Are there any write ups on replacing the
electronics? I'm wondering if the tumbler is next...

Thanks in advance

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erikv11
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Re: Fuel Pump / Insert Questions [1997 Volvo 850 GLT]

Postby erikv11 » Wed Aug 08, 2012 3:38 pm

It's the 15 minute job, really easy once you get the plastics off.

viewtopic.php?f=1&t=37398

http://www.fcpeuro.com/products/volvo-i ... 60-9447803
'95 T5-R 854 | m4.4 | 180 k
'96 NA 855 | 131 k
'98 V70 GLT | 15g turbo, T5 tune & injectors | 258 k
gone: '96 NA 850 210k, '98 NA V70 182k, '98 NA S70 174 k

ridemaine
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Joined: Mon Aug 13, 2012 2:30 am
Year and Model: 1996 850 Wagon
Location: Maine

Re: Fuel Pump / Insert Questions [1997 Volvo 850 GLT]

Postby ridemaine » Mon Aug 13, 2012 2:38 am

1997Volvo850 - Have you had any luck solving your problem. My 1996 850 died today in town and reluctently restarted a few times but died right out. I have nearly no flow at the shradder valve but what makes me wonder is your talk about the ignition switch. Mine has doen just what you talk about with turning back the key to get lights, speedo, and blickers for the 2.5 years and 30k I've owned it. Yesturday on a small road trip the speedo totally stopped work at one point so know this fuel issue is making me wonder. Any information on your findings and results would be greatly appreaciated. Love the car but cash is short right now with the college bill waiting to be paid.

c_leforce
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Joined: Wed Jul 29, 2009 3:37 pm
Year and Model: 1997 850glt
Location: Kentucky

Re: Fuel Pump / Insert Questions [1997 Volvo 850 GLT]

Postby c_leforce » Mon Aug 13, 2012 6:18 pm

I have a 97 850 glt with what i think is a lot of the same issues, The fuel pump is good and the relay is new. But my car will still not start sometimes and worse die while I'm driving it. The only way i can get it started is by doing a hard reset by disconnecting the battery, then it will start right up. I don't seem to have the issue with playing with the key to get things working but i do think it might be a failing ecu.... any ideas with how mine is acting compared to others symptoms?

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cn90
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Re: Fuel Pump / Insert Questions [1997 Volvo 850 GLT]

Postby cn90 » Mon Aug 13, 2012 6:57 pm

c_leforce wrote:I have a 97 850 glt with what i think is a lot of the same issues, The fuel pump is good and the relay is new. But my car will still not start sometimes and worse die while I'm driving it. The only way i can get it started is by doing a hard reset by disconnecting the battery, then it will start right up. I don't seem to have the issue with playing with the key to get things working but i do think it might be a failing ecu.... any ideas with how mine is acting compared to others symptoms?


Look into MAF issue.
If so, use only Bosch or Volvo brands.
1998 S70 GLT 160K+
2005 XC90 2.5T 85K+


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