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p0131

Help and Advice on Volvo's extremely popular car line, powered by Volvo's nearly indestructible, versatile inline 5-cylinder engine.
1992 - 1997 850, 850 R, 850 T5-R, 850 T5, 850 GLT
1997 - 2000 S70, S70 AWD
1997 - 2000 V70, V70 AWD
1997 - 2000 V70-XC
1997 - 2004 C70

p0131

Postby eddiecohoon » 04 Mar 2013, 23:31

I have an ongoing battle to figure out whats wrong with my 98 c70. Codes p0131 and p0172. what tests should i run or have ran for me to find out the real issue as to not replace and unnessecary part. I bought a sensor brought to a shop to have them install. told them the code and which sensor it was. Apparently both front sensors had different plugs. so when it would connect they must have just switched the other and called it a day. prefer to just make sure its done right this time. all help is greatly appreciated/
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Re: p0131

Postby rmmagow » 05 Mar 2013, 18:11

Sounds like the Front O2 sensor is no good, bad wiring? P0172 is running rich. Gotta fix that or you may fry the CAT.
1998 V70 AWD 215K - Daily Driver
1985 Mercedes Benz 300D - 194K Daily Driver - Back On The Road
1998 S70 133K - Wife's Car and Daily Driver
2003 GMC Sonoma - 113K
1958 Mercedes Benz 220S 66K Original and never to be restored.
2006 Saturn ION 5-Speed - 150K Son's weird little car
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Re: p0131

Postby mercuric » 05 Mar 2013, 21:17

P0172 EFI-231 Long-term fuel trim, part load Upper limit
-or-
P0172 EFI-232 Long-term fuel trim, idling Upper limit

P0131 EFI-212 Front heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) Signal too low. Intermittent fault
-or-
P0131 EFI-212 Front heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) Signal too low. Permanent fault

format is:
[OBD-II CODE] [DTC CODE] [Description]
OBD-II code = what you get on a generic OBD-II scan tool
DTC Code = the volvo proprietary code for the failure.

You'd have to get the blink code (or use a volvo scan tool) to get the DTC code, to determine idle vs part load.. or perm vs intermittent. Probably doesn't matter, though.

Also, upper limit means the upper limit of compensation rather than the upper limit of fuel mixture

quoting VIDA
EFI-232
The engine control module (ECM) receives information from the heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) about the fuel/air mixture in the idling and partial load ranges. If the fuel/air mixture deviates from λ=1 the short-term fuel trim will compensate for this by adjusting injection time so that λ=1 is achieved. When the short-term fuel trim makes an adjustment, the integrator median must be adjusted by the long-term trim. If adaptation needs to adjust to close to its maximum diagnostic trouble code (DTC) EFI-232 (idling range -0.48 ms - 0.40 ms) or diagnostic trouble code (DTC) EFI-231 (part load range factor 0.773 - 1.227) and the status message Upper limit (lean fuel/air mixture) or Lower limit (rich fuel/air mixture) will be stored.

Possible source
UPPER LIMIT
defective mass air flow (MAF) sensor
low fuel pressure
air leakage
faulty pulsation damper
faulty sensor signals.

EFI-212
Before fuel trim starts the front heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) must be ready - it should be at operational temperature and have the correct output voltage. Monitoring of the heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) function starts approximately 3 minutes after heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) heating starts. Diagnostic trouble code (DTC) EFI-212 is stored if there is a fault in the front or rear heated oxygen sensors (HO2S) or their cabling that affects the output voltage from the front heated oxygen sensor (HO2S).
Possible source
Signal too high:
short-circuit to supply voltage in front heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) signal cable (+)
short-circuit to supply voltage in front heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) signal cable (-)
short-circuit to supply voltage in rear heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) signal cable (+)
short-circuit to supply voltage in rear heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) signal cable (-)
defective front heated oxygen sensor (HO2S)
defective rear heated oxygen sensor (HO2S).
Signal too low:
short-circuit to ground in front heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) signal cable (+)
short-circuit to ground in front heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) signal cable (-)
short-circuit to ground in rear heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) signal cable (+)
short-circuit to ground in rear heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) signal cable (-)
defective front heated oxygen sensor (HO2S)
defective rear heated oxygen sensor (HO2S).
Signal missing:
open-circuit in signal cable (+)
open-circuit in signal cable (-)
defective front heated oxygen sensor (HO2S).
Faulty signal:
short-circuit between signal cable (+) and signal cable (-)
defective front heated oxygen sensor (HO2S).


Also, DTC EFI-212 causes fuel trim to be disabled, meaning you are going to get poor mileage and/or crappy performance.

I'd start by inspecting all the wiring. These cars have different wiring connectors on various years, which can be a source of annoyance and/or installation error. An adapter is available, IIRC FCP groton stocks them.

Depending on how old both the sensors are, I might just replace them. If they've got 100,000+ miles, they are due anyways. Get real bosch sensors with the proper harness and/or adapter, not cheap aftermarket stuff. FCP or iPD should be able to get you what you need.

Before you invest in parts, though, I'd double check all the O2 sensor wiring, verify you have good fuel pressure and do a careful check for vacuum leaks. The MAF sensor is a concern, but that usually results in more pervasive problems.

Given the signal code, I'd be most suspicious of wiring.

Do you have running issues (weak, poor MPG, etc), or just codes?
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Re: p0131

Postby eddiecohoon » 11 Mar 2013, 04:23

I have had poor mpg, slightly diminished performance. I have had the car for 50000 and almost nothing but the basic oil changes and tires and such has had to be done. Originally bought a sensor, brought it to a shop and since the plug was wrong instead of not doing it they put it on the other front sensor spot. But other than that and a couple vac leaks that I had. I have not changed anything and believe all is still original
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Re: p0131

Postby rmmagow » 11 Mar 2013, 12:42

HO2S, should that go ready very quickly once it is up to temp? My car, persistent P0171, P0455 and occasional P0243 won't set HO2S to READY unless the car has been running without CELs for a couple of days. My CEL does stay off, sometimes for a week and I've seen HO2S and the CAT actually go ready. EVAP however never goes ready and is probably a broken hose. The car always seems to run the same, 23, 23.5 mpg and a nice idle at the mark right before 1000 RPM.
1998 V70 AWD 215K - Daily Driver
1985 Mercedes Benz 300D - 194K Daily Driver - Back On The Road
1998 S70 133K - Wife's Car and Daily Driver
2003 GMC Sonoma - 113K
1958 Mercedes Benz 220S 66K Original and never to be restored.
2006 Saturn ION 5-Speed - 150K Son's weird little car
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Re: p0131

Postby mercuric » 11 Mar 2013, 15:23

eddiecohoon wrote:Originally bought a sensor, brought it to a shop and since the plug was wrong instead of not doing it they put it on the other front sensor spot. But other than that and a couple vac leaks that I had. I have not changed anything and believe all is still original


Other front sensor spot? Unless all the documentation I have related to the 98 C70 is false (including VIDA and a volvo-blue wiring diagram tp3937202), or you have a later-model C70, there is only a single front and single rear O2 sensor.

Maybe what actually happened is they installed the sensor in the spot behind the cat, which is actually the rear O2 sensor? This, of course, wouldn't help your front O2 sensor problem.

rmmagow wrote:HO2S, should that go ready very quickly once it is up to temp? My car, persistent P0171, P0455 and occasional P0243 won't set HO2S to READY unless the car has been running without CELs for a couple of days. My CEL does stay off, sometimes for a week and I've seen HO2S and the CAT actually go ready. EVAP however never goes ready and is probably a broken hose. The car always seems to run the same, 23, 23.5 mpg and a nice idle at the mark right before 1000 RPM.


It seems to me these cars don't like to make anything go "ready" in any quick period of time. I wouldn't worry too much about the ready status, honestly. Are you sure you didn't mean P0445, not P0455? I can't find anything on P0455, but P0445 is one of the EVAP codes, which translates to DTC EFI-541, which is specifically related to the EVAP system's canister purge valve... Note the list of "substituted values" -- O2 sensor control and test is disabled. So you probably want to figure out the EVAP system problem first.

P0243 can indicate either DTC 242 (Turbocharger (TC) control valve signal - Signal missing) or 414 (Boost pressure control - Faulty Signal). I'd recommend getting the blink code (actual DTC) to determine which one it is -- 242 indicates an issue with the turbo control valve electricals, and disables fuel trim. 414 is a bit more interesting:

Condition
The engine control module (ECM) derives boost pressure from the mass air flow (MAF) sensor signal. Diagnostic trouble code (DTC) EFI-414 is stored if the engine control module (ECM) registers that the mass air flow (MAF) sensor is fault-free and the load signal exceeds a certain level.


If DTC 414 is the one being set, combined with long-term fuel trim lower limit (P0171), i'd be really suspicious of some sort of intake system leak.

Either way, check the plumbing to your turbo control valve, all three hoses.

- Condition
Diagnostic trouble code (DTC) EFI-541 (Canister purge (CP) valve, signal) is stored if the engine control module (ECM) registers a fault in the canister purge (CP) valve coil or cables after 5 seconds.

- Substitute value
2-heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) control disabled
the electrical test of the front heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) is disabled
the electrical test of the rear heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) is disabled
the pulsed secondary air injection system (PAIR) test is disabled
the heated oxygen sensor (HO2S) test is disabled
the three-way catalytic converter (TWC) test is disabled
leak diagnostic disabled
fuel shut-off conditions changed.

- Possible source
Signal too high:
short-circuit to supply voltage in signal cable
defective canister purge (CP) valve.
Signal too low:
short-circuit to ground in signal cable
Signal missing:
defective fuse 11B/5 (1998-)
open-circuit in signal- or power cable
defective canister purge (CP) valve.

- Fault symptom[s]
may result in poor performance
may result in fuel odor
may result in uneven idling.


Interesting that VIDA doesn't cross-reference the P0455 code to a DTC, but there's a bunch of reports regarding it on forums for this generation of cars. A little searching shows it's generally related to the EVAP valve or the lines to the gas tank:

interesting thread: viewtopic.php?f=1&t=31691
And another: http://volvoforums.com/forum/volvo-s70-33/p0455-8638/
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Re: p0131

Postby eddiecohoon » 04 Apr 2013, 05:13

So I have now replaced the correct o2 sensor. Still no change. If I reset the codes after I start my car the code will stay away. But after I turn it off and turn it back on I have about 3 min before it comes back on. Maybe MAF sensor?
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Re: p0131

Postby erikv11 » 04 Apr 2013, 06:15

Did you check really carefully for vacuum leaks?

MAF is not a bad idea, very easy to test:

Car off
unplug MAF
start car
drive it a bit (will get a MAF code p0102)
do you still get those other codes?

The other way to test is to get a MAF from the junkyard, pretty much every 850 there will have a good MAF in it. Like the O2 sensor, the MAF must be Bosch or Volvo branded.
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Re: p0131

Postby eddiecohoon » 05 Apr 2013, 03:59

I have check for vacuum leaks before, couldn't find one. Did the MAF test. Still got the o2 code. However, after reconnecting the MAF I have not had the code come back on. Still getting bad mileage though. Check for leaks again?
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Re: p0131

Postby erikv11 » 05 Apr 2013, 04:21

Ah, too bad.

I dunno, you can check for vac leaks forever. Wouldn't hurt but your call. Did you check the little elbow on the end of the intake manifold?

Have you ever tested the resistance values of the ECT? Another sensor that is free to test. There is a thread from cn90 that lists some of the benchmark resistance values, it was bumped up today I think, give it a look.

I'm grasping at straws here but I know your car has had this issue for a long time now, worth checking many things.
'96 NA 855 | 207 k | wrecked body, rebuilt engine needs a home
'96 NA 855 | 121 k
'95 R 854 | 180 k
'98 V70 GLT | 221 k
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Re: p0131

Postby eddiecohoon » 05 Apr 2013, 12:53

I did but I will check again. I will also check the ect as well. Thank you
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