98 V70/T5: Cam Timing Q's Topic is solved

[sleddriver]

Spent far longer than I anticipated this afternoonn replacing both front camshaft seals.

More on that later....

I read multiple threads on cam timing and took photos of mine before & and after. I have yet to reinstall the TB hydrlc tensioner. Currently, the tnsr pulley is being pulled on with a bungy. I've rotated the crank CW a few directions with the TB reinstalled, but the cam marks no longer line up. Are they supposed to AFTER the pulley/camshaft relationship has been altered or not?

I am able to move the crank by hand, no indications that anything that shouldn't be touching, is.

Here's the initial position after the crank was rotated to center the marks. When turning the crank CW, the top of the belt between the two sprockets moves from left to right. So both intake & exhaust have passed their alignment marks by half a tooth.

Loosened one Intake bolt while TB still under hydra tension. Here it looks about in the middle of the oval slot.

Repeated the above with the Exhaust side. May be a bit to the left, indicating retarded.

Upon reassembly, I decided to retard the intake a bit and advance the exhaust, as recommended for turbo cars. Here's the new setting for the intake. I meas. the right side gap at 3mm. Dead even would be 2.5mm as the max slot width meas = 11mm and the bolt dia on the unthreaded section = 6mm. This leaves 5mm or 2.5mm/side when centered. Thus there is 0.5mm of retard.

The exhaust here I left in the middle. It may be a smidge to the right.

After spinning the crank CW two full turns, then lining up the crank, here's how the cams look:

Volvo_Camshaft Seals 027.JPG (148.14 KiB) Viewed 2466 times

Actually, now that I get a good look from inside, viewing this photo, it shows they're about the same distance ahead of the TB Cover index marks. Both camshafts were rotated CW a bit due to tightening the sprocket bolts before reinstalling the belt. I did move them CCW a bit to return them to their original position.

I'm thinking that if I removed the belt, rotated both sprockets one tooth CCW, then replace the belt and rotate a few times, I might be lined up.

Weigh in with suggestions, words of wisdom & advice!

[Ozark Lee]

I think you are correct. That is actually pretty common if there is a bit of slack in the belt as it goes across the idler before the grenade pin on the tensioner gets pulled. The trick is to have that part of the belt where it comes off of the crankshaft and across the idler taught as it hits the intake cam sprocket.

...Lee

[sleddriver]

OK Lee. Thanks for the over-the-shoulder look and reply. I did notice some belt slack as this month-or-two-old new belt is much looser than when new AND I've never removed any belt before, then put it back on. A few months ago was my first time to remove any TB period. The past two times it was due I paid someone else.

I'm waiting for some degreaser to work before I go rinse with 140°F. Next, I'll have to clean up the garage floor oil spots.

[sleddriver]

No one else wanted to weigh in here, eh? Oh well......

Indoors for a bit taking a break from the heat & humidity (93°F, 64% Rh, solar heat index: 123°F). I guess my brain has protected me from how frustrating this job was just a few months ago. I even wrote out a complete procedure. The hydraulic tensioner bolts are a PITA to reinstall when you have big hands. 1/4" rachet is too short, 1/2" is too wide unless you grind down a 12mm socket. 3/8" will work. It sure does take a long time of racheting to full seat the bolt plus dropping the wrench itself half a dozen times. The lower HTB needs a 1/4" wobble to clear the crank pulley.

Time to buy a thin 3/8" air ratchet to slide into these tough places and just squeeze the trigger.

Finally got them back into proper alignment after multiple crank spins. Working with a loose TB is A LOT different than a tight one....

Volvo_Cam Timing II 002.JPG (171.85 KiB) Viewed 2420 times

Another issue was finding a suitable piece of wire strong enough to withstand the tremendous force of the HT. It bent all finishing nails that would fit. A HSS drill bit is too long to extract when the HT is installed. More waisted time. I finally found a piece of very stiff wire that would fit and not bend. I'm going to specially label it so I can easily find it next time.

I also need to specially modify a bungie to safely engage the TP, so I don't have to worry about it slipping and smacking me in the face. Safety glasses are a must when this thing is installed. Trying to seat the upper HT bolt with the bungie installed and little clearance, is dangerous.

Re: Cam Timing. IPD both sells a tool ~ $60 + post instructions for it. Interesting read. Don't even need to remove the TB to adjust either. Rather engenius. Also allows precise settings as each mm of cam movement within the limited range equals 3°.

Both camshaft seals were absolutely fossilized. No wonder they leaked. Removal was difficult to say the least. More on this later.

/rant

[rspi]

I usually make several marks in the inside cam tip with the cam sprockets. The only true way to get it right is to remove the stuff off the back and use the locking tool.

[sleddriver]

Thanks Robert. I did watch your video before proceeding. I was interested in cam timing information as I began to realize the sled is a bit sluggish in the low-RPM-region, especially during the hot Summer Tx heat. Definitely not "eager" to move out after a stop. I would definitely trade some top end for a bit more "eagerness" on the low end. Adjusting the cams seems a bit hit-or-miss without an index plate however. I definitely did NOT want to get in a situation that occurred years ago when an indy first replaced the belt and left the exhaust one-tooth-off retarded. Noticed loss of power, lower MPG, sluggish, balking while climbing steep local hills. Didn't connect-the-dots unfortunately, until years later. (1st TB change was back in the mid-2000's).Once fixed, the fun was back.

After buttoning her up, I went for a drive. Not eager around 2000 rpm. Pulls strongly though when floored and rpm's climb. So I think I'm back where I was and didn't experience the above prior, poor performance.

I left it parked on the driveway for about 6hrs and noticed no oil drips! Time will tell. I need to clean off the prior spills on the garage floor to have a clean surface to start from.

Finally, a few comments on some other posts. One said if the front or rear seals are leaking, the PCV system must be clogged/plugged/etc because these seals rarely, if ever fail. Not necessarily. My motor passed the glove test with flying colors, but both front seals leaked. Why? Because they were fossilized, hard, and brittle. Any seal will leak in that condition. These top-of-the-motor seals have to deal with quite a bit of heat. IOW, they live a hard life. What I pulled out though were not OEM, but Elring. Supplied by the indy at the previous TB change.

Second, I'm interested in how others made such fine adjustments to the cams without an index plate; as one mm of cam rotation equals 3°. To do this one-degree-at-a-time, means .33mm at-a-time. I pulled out a dial caliper to have a look at 0.33mm....that's a mighty fine line. I suppose you could machine a piece of metal to the correct thickness and use that as a spacer. Since in-the-middle = 2.5mm/side of clearance, you could machine a spacer to 2.17mm with a fly cutter in a milling machine. Or find a piece of wire that's close.

[erikv11]

For the record, Elring cam seals have a very poor reputation. Glad you got them out of there. Nicely done.

Haven't ever adjusted cams, so no comment there. It's on the list because it should be so easy to do, but like many things on the list ...

[sleddriver]

Thanks. Indy is supplied with Elring & Victor Heinz via WORLD-PAC. I think they warranty their work for one year though.....so if it leaks after a few years or so, you pony up to do it all over again.

I'm going to resume using 91 or 93 octane gas again during the heat. Got in the habit of using 87 for so long due to high gas prices. I don't ever hear any detonation, but it could be going on. Might help with the sluggish 2K rpm area. I read several threads on gas and many reported better performance using it. Could also be that the EPA Tx Blend is just poor compared to the Winter blend.

I am interested in others experience regarding cam timing. Please weigh in.

[sleddriver]

Re: Cam Timing. IPD both sells a tool ~ $60 + post instructions for it. Interesting read. Don't even need to remove the TB to adjust either. Rather engenius. Also allows precise settings as each mm of cam movement within the limited range equals 3°.

CORRECTION: IPD's tool isn't $60; it's $21.95. My apologies! Not sure what I was looking at when I quoted the wrong price.
Cam tool instructions: https://www.ipdusa.com/products/7047/11 ... iming-tool

ARD also sells one for $32.50: http://www.ardideas.com/ARD-Cam-Timing-Tool_p_146.html

[sleddriver]

Reflections On Seal Removal & Installation:

I wanted to close this loop before too much time passed. I used CN90's excellent guide and wrote out the procedure beforehand to save time & frustration searching for the correct socket size, doing things out of order, and be sure I didn't forget anything. Though I initially thought the main oil leak was due to the rear, I intended to replace the intake as well.

After removing the sprockets, I looked underneath for oil:

Underside of the front seal, showing a leak.

Underside of the rear seal, also showing a leak. Both lower areas are wet and traces of oil can be found where they ran back towards the block, then ran down the front of the motor, behind the plastic TB shield. The rear leak will quickly turn the corner to the backside of the motor, and dirty up the coolant connection before continuing its path down to the bottom. I thought I may have even had a coolant leak there. Fortunately, not so.

• I left the serpentine belt & tensioner in place as they didn't obstruct the work area and I didn't want to remove things I didn't need to.
• I also left the spark plugs in place and didn't experience any problem wrenching over the crank using a long 1/2" breaker bar.
• Definitely important to loosen all cam sprocket bolts BEFORE removing the TB.
• The old seals were fully installed to a depth of 6mm.
• I used a mild Scotch-brite pad to polish the ends of the camshafts to remove any roughness, then blew away any debris/dirt BEFORE pulling the seals. My thinking was to not allow any rough spots to rough-up the fresh inner seal lip while twisting & sliding them into place.
  
  Here's the difference between a polished surface and a "rough" one:

  

• Using the paint-can-opener CN90 recommended, I attempted to slide it between the camshaft & inner seal. No joy...not even close. The inner lip was rock hard. Mine were a bit deep, so I couldn't get the angle right either. Next up was an IC chip puller, with a longer reach. No joy there either. Finally, I used a very small jewelers screwdriver. I could wedge this in, but no way it was strong enough to pry with. So I used a very tiny drill (3/32") to drill a hole, then threaded in a #6 PB screw with a very coarse thread. Fine or normal thread would work here, just didn't have one.
  
  With that done, I carefully levered it out using long-nose pliers and a block of wood for a fulcrum. A few pieces of the front face cracked off while doing so. It also left behind pieces. I carefully flicked these out of the way using a Q-tip so they didn't fall into the oil slot. Then cleaned up this area with a fresh one.
• Cn90's trick of using a 1-1/2" PVC coupler was spot on as was removing ~ 26mm of it so the existing sprocket bolts could be used along with the sprocket to slowly squeeze the new seal into place......after first lubing it well with oil and twisting it onto the end of the camshaft. This technique worked fine and ensured the new seal was "square-on", with no draging on the critical inner lip.
• I verified the inset was consistent at 6mm, but ran into a problem with it being around 4mm on the bottom. Closer inspection revealed that the outer surface of the head wasn't in the same vertical plane as the upper camshaft cover. Instead it bulged out a bit and was rough as seen here:

  

• Extracting the old rear seal was more difficult due to the strut tower. I used the same procedure as above, but it took longer. This seal was very tight and came out in more pieces. "Hardened & fossilized" describe its condition well. Only a screw would remove it. Installing the new one was the same as above.
• I used a small inspection mirror on a wand to fully inspect the inner lip of both seals for any abnormalities.
  
  The most difficult and frustrating part of reassembling was installing & tightening the two 12mm hydraulic tensioner bolts. They were far easier to loosen! I discussed (and cussed) this at length in an earlier entry.
  
  Hopefully (for the final time), I cleaned up all the oil mess by spraying it down with degreaser, letting it work about 15min., then rinsed with a pump up sprayer filled with 140°F water.
  
  I am most pleased to report that the oil leaks have STOPPED as have the coolant leaks at the WP mentioned in another thread! How nice to have a garage floor FREE from puddles! Next time I'll order new seals and replace them when I do the TB.