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98 V70:Cabin Blower Speed Vehicle Speed Sensitive? Topic is solved

Help, Advice and DIY Tutorials on Volvo's extremely popular car line -- Volvo's 1990s "bread and butter" cars -- powered by the ubiquitous and durable Volvo inline 5-cylinder engine.

1992 - 1997 850, 850 R, 850 T5-R, 850 T5, 850 GLT
1997 - 2000 S70, S70 AWD
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sleddriver
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Re: 98 V70:Cabin Blower Speed Vehicle Speed Sensitive?

Post by sleddriver »

Spent the last 1.5hrs looking over the ECC, Combi & Motronic 4.x schematics. I thought there was a wiring chart that showed what each one carried, like what signal it carries. However, couldn't find it. Diagnosing this sounds like an "I roll" black hole time-wise. And this time of year is a very bad time to fall into one of these......

My indy uses an Autodiagnos scanner which will let me read everything. However, given this problem only manifests itself at speed, it'll call for two people, borrowing his scanner and driving the car.

It is related to actual vehicle speed, not RPM. Doesn't the radio also have the capability to lower/raise volume based on vehicle speed? I've never noticed this. Perhaps it must be enabled?

This makes me wonder if this ECC needs to have this "feature" (cabin air blower speed inversely proportional to vehicle speed) turned off via the scanner.

What I need is an ECC manual itself! Does such an animal exist? Please advise....
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Re: 98 V70:Cabin Blower Speed Vehicle Speed Sensitive?

Post by sleddriver »

Turns out Burn-E was experiencing something very similar: http://www.matthewsvolvosite.com/forums ... =1&t=59689. He also posted on VS, but didn't receive much comment. Another owner with an XC also experienced something similar. So, I'm not nuts and neither are they.....well that's a start.

I did find a bit of an "ECC Manual" for an 850 here: http://www.volvotips.com/index.php/850- ... ce-manual/. I'd forgotten about that. I do remember reading back in the beginning of the year when I was having issues with the original ECC that came with the sled.
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Re: 98 V70:Cabin Blower Speed Vehicle Speed Sensitive?

Post by sleddriver »

I decided to pull the ECC, remove the top and have a look inside. Found this:
Volvo_ECC from junk yard 006_Edit.jpg
Volvo_ECC from junk yard 006_Edit.jpg (121.49 KiB) Viewed 563 times
Note the 6th pad to the left of the lower right hand IC corner looks like it overheated. MOF, it looks like the Cu trace burned all the way to the left-most resistor! Also, that bottom row of IC pins that are circled appear to have some sort of dust/fuzz/smutz combo in between them. Very odd that.

PO also had the dimmer setting on MAX:
Volvo_ECC from junk yard 002.JPG
The board needs a good wash.
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Re: 98 V70:Cabin Blower Speed Vehicle Speed Sensitive?

Post by sleddriver »

I've been running the fan on AUTO recently with temp set to 78°F. Fan will slowly spin even on a dead-cold engine, I guess to move air past the duct temp sensors. They'll ramp up/down as necessary. I notice a bit of a fluctuation when slowing to a stop, then at full stop. So AUTO fan speed appears to be working.

BTW, the ECC I pulled from the JY has ORANGE backlights instead of GREEN. Odd that. Even odder, is that as shown above the bulbs were covered in BLUE vinyl covers!! Removing those had increased the brightness.
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Re: 98 V70:Cabin Blower Speed Vehicle Speed Sensitive?

Post by jblackburn »

I notice a bit of a fluctuation when slowing to a stop, then at full stop. So AUTO fan speed appears to be working.
Alternator output alone can explain that one.

No change with speed otherwise now?

Also, yes, the radio does adjust volume at certain speeds - around 40 and 75 IIRC. That setting is in the manual somewhere or another.
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Re: 98 V70:Cabin Blower Speed Vehicle Speed Sensitive?

Post by sleddriver »

Update:
Using my indy's Autodiagnos Volvo code scanner, I pulled the following COMBI codes:
CI-121 ECT Signal Faulty; count = 48
CI-123 48 Pulse Vss out; Signal too high; (Mileage = 207,352mi. This appears to be an old code as current mi. > 215kmi. )
CI-221 Vss Signal - Missing (Mileage = 208,277)

I attempted to erase these three codes. Unfortunately, the AD scanner appeared to hang-up. After 5min., nothing had changed so I pulled the plug. I was also unable to erase these codes using the AutoLogics scanner mentioned below. Odd that.....

ABS Code:
ABS-432 Control Module Intermittent Fault. Global Disturbance Fault. Count = 64. Never seen this one before. ABS light comes on at times, then goes off.

ECC Scan revealed no stored codes. So I used the diagnostic function to verify all knob, button and slider functions & operations. More on these readings later.

Switched to a newer AutoLogics (?) unit. Pulled same three COMBI codes as above. Wasn't able to delete them either. However, it did provide more detailed info on each than the AD unit and a brief web search. Due to time constraints I wasn't able to write out the complete code descriptions. However, I did note with interest that the ECC blower speed should decrease as vehicle velocity increases!! Indy confirmed that the vehicle speed signal first goes to the ABS then COMBI and the ECC gets it from there. Thus, these COMBI codes can be set due to an ABS module fault/failure which may/may not illuminate the ABS light.

The above seems in conflict with many owners of ECC equiped 98's: No reports of varying ECC blower speeds when manually set with the slider and both Drvr & Pass temp controls set off either MIN or MAX. I do recall that with my original ECC and the twice repaired ABS module illuminating the ABS light yet again, that the ECC blower speed remained where I set it. (I had so many problems with the ABS module on that car, I learned to just ignore the #$%^ light until earlier this year when I discovered a motor pin had broken free of the PCB. Anyone heard of ABS-432?)

UPDATE II:

From 1996 http://www.volvotips.com/index.php/850- ... ir-manual/
DTC CI-123
48-Pulse Speed Signal Short-Circuited To Supply

1) This DTC will set if signal leads have short circuit to supply. On vehicles equipped with Electronic Climate Control (ECC),
fan speed may not decrease at higher road speeds.
On vehicles equipped with a trip computer, incorrect values are shown for average speed, average consumption, instantaneous consumption, and trip computer trip recorder.
2) To correct this problem, check signal leads for speed output signal for a short circuit to supply between instrument cluster and ECC or trip computer.


Short-circuited to supply sounds like "signal too high" to me. This wordage rings similar to what I read yesterday.

DTC CI-221
Speed Signal Absent

1) This DTC will set if instrument cluster does not register a speed signal (input signal) when engine speed signal exceeds 1500
RPM for at least one minute and engine temperature exceeds 122 F (50 C).
2) Speedometer may read too low or give no output. DTC is set in engine control system. On vehicles equipped with Electronic Climate Control (ECC), fan speed does not reduce with increased road speed. On vehicles equipped with trip computer, faults occur in displays for average speed, average consumption, instantaneous consumption and trip computer trip recorder. Cruise control will shut down and a DTC will set. If ABS light comes on, see appropriate BRAKES – ANTI-LOCK
article.
3) To correct this problem, check for broken signal lead, high contact resistance, idle above 1500 RPM, or ABS system. See appropriate BRAKES – ANTI-LOCK article.


Here it is again: ECC fan speed inversely proportional to vehicle speed. Why would Volvo include this as a "feature"? Also mentions the CC will "shut down". Mine currently is though it may be due to not being plugged back in while doing the work under the drivers side.
Last edited by sleddriver on Wed Dec 14, 2016 12:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 98 V70:Cabin Blower Speed Vehicle Speed Sensitive?

Post by abscate »

Global Disturbance Fault.
Hey - be careful with this one. That looks like a button you shouldn't push

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Re: 98 V70:Cabin Blower Speed Vehicle Speed Sensitive?

Post by jblackburn »

sleddriver wrote:The above seems in conflict with many owners of ECC equiped 98's: No reports of varying ECC blower speeds when manually set with the slider and both Drvr & Pass temp controls set off either MIN or MAX. I do recall that with my original ECC and the twice repaired ABS module illuminating the ABS light yet again, that the ECC blower speed remained where I set it. (I had so many problems with the ABS module on that car, I learned to just ignore the #$%^ light until earlier this year when I discovered a motor pin had broken free of the PCB. Anyone heard of ABS-432?)
I believe it might ramp the fan up/down when in "auto" fan speed mode with vehicle speed (since at higher speeds air passes through the vents on its own). But yes, fairly sure that mine stays where it's set when the fan speed itself is set manually.
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Re: 98 V70:Cabin Blower Speed Vehicle Speed Sensitive?

Post by ecbsykes »

Hey! The title of this thread immediatley got my attention. I too have noticed (for years, and through several 2 blower motors) that many times while driving on the freeway, that went I come to a relatively quick stop, I can definitley hear the blower motor pushing more air out. I have an ECC and only use it in the manual mode (never auto for fan speed, temp, or position).
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Re: 98 V70:Cabin Blower Speed Vehicle Speed Sensitive?

Post by sleddriver »

ECBSykes: Welcome to the club! There seem to be a few who have experienced this problem. Definitely not wide spread. According to what I posted earlier, properly functioning units should act this way....yet few do. WUWT?
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