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No start. 1992, 245, B230F, LH 2.4, ODO @ 317k km.

Help, Advice, Owners' Discussion and DIY Tutorials on all Volvo's "mid era" rear wheel drive Volvos.
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93Regina
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93Regina

Re: NO START. 1992, 245, B230F, LH 2.4, ODO @ 317k km.

Post by 93Regina » Wed Mar 21, 2018 11:19 pm

Click on this one, and go to ECU link: ECU information table giving which ECU and AMM for which car. Handy
http://www.nuceng.ca/bill/volvo/volvohome.htm

If not, try this one: https://tinyurl.com/ybntx3ba

Something on Matthew's site is messing with URL completion

Go here, and click on LH 2.4

http://www.volvowiringdiagrams.com/
Last edited by 93Regina on Wed Mar 21, 2018 11:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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sergitin32



sergitin32
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sergitin32

Re: NO START. 1992, 245, B230F, LH 2.4, ODO @ 317k km.

Post by sergitin32 » Wed Mar 21, 2018 11:35 pm

Yes, I used that chart to look for the eBay ECU I got xxx-951 is a good substitute for the 561 white label I have there, still didn't make a difference.
The diagrams for LH 2.4 have a lot of great info. I will try checking the signals at the ECU connector, since I have the feeling there is a ground there missing, Thanks for this great resource!

Thank you 93Regina!



yosef7
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yosef7

Re: NO START. 1992, 245, B230F, LH 2.4, ODO @ 317k km.

Post by yosef7 » Fri Apr 13, 2018 5:25 pm

I once had a tough time with my 92 240 fuel relay. Some days it would work beautiful and others not so much. Did much of what you are doing. It was frustrating. I finally was giving up and thought wires. There is a short somewhere. And you know that is not a happy task.

Found a wire from ignition (key) to the relay. The wire was open just enough to short every so often for no reason other than the exposed cooper grounded when it wanted to. Such a simple thing yet hard to find and diagnose.

Way up under the dash.

If it helps, that was my experience.
Yosef


May you always have enough.

sergitin32
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Re: NO START. 1992, 245, B230F, LH 2.4, ODO @ 317k km.

Post by sergitin32 » Sat Apr 14, 2018 11:31 am

Yeah I believe that's my next try. Look in the wiring. There have been a few gremlins going on while this is happening. Too bad cuz it's very tedious job. That's why I haven't put much thought into it. Like if ignoring might make it go away. Thanks for sharing your experience.



sergitin32
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Re: NO START. 1992, 245, B230F, LH 2.4, ODO @ 317k km.

Post by sergitin32 » Thu Oct 04, 2018 7:22 pm

OK, I am trying a new approach to this issue.
I really want to get this car going.

If any of you guys would have a no start, with the main fuel pump that does not preload as the ignition switch goes to pos1 with diagnostic code lights that do the following:

pin2: Very dim on as I put the connector in. Light comes on when press by 2 seconds, then stays very lo dim... no codes at all.

pin6: Off when connector goes in. ON when press button for 2 seconds then off again when released, no codes, not even 1-1-1.

Previous work was exchanged the cooing temperature sensor for a code from the diagnostic unit that was working alright. Radio installation and some diagnostic in the wipers switch to make the rear wiper to work.

Pump relay and ECU had been exchanged with my other 1989 240 with no difference, well except my 1989 now is having trouble starting when warm, but that's another thread.

I was kinda assuming there might be something wrong with the ECU current ingress that might have hurt my other Volvo's ECU.

RPM sensor? It is also related to the main pump preload right?

We also tested the relay for the pump and connectivity by bypassing it and it was all good. As well as the main fuse #6 I believe in this case. No 25Amps fuse for the fuel injection in the engine for this year but it goes all through #6. All fuses were changed to brass from IPD.

I will start reading the manuals and back to the drawing board.
Thanks a lot for any hints or advice,

Sergitin



sergitin32
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Re: NO START. 1992, 245, B230F, LH 2.4, ODO @ 317k km.

Post by sergitin32 » Sun Oct 07, 2018 11:55 pm

Found this piece of diagnosis advice from https://www.volvoclub.org.uk/faq/Engine ... ction.html

"Tips from Bob Dietz] When the car dies run a test light from the negative side of the coil to ground. If the light flashes brightly when you bump the starter then all the ignition components are ok, and the fuel pump should run for a few seconds. If the light barely flashes and the fuel pump doesn't run, then suspect the ignition amplifier (between the air filter housing and the inner fender wall.) If the light flashes and the fuel pump doesn't run, suspect the fuel injection relay (the white relay behind the ashtray--remove the lighter, lighter cover plate, two screws and the ashtray to access). Pull the cover off and reinstall, turn the key to run position and operate the contacts by finger. If the fuel pump runs, then the relay is suspect--resolder or replace--your choice. If by turning the key to start and holding the fuel pump point set closed the car runs, release finger pressure on the fuel pump contacts. If the contacts stay closed for a few seconds after you release the contacts then the relay is bad and the fuel injection control unit is ok. If the motor shuts off as soon as the fuel runs out after you take finger pressure off the relay contacts then replace the relay and the fuel control unit--the protection diode on the relay has failed and wounded the computer."

Trying this next time I check the car... power stage under suspicion here. Discard the ignition VS the fuel delivery. Clever!!!



sergitin32
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Re: NO START. 1992, 245, B230F, LH 2.4, ODO @ 317k km.

Post by sergitin32 » Mon Nov 05, 2018 8:37 pm

OK WEIRD... but now I know its electrical and its wiring problems... I mean I think.

After taking out the oil separator box from this wagon and putting it into the '89 sedan.
Today I decided to go and take a look at things mainly to exchange power stages etc and see what happens.
And just because I gave it a go to the ignition, to my amaze the gas pump hummed when the switch opened.
Cranked the engine for like 5 seconds and the car started and idled as if everything is peach. DAMN...

One + thing I discovered today in my curiosity is that in the driver's side fender there was a lot of nature and paper detritus heavily packed inside the tunnel with wires a few wires. So there was probably a rodent living there for a while while one of the previous owners had it parked. I believe all these issues might be due to faulty wiring to the ECU from one or several sources but mainly from the coolant temperature sensor cuz when I tried pulling codes again the 123 and 232 came back again. The sensor is a brand new Bosch unit... I think while fighting to get the oil separator box out I might have moved the wires in the harness close by (I mean I know I did cuz it is so damn tight) and there might have done contact again and fix the problem... Or again maybe while digging the mouse nest some wire caught on the flow... need to investigate. I still wonder if the sensor might be fried, it was an eBay unit and I already contacted the seller.

Next thing I will uncover all the wires including the ones passing through the fender tunnel and try to find if there is any damage there. I expect to find some chew or frail wiring, even when Volvo solved that issue in 1986 I have read.



sergitin32
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Re: NO START. 1992, 245, B230F, LH 2.4, ODO @ 317k km.

Post by sergitin32 » Tue Feb 12, 2019 6:25 pm

Once again the car wouldn't start, after being ok for a month or so starting every week and idle like a purring cat. SYmptoms include issues pulling codes and the fuel pump not pre-charging when ignition in position I.

I thought better to attack this problem one symptom at the time.
In this post, I will be focussing in the "OBD" diagnose unit. I had some videos but seems I can not attach them here, so I will describe them.

When "pulling" codes from connector 6 the light shines only when I pulse the button for 2 seconds and then nothing.
when in connector 2 the light is lit always but very dimly, then brighter when push button for 2 seconds then back to very dim.
20190211_190155.jpg
I have been doing some reading through the electric diagrams in the several manuals I have here (Chilton, Haynes, Bentley) I can only say I am not happy with them.
Here I tried to show a couple pictures of what they look like, I had to do some "paint" editing to the picture from the Bentley manual since the print in those diagrams is really bad. In the Haynes, the OBD is Q... in the Bentley is tagged as 131.
2019-2-12 15-2-15.jpg
1992 vlolvo 240 LH 2.4.jpg
Note: Chilton says the wiring from pin 6 in EZK to pin 4 in OBD and ignition switch is red and black... while Haynes and Bentley claim it to be blue, I guess I will take a look and give some feedback next time.

I will start measuring continuity for the wires connecting these units and come back with my findings.

I was just wondering if anyone with more experience diagnosing this OBD unit could orient me in the right direction? Or if at all disagree with these pictures info.

Thanks very much.



sergitin32
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Re: NO START. 1992, 245, B230F, LH 2.4, ODO @ 317k km.

Post by sergitin32 » Tue Feb 12, 2019 6:44 pm

In this second post for today, I would like to comment on my findings in regards to the Engine Coolant Temperature sensor (ECT).

So I took the connector off the sensor and measured for resistance in each of its pins (sensor's) and I obtain a 3400Kohms reading approx in both at 12 Celsius as the pics can attest.
20190211_185349.jpg
20190211_185259.jpg
20190211_185245.jpg

I then proceeded to dissect the main run of the harness that engulfs the wiring from this sensor and they did look like brand new. SO no wire disintegration happening here due to heat or oil contamination. I also kinda pulled and pushed just to make sure they were attached at the points where I could not see the wiring.

Next, I bridged the connector itself with a piece of copper wire and went to measure continuity by pin 13 @ ECU and pin 2 @ EZK, the multimeter beeped. so the harness is good in all its length. and the sensor is giving a proper reading for the temperature... so starting should not be an issue due to these components.

I went around cleaning connectors and found the wire coming from the RPM speed sensor or Crankshaft Position/speed sensor or whatever other names it might have in this world and found the wire cover to have a few nicks due to heat. So, just in case I bought a couple of these sensors to put them in both my cars since they are known for being NO START reason.

The rest, for now, checks right.

Question: Does any of these two sensors gives the ECU a signal that would run the main fuel pump to preload the injectors when the switch gets turn to position 1? As if the signal is not there the pump won't do the original humming as the switch is turned to the position before cranking?

Thanks for the help guys, I am really wanting to get this car going but I am kinda lost with this trouble.



93Regina
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93Regina

Re: NO START. 1992, 245, B230F, LH 2.4, ODO @ 317k km.

Post by 93Regina » Tue Feb 12, 2019 9:06 pm

sergitin32 wrote:
Tue Feb 12, 2019 6:44 pm
fuel pump not pre-charging when ignition in position I.
Oh....remove return fuel line from FPR (Fuel Pressure Regulator), hook hose to FPR's barb, put hose in Coke bottle, and have someone turn ignition to on posiltion.

No fuel in Coke bottle...insert return fuel hose back in its place, then hot wire fuel pumps at fuse panel, and start engine



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