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1992 Volvo 245, 317xxx km, B230F, Recurrent No start issue, cant pull codes.

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sergitin32
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1992 Volvo 245, 317xxx km, B230F, Recurrent No start issue, cant pull codes.

Post by sergitin32 »

This must be like the 3rd or 4th time I thought I have this fixed, but the issue is long term intermittent. Meaning it would start for several days or weeks (I haven't driven long to test how it behaves in the open road) then one day of a sudden won't start, and remain like that for months at a time. Then one day randomly it starts again and it goes. Of course, during this period of time, I have searched the forums and posted a few times in other forums with no avail to any answers. I have also never stopped of changing parts that I would believe could be involved in a no start issue... here is a list of the most common suspects that have been taken care off:

New fuel filter
New coolant temperature sensor
New RPM sensor or crank speed sensor
New spark plugs
New distributor cap and rotor
New brass set of fuses

When the car starts it idles really nicely and it goes smoothly with no problem. 

On-time I even change the ECU with another I got from eBay, nothing, tried my ECU in my second Volvo 240 (1989) and it did not work, the worst thing is my other car started behaving badly after I did this, not sure what that was all about

Also exchanged the fuel pump relay and still a no go, tried this car relay with a multimeter for continuity and it checked out fine. I know I could also try to reflow the old solder points but I don't think this is the culprit anyway. 

HERE IS THE MAN PROBLEM:

Every time it stops starting I go to pull some codes in both its pins. RESULTS:

Pin 2: No codes but the light stays on in a very-very dim way hard to see it's on unless you shadow it. 
Pin 6: Nothing. No codes at all, the light stays off. 

When I depress the button in order to pull the codes the light comes on for the time the button is depressed (2 seconds) then it behaves as I related above. 

I have been trying to get a notion about what the circuitry is for this code diagnosis tool and see where should I be looking for a faulty ground for example or something like that, but I have had zero luck finding the diagrams for it. I would assume this thing is hooked directly to both computers for ignition and fuel injection. 

I am trying to sell this car and fortunately, it failed me again before the sale, since I truly believed it was fixed, I guess the hope is stronger than the logic. 

Any advice would be greatly appreciated.
Last edited by sergitin32 on Sun Jul 19, 2020 3:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
sergitin32
Posts: 162
Joined: Sun Feb 11, 2007 3:36 am
Year and Model: 1989 240 DL
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Has thanked: 5 times
Been thanked: 2 times

Re: 992 Volvo 245, 317xxx km, B230F, Recurrent No start issue, cant pull codes.

Post by sergitin32 »

I just went to the fuse box to look for any problems, other than fuse 15th been broken and inmediately replaced, cleaned all contacts which were really clean enough from previous time. Needless to say that did not clear the problem. The car still is a NO-START.
I can not hear the main pump click and buzz when move the ignition switch to its first position, not the relay. But I dont believe these would affect the codes in anyway. I will try look for grounds for this circuitry and check their integrity next.
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volvolugnut
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Re: 992 Volvo 245, 317xxx km, B230F, Recurrent No start issue, cant pull codes.

Post by volvolugnut »

When you have a no start, does the engine crank? Any starter click or grind? Do the headlights dim or go out? Has the key switch ever been replaced?

volvolugnut
2001 V70 T5, 1986 244DL, 1983 245DL, 1975 245DL, 1959 PV544, multiple parts cars.
sergitin32
Posts: 162
Joined: Sun Feb 11, 2007 3:36 am
Year and Model: 1989 240 DL
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Has thanked: 5 times
Been thanked: 2 times

Re: 992 Volvo 245, 317xxx km, B230F, Recurrent No start issue, cant pull codes.

Post by sergitin32 »

Yes the engine's crank cycle fine, but it doesnt start.
Starter sounds healthy.
Lights dim I asume the normal amount.
I believe this is the original ignition switch for this car, althou I could not say if different.
I think I will still reflow the solderings for the main relay just because it can't hurt.
But I really think it is something else.
The main question is always why the diagnostic box wont work.
????
sergitin32
Posts: 162
Joined: Sun Feb 11, 2007 3:36 am
Year and Model: 1989 240 DL
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Has thanked: 5 times
Been thanked: 2 times

Re: 992 Volvo 245, 317xxx km, B230F, Recurrent No start issue, cant pull codes.

Post by sergitin32 »

I just resoldered the main relay to no imporvement... solders looked alright but just in case.
sergitin32
Posts: 162
Joined: Sun Feb 11, 2007 3:36 am
Year and Model: 1989 240 DL
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Re: 992 Volvo 245, 317xxx km, B230F, Recurrent No start issue, cant pull codes.

Post by sergitin32 »

Also tried jumping the fuses to test for in-tank pump and main "pressure" pump and they both work, this is how:
Take power from fuse No6 (always on / not switched) and take fuse No4 out. Then with a jump cable from fuse No6 to the left conector of fuse No4 you should hear the main pump actuating. Then the right conector of fuse No4 and you should hear very dimly the in tank pump working (quite night time working space). Then you put fuse number 4 back in place and jump from fuse No 6 to any side of fuse No4 and if both pump were running independently before now they are running together.
With this jumper on try starting the car, if the car doesnt even try to start most likely is not fuel what's needed, so in my case it did not start at all... not even hesitation. So I would believe it is a spark issue, unless the fuel pressure regulator is giving me a hard time I guess... But I would think this to be more on the electric side of the combustion. "spark"... I will try to check the spark plug cables next and see what I get.
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volvolugnut
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Re: 992 Volvo 245, 317xxx km, B230F, Recurrent No start issue, cant pull codes.

Post by volvolugnut »

Have you tried a shot of starter fluid in to the air inlet? If it runs briefly, then it is a fuel supply problem. Also take out a spark plug, connect the plug wire and lay it on a grounded part of the engine. Have someone crank the engine and watch for a good blue spark.
Also, check the wire connections at the coil. All connections should be tight and clean. No corrosion or loose connectors.
Do you have any crumbling wires anywhere? Often these years the insulation just crumbled away and made shorts. Look at the connections at the firewall and headlights. Anywhere exposed to high heat seemed to be a problem. These would often be intermittent failures.

volvolugnut
2001 V70 T5, 1986 244DL, 1983 245DL, 1975 245DL, 1959 PV544, multiple parts cars.
sergitin32
Posts: 162
Joined: Sun Feb 11, 2007 3:36 am
Year and Model: 1989 240 DL
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Has thanked: 5 times
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Re: 992 Volvo 245, 317xxx km, B230F, Recurrent No start issue, cant pull codes.

Post by sergitin32 »

I will try the starter fluid trick, but since I jumped the fuel pumps to work properly last night and still did not start I would think fuel is not the issue and ignition most likelt.
I havent seen any wiring crumbling, I thougt those were more likely to happen in oldes models, before 1986 or so, i will still look around since something like that is likely to make this happen.
Coil conector was cleaned and tight when I changed the distributor cap and rotor. all cables were cleaned and reattached then.
Thanks for all the advice.
Any one has ever had the diagnostic unit gone down and ideas to where to start looking.
As per now I think I will bring 12V directly to both ECUs and EZK to see if there is an electric feed problem with these.
Then go from there.
I dont have anyone to help me cranking the engine but I have a remote starter some where in the tool boxes.
Cheers.
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volvolugnut
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Re: 992 Volvo 245, 317xxx km, B230F, Recurrent No start issue, cant pull codes.

Post by volvolugnut »

Stick to the basics for now. Confirm you have fuel to the injectors (or starter fluid). Fuel pump running does not guarantee fuel to the cylinders. Confirm you have spark at the plugs. If one of these fail we have a direction to follow. I am inclined to think it is an electrical problem.
I know nothing about the flashing light diagnostic system. But the car can run without the diagnotic system working.
volvolugnut
2001 V70 T5, 1986 244DL, 1983 245DL, 1975 245DL, 1959 PV544, multiple parts cars.
sergitin32
Posts: 162
Joined: Sun Feb 11, 2007 3:36 am
Year and Model: 1989 240 DL
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
Has thanked: 5 times
Been thanked: 2 times

Re: 1992 Volvo 245, 317xxx km, B230F, Recurrent No start issue, cant pull codes.

Post by sergitin32 »

"I know nothing about the flashing light diagnostic system. But the car can run without the diagnostic system working."
It depends, apparently the diagnostic system brings codes from the ECU and EZK which are the computers from fuel injection and ignition systems respectively. Hence if the ECU and or EZK won't give codes cuz they are both having issues, the diagnostic box won't "talk to you" but it isn't a box issue but somewhere else and that's is what I am trying to figure out how to "read" the fact that the diagnostic tool is not working with the issue at hand.
Thanks for your advice.
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