Transmission Service Required, does this take Neutral...

carboncow · Post by **carboncow** » 17 Apr 2013, 21:34

Control offline?

I know of the 2001 issues with the "Neutral Control" and I have always doubted our 2001 V70 T5 had ever had the software update to remove this horrible function. The transmission has always been clunky getting out off from a stop but we have known how to work with it and not let it slam as the clutches engage.

In the last couple of months the Transmission Service Required light has come on and it shows this in Vida Dice:

TCM-012A Neutral control Neutral control
TCM-012B Netural control no neutral control

(good messages, eh?)

Worth noting that the car drives fine, no flares, or weird shifts...no decreeable issues, but...

Who would agree that this issue may very well take the Neutral Control functionality offline?
The car actually feels like it's shifting better and never clunking from pulling away at a stop or weird clunky downshifts as the car goes in to Neutral Control.

Does anyone also know/agree that these codes showing with the TSR message may mean the software is offline?
Also, I noted from this posting: http://www.import-car.com/issue/article ... ntid=41766 that it makes mention (ALLDATA) that no adaption is required yet the indie in our area insists... hence a $250-300 software install. Opinions/experience?

jda2000 · Post by **jda2000** » 18 Apr 2013, 08:48

I say if the car is shifting fine, then just reset the fluid counter and the TCM adaptives with vida/dice and clear all the codes afterwards.

carboncow · Post by **carboncow** » 18 Apr 2013, 12:23

What are the TCM "adaptives"?

Does this have to do with the "adaptive" driving technique required after a software update?

Thanks.

jda2000 · Post by **jda2000** » 18 Apr 2013, 12:59

carboncow wrote:What are the TCM "adaptives"?

Does this have to do with the "adaptive" driving technique required after a software update?

Thanks.

exactly.

Since the car is shifting fine, and you already changed the tranny fluid, and you already have a working vida/dice setup , just go to the TCM module with vida and reset the fluid counter, reset the adaptives and then clear all the stored trouble codes and see what codes return if any.

carboncow · Post by **carboncow** » 18 Apr 2013, 13:20

Tranny fluid is about 2.5 years old, so it wouldn't hurt to hit it again.

Is the adaptive required any time there is a tranny code and reset? I'm quite sure I didn't do it when this same Neutral issue popped up last fall.

If one doesn't do the "proper" adaptive as spelled out by Volvo, does it simply figure it out over a longer stretch of time with odd shifting patterns until it gets happy?

Just trying to figure all this out and why the software update option with the dealer/indie insists on the adaptive since it didn't take issue when I didn't do it.

Post by **JRL** » 18 Apr 2013, 13:27

First let me say I don't have any sympathy since you thought you still had the stop neutral in your 01 but you left it in...KNOWING that this is the major factor that destroys 2001 transmissions!!!!

Only thing you can do is replace the fluid again, DOWNLOAD/UPGRADE THE SOFTWARE, reset the adaptions and have them do the drive cycle (all dealer).
The drive cycle needs to be done after the adaptions are cleared and reset
It's nothing you do now.

250-$300?!!!!!

I sure hope you're in Canada with that price
Software costs 50 (US) bucks, labor should be no more than one hour's labor including the 10 minute drive cycle.

Technically after every fluid change the adaptions should be reset along with the fluid counters.
After that you MUST do a new drive cycle, even if it's a shortened version of it.

Drive cycle-(the long version) that no one does anymore as Volvo found it was usually quite unnecessary.

1.) Accelerate 0-50 MPH within 30 seconds…VERY SLOWLY keep it under 1800 RPM if possible
2.) Maintain 45-50 MPH for 20 minutes without using cruise control NOT NECESSARY
3.) Park car, turn off A/C, idle for 5 minutes NECESSARY
4.) Accelerate 0-50 MPH within 30 seconds NECESSARY
5.) Maintain 45-50 MPH for 20 minutes without using cruise control NOT NECESSARY
6.) Shut off car and allow to cool for 30 minutes before repeating cycle ( in some cases the car requires two cycles)
USUALLY NOT NECESSARY. IF AFTER THE FIRST DRIVE CYCLE YOU FIND IT'S SHIFTING FINE, OMIT
Basically you go through step #4 omitting step #2 and it should be fine, if not, repeat.

carboncow · Post by **carboncow** » 18 Apr 2013, 13:58

ah JRL...incredibly helpful and rude all in the same post!

Yea, I can see why nobody (even the dealer) would ever do the properly full adaption...that is simply ridiculous!

I never did the software upgrade for many reasons that made sense at the time...never expected the transmission to last this long for many reasons...but it just keeps going and going. Don't get me wrong it's driving "fine" with the error code for this car but it's always dropped hard from stops since we got it...and with 160K+ miles now most online told me the damage was already done. Since we really didn't know if the software was done or not, the dealer/indie are an hour away...and the are screwing us for a software upgrade...I just couldn't justify it. If our two Volvos were not breaking down monthly I maybe could have justified it...but we struggle to keep up with them. In hind site 20/20 we never expected this car to last this long!

Nope...no sympathy needed here...even if you were passing it out! Thanks for your comments. (we'll most of it).

I'll poke around Vida more as I'm not actually familiar with the fluid counter...other then the MIL service reminder and reset. I'll assume you are talking something else I should figure out.

Post by **JRL** » 18 Apr 2013, 14:22

Could have thrown the code because the counters were never reset.
Still no excuse to still have the software in the car, and yes, most probably major damage has already been done at those miles..... especially if the S/N software is still in it!

And I still don't.
C'mon, you've been around for a while and had the knowledge how bad that software was to have left in the car and in the least not checked to confirm either way
You had a very long time to do this

Post by **precopster** » 18 Apr 2013, 15:43

Never seen that combination of code actually targetting the stop neutral feature, but I guess 99% of them fail for other reasons than this feature going wrong like this (poor early valve body design and B4 covers that have long since broken)

Who knows if you say the trans still shifts fine and the car feels ok on the road you may be one of the lucky ones. If the status for those codes is orange you may get away with having no damage. Perhaps after new fluid and an adapatation it may change to that state.

Getting the feature removed at at a dealer is probably a good idea. The fluid counter reset is in Diagnostics-Vehicle Communication-TCM Advanced Tab.

MattHenning · Post by **MattHenning** » 18 Apr 2013, 21:26

Vida can tell you which version of the software you have. Go to Diagnostics-Vehicle Communication-TCM Advanced Tab and click on Control Module Adaptation. When the page below comes up, click on the picture of the VCT-2000. Vida will read the version of the software you have, and tell you if it needs to be upgraded. Control Module Adaptation is not a feature of the original software and will not work unless you get the upgrade.
Of course, if you can feel the stop-neutral feature, you already know you need the upgrade.