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How leery would you be of 4C if the car otherwise checks out?

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matthew1
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Re: How leery would you be of 4C if the car otherwise checks out?

Post by matthew1 » Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:22 am

Rattnalle wrote:
Wed Apr 18, 2018 9:05 am
A quick Google search seems to confirm XCs with 4C do exist. IPD have the spare dampers specific for both R and XC. If anything it should do more good on an XC that had more suspension travel to work with to go between hard and soft.

They're still ridiculously expensive though at $500 each. That's more than an entire set of regular Sachs dampers.

How much the system is worth is up to each of us to decide. I've decided it isn't. Matthew seems to think it is?
I stand corrected. Somehow in all my years of reading about Volvos I've never happened upon this species!

"XC70 4C system has 2 modes" - that's interesting. The R cars have 3 modes.

I had a 2004 V70 R and I thought the 4C system was very good. In "Advanced" mode, it was super tight. The car cornered about as flat as any stock 3400 lbs wagon would. I'm no racecar driver, but I thought it would have been a blast on a track.

I didn't own the car long enough to have to change the struts, thankfully. But while I maintained the car, there were no errors, ride problems, leaks or anything else that went wrong with the 4C stuff. I loved that car.

For those who want a bit of background, I have a Volvo 4C suspension post here.


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Diverging into trannys . . .

Post by dgh74 » Wed Apr 18, 2018 1:08 pm

Thanks again guys! I am looking at cars from private parties and at cars from indy Volvo dealers/mechanics. One of them told me that they started putting a stronger part in the cars in 2005 that resolved some of the earlier transmission issues. I assume that this might be the B4 servo update that I've read about. And another told me that he no longer sells 2005s because Volvo got a bad batch of AW trannys that year. So far it's been a fascinating journey into what seem to be an inexact science. If all else is equal, then I may lean toward a car without the 4C. I'm wondering if the money'd be better spent on restoring the rest of the suspension on a car with regular shocks?



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Re: How leery would you be of 4C if the car otherwise checks out?

Post by Rattnalle » Wed Apr 18, 2018 1:15 pm

I replaced my shocks and springs at 185-ish k miles. The upgrade was really noticeable, a great improvement in both ride quality and handling. Unsure about the age of the old stuff but not new..



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Re: How leery would you be of 4C if the car otherwise checks out?

Post by vtl » Thu Apr 19, 2018 3:51 pm

I just replaced regular rear suspension that I replaced just 2 years ago (all original Volvo parts) with new Nivomats and regret I didn't do it earlier. What a pleasant ride I've got now!..

The tricky thing with these P2 Volvos is you can't really find a comparable replacement. Once you agree that "dumping money into old car" is only a fraction of a new car payment, but you get a real car in return, not clunky iPod on wheels full of buggy software you don't really want, then you get a piece in your mind.


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Re: How leery would you be of 4C if the car otherwise checks out?

Post by dgh74 » Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:01 pm

You're right. I'm looking at these cars because I can't really find anything else that fits the bill. I've put a ton of money into my Saab in recent years, so it's not that I mind spending it on ageing Swedes. It's just that I don't have a good feeling about anything made by Monroe. Maybe from memories of my dad taking his car to Midas in the 80s. And I think that the active suspension is excessive and over-complicated for the task at hand. To my thinking the Nivomats are a good compromise. That said, how long do the OEM shocks typically last and how long do the 4C and the Nivos last in comparison? A mechanic just told me that at 140K they're probably shot. Another question-- aside from poor ride quality, do the 4Cs throw any codes, or do anything electronically wonky to indicate that they're failing?



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Re: How leery would you be of 4C if the car otherwise checks out?

Post by vtl » Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:23 pm

Basic rear coil spring + shock suspension does not last. It was not doing what I hoped it would do even when it was installed new. I take the car to longer semi-offroad trips, like from Boston to Trans-Taiga road in northern Quebec, 3500 mi, 900 mi is bad gravel - regular suspension didn't do it well: the rear end was sagged, I barely could fit 2 fingers between tire and body. Plastic on the bottom, cladding panels, etc were almost destroyed, car was barely controllable on the gravel. Nivomats are complete opposite, recent ride to Cabot Trail in Nova Scotia fully loaded (family + stuff) was a pleasure, no issues with suspension at all. Folks in Eastern Europe report they get used, 12+ y.o. XC70s with Nivomats that are still alive. They load the cars as hell, like close to 1 ton concrete blocks for construction, and Nivomats don't even notice it.

I don't know anything about 4C. If the car is super-nice, but you don't like 4C, you can convert it to a regular suspension or Nivomats, perhaps with help of forum-local Volvo software wizards ;)


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Re: How leery would you be of 4C if the car otherwise checks out?

Post by DrDan » Sat Apr 21, 2018 3:23 pm

dgh74 wrote:
Thu Apr 19, 2018 5:01 pm
That said, how long do the OEM shocks typically last and how long do the 4C and the Nivos last in comparison?
My rear shocks (or rather one of them) went bad at about 60k miles, very easy and cheap to replace because they pull out downwards without disassembling the suspension. I used Sachs SuperTouring. Big difference in ride quality, with the bad shock the car did not always feel safely controllable on bumpy roads.
Front ones feel kind of stiff and also are suspect (for making that ominous bobobob sound) now, at ~110k miles. Going to be replaced along with spring seats and strut mounts soon. I'm happy that my struts cost <100 bucks each, not 500.



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Re: How leery would you be of 4C if the car otherwise checks out?

Post by scot850 » Sat Apr 21, 2018 4:06 pm

Late to the party, but we have an 06 Xc70 and it has 4C suspension. I just LOVE buying vehicles with very expensive shocks and systems (my 4Runner has Toyota's X-REAS system like the 4C idea).

We had to replace the rears ($1100 CDN each up here from dealer but WAY cheaper from US). The rears were also not helped by the famous P2 broken spring which may have helped the demise early. Fitted new springs and rear shocks. Car had only about 140,000km at that time and 11 years old (about 87,500 miles). Decided to replace the fronts also. Bought the parts but when it went into Volvo this year for an inspection and service they said the fronts were still good, so the new springs/seats/4C front shocks are still in a box in the basement. To be blunt I am amazed anything Monroe makes could last more than a year so I am suitably humbled! We have a lot of salt on the roads here and cold winters (can get to -40C). I cleaned and painted the front shocks as they were showing significant surface rust about 3 years ago and they still look pretty good today.

For us we never adjust the suspension (not height adjustable just stiffness x2 settings), so for us a pointless accessory.

I certainly would not knowingly buy a car with it but if it is working and 2 have been replaced I wouldn't worry too much about it, but plan for a replacement of the other 2 at some point in the near future. I worry more about the springs than the shocks!

I have Nivomats on my 'R' and as far as I know at 270,000km (165,000 miles) and 19 years they are the originals. I do have a good used set if they should fail that will hopefully be still ok when the time comes!

Neil


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