I think I killed it

woolshire · Post by **woolshire** » 14 Nov 2012, 19:30

On the way home from work, my 96' 850 turbo suddenly made some interior noise and sweet steam poured out of the vents. Sound simple, right? Indeed I blew a heater core, but that isn't "the problem".
I stopped and shut the car off when the temp started rising, but not to red. I put a couple gallons of water in and made what appears to be the wrong decision to drive it the last 8 miles home, carefully watching the temp gauge. It never got close to the red but about a block from home, I started hearing a slight noise from the engine, and then the oil light came on. I shut the car off immediately at that point.
I used a turkey baster to suck out some oil from under the oil cap and I am 99% sure that it is a coolant/oil mixture. I'm looking for thoughts, besides it was a bad idea to drive it. Warped head? Blown head gasket? I got no codes thrown.

holyjaguar · Post by **holyjaguar** » 14 Nov 2012, 19:42

Hey woolshire,I am in the process of pulling my N/A engine,(and transaxle), Due to a crack in my block,but you might get off easy with only a head Gasket.Check your compression,. Were you getting any air bubbles in the expansion tank,(possible crack in block). oil and coolant,may be "just" a blown head gasket,but still a Job.for a pro.,I might add.Don`t drive it any more though,and,Best of luck to you, holyjaguar

binglax09 · Post by **binglax09** » 14 Nov 2012, 19:51

Compression check is your very first order of business.

After that, if you find a bad cyl. then you need to replace the head gasket. Maybe a warped head but that's normal and easy to deck it at a machine shop when you get the valve stem seals replaced. Cracked blocks are rare to find in this type of overheating.

woolshire · Post by **woolshire** » 14 Nov 2012, 20:02

Thanks for the tips so far. I guess I thought as long as the temp stayed in band, it would be OK. Apparently, that is not the case.

binglax09 · Post by **binglax09** » 14 Nov 2012, 20:13

The oil light would be my biggest worry. If you took out a rod bearing that would make the headgasket job not worth it.

And what does red mean? nothing really, as anything over the middle is over 190F or so and the motor is not going to be happy anywhere over that. 190F is what most all motors like to run at...

Post by **JDS60R** » 14 Nov 2012, 20:35

You are probably fine if the noise was slight. The lifters start to complain first.

Keep in mind that if you have an oil cooler on the radiator (Turbo's) that it is the primary cause of this type of failure.

Before you go any further, remove the coolant and test the oil cooler in the rad to hold pressure. It is likely that it has failed and you just need an oil change and a new rad. Do an oil change, disconnect the oil cooler lines from the rad (and connect to each other with hose and strong clamps, then do a compression test. Good compression (even numbers on clean oil) and a rad with an oil cooler that will not hold pressure is your key to replace rad and do an oil change again after 15 miles or 10 minutes running at idle to assure all water is gone from in the engine.

If the oil cooler tests ok then :

Drain the oil right away as water on the crank is never a good idea. Put some cheap oil and a filter in and give it a compression test. Sounds like you just lost a head gasket. Always leave the coolant pressure cap off or loose while testing as to not encourage the coolant to go into the oil.

Do not add any more water. Better to drain whats left before the oil change and compression test. You can run the engine safely for a minute without coolant. No more than that though.

Post by **jblackburn** » 14 Nov 2012, 22:00

And what does red mean? nothing really, as anything over the middle is over 190F or so and the motor is not going to be happy anywhere over that. 190F is what most all motors like to run at...

Most engines are fine up to 240, and quite a few these days run at 220. After that, they're not happy, as even under pressure, the coolant begins to turn to steam and doesn't effectively cool the engine.

My main point in this post is that when there's not proper pressure in the cooling system, the temp gauge doesn't mean jack if there's no coolant going past it. Even in steam form, as is happening with hot coolant that has a leak in the system not allowing it to maintain pressure, the engine isn't getting coolant flow through all of the passages to keep it cool.

I believe JDS is correct - change the oil (just use something like Supertech off the shelf at Walmart and really cheap) and run a compression test. I would unhook the lines from the oil cooler at the radiator, and add a piece of transmission line and some clamps in between.

Post by **rspi** » 15 Nov 2012, 06:35

Once you loose the coolant, driving the car anywhere is a big risk. As Justin said, I don't think the gauge works if the sensor is not covered in liquid, hot air on it doesn't make it work properly.

From what I have read, coolant boils at 265, 275 if under pressure. Not sure of the temp that the head starts to warp, that's the real deal.

Test it as mentioned. Hope things work out for you.

Post by **rspi** » 15 Nov 2012, 08:38

Oh, two more things. Our temp gauge is calibrated to lock in at the 3 o'clock position between the temps of 175° - 220°.

If it makes you feel any better, I would have done the exact same thing that you did. I do use a scangauge to monitor my engine temp, not that it would have made a difference.

woolshire · Post by **woolshire** » 15 Nov 2012, 22:11

Ok, tonight I removed the two heater core lines from the fire wall and connected them together with small radiator hose and claps. I also drained the little bit left in the radiator. I didn't see any oil in the coolant...not sure if that is significant.
From what I have learned here is that I should next pull the two oil cooler lines off the radiator and connect them together. Then change the oil and perform a compression test (I've never done that but know it isn't hard) and report back here. That will happen Saturday.
I will need to evaluate whether it will be worth fixing the car. It has 203,000 miles on it but I have done a tremendous amount of work to it and mechanically (except for this little issue) it is in excellent shape. But getting close to winter and not having a tremendous amount of time, or a good warm area to work will come into play. A radiator and heater core are doable, but not sure about a head gasket/warped head and who knows what else...