Looking for a diesel now. need some general info

[scot850]

Possibly got it wrong, but it was a 5 cylinder Audi deisel engine in it.

Neil.

[Rattnalle]

Possibly got it wrong, but it was a 5 cylinder Audi deisel engine in it.

Neil.

Yes it was. Audi has been using a lot of I5s in th past.

[Rattnalle]

I hate you guys. We don’t get diesels here.

Trip to Amsterdam soon, kaneelschep....

The reason you don't get diesels is you have stricter rules on harmful emissions. Our rules are more concerned with climate emissions.

Gas at 40 Euro cents per liter helps, too!

General Motors destroyed the perception of diesels in the USA with a horrible line up of diesel cars in the 1980s..I can't believe a diesel at 40 mpg is putting out more emissions than a gas car at 20 mpg or worse in the city

My old car will be allowed in emission zones in Germany where all diesels except the ones from the last six months or so will be banned. Direct injected petrols with a particle filter will be no go as well. Harsher rules after dieselgate. Based on actual emissions as far as possible. The ones that are harmful to humans.

[mrbrian200]

I hate you guys. We don’t get diesels here.

Trip to Amsterdam soon, kaneelschep....

The reason you don't get diesels is you have stricter rules on harmful emissions. Our rules are more concerned with climate emissions.

Gas at 40 Euro cents per liter helps, too!

General Motors destroyed the perception of diesels in the USA with a horrible line up of diesel cars in the 1980s..I can't believe a diesel at 40 mpg is putting out more emissions than a gas car at 20 mpg or worse in the city

Some of you are getting VWs design engineering failure (and subsequent 'coverup') confused with what modern diesels are capable of. Modern diesel engines can meet US emissions standards. They do all the time.

Volkswagen's problem was that they tried to do too much with too little (engine displacement). Had they modestly stepped those engines up to 2.0-2.2L they probably would have met both consumer performance expectations as well as US emission standards. Instead of scrapping their inadequately small under powered diesel engine and starting over (to design a somewhat larger displacement engine that didn't have to be jack-tuned to achieve adequate performance), they modified the ECM software to modify injection timing + 'rich and dirty' to beef up power output. This is not an example of diesel technology being 'incapable', but of a company trying to cheat the system/standards that have been put in place ***for good reason***.

Diesels are very popular here in the states, just not in passenger vehicles. I've read up quite a bit on this subject. The primary reason diesels aren't popular here isn't because of emissions standards or the 80s GM diesels that have largely been forgotten by the general population. It's because of lower consumer demand stemming from federal and state sales and excise taxes on diesel fuel at rates approaching 1000% over that of gasoline. Because the price of diesel fuel is so much higher here (as opposed to Europe where petrol and diesel are roughly the same price at the pump) the cost per mile to run a diesel car isn't particularly advantageous over gasoline in the US. So a diesel car gets 30-40% better mpg, but the fuel costs 30-50% more than petrol. In cost per mile there is no specific advantage to owning one except to be able to run longer without stopping (on the same size tank of fuel).

Therefore diesels here are reserved for high torque applications such as heavy vehicles, towing, and heavy equipment that if run on petrol would need to utilize ridiculously large engines + turbo. At that point a smaller turbo diesel becomes more economically feasible to both manufacture and run. And indeed, in the arena of heavy vehicles and equipment diesels are very popular.

That's the real reason we don't get them...unequal higher taxes levied on the price of diesel fuel. Put in place by some corrupted government lobby that for whatever reason doesn't want diesels to become popular here.

It's not because diesel engines can't be designed to meet US emission standards. They CAN. Automakers just need to accept 'realistic limits' with regard to smaller displacement, expected performance, and tailpipe emissions. VW wasn't willing to work within these confines and burned themselves multi-billion dollar fines as well as punching a fresh black eye on the entire auto industry.

[Rattnalle]

It's not because diesel engines can't be designed to meet US emission standards. They CAN. Automakers just need to accept 'realistic limits' with regard to smaller displacement, expected performance, and tailpipe emissions. VW wasn't willing to work within these confines and burned themselves multi-billion dollar fines as well as punching a fresh black eye on the entire auto industry.

Most new diesel cars over here are now using AdBlue additive to reduce emissions and conform to the newer emission standards. So sure it's possible to meet even high standards but it's taken a bit of work to get there. A lot of almost new diesels will be banned from emission zones in Germany after the scandal where the EURO6 emission standard now isn't seen as enough. But EURO3 (ie early -00s) petrol cars without direct inject will be fine in the same zones..

[Klausc]

http://www.ooyyo.com/hungary/c=CDA31D71 ... 1251.html/

[kaneelschep]

Those are all newer volvo's I want a classic v70 or 850. A real volvo
Ok actually I want a 145 with T5 engine on lpg, but my wife wont let me.
There are about 4 or 5 on the market here.
This looks good.
https://www.hasznaltauto.hu/szemelyauto ... n-12761918

Every car manufacturer lies about emissions and mileage. Its just a show thing so politicians who dont have a clue about cars can feel good about themselves and tell the world they are saving it.
Noone is happy the balance of lies got disturbed. Not good for economies all over the world and people spending money.
It just happened to be VW, but could have been any of the brands.
German emission zones.. Aah political spasms. well. Lots to say about that.
Best to say the air will be cleaner maybe Not a lot of logic.
Holland is following Germany to zoning big cites btw.
It is actually nice to have inner cities with less cars though.

The 1.9 tdi or later 2L Cr diesel are amongst the best engines out there. No reason to make a new one.
From 66kw up to 110kw and 300+nm. I drove multiple to over half a million km. My audi with that same 1.9L tdi in 85kw has 406000km. First turbo, uses 1L oil on 10000km. Still strong to pull hard. No smoke.

My previous volvo 850 2litre instead of 2,5Litre T5 was a perfect example of why engines wont be made bigger.
Lot of countries in Europe put cars over 2 litre in higher tax groups. Simple but effective.

There is also European mentality. We grew up with the 1.6 being the bigger engine.. But the 1.3 still towing the caravan and bringing the whole family everywhere.
Imagine us watching american movies with 2500kilo cars and their 5,7 litre engines. Wich made less HP than a Vw golf gti, opel kadett or fiat uno turbo. And didnt make it around any corner. Using as much fuel as an oiltanker.

Diesel cars in Holland are taxed 2 times higher as benzine cars.
Our volvo 850 would be 60euro a month in benzine, 120 in diesel, 100 on lpg.
With diesel fuel being only +-30 cents cheaper a litre than benzine, its a simple mileage/distance game.
Sucks to pay, but makes people more aware about their fuel usage, I guess.

[abscate]

Ok actually I want a 145 with T5 engine on lpg, but my wife wont let me.
There are about 4 or 5 on the market here.

Ha! Real men don’t need permission. I’ll write more on that If I get permission.

We don’t get LPG over here either, but our employers give us healthcare!

[callahanoffroad]

The reason you don't get diesels is you have stricter rules on harmful emissions. Our rules are more concerned with climate emissions.

Gas at 40 Euro cents per liter helps, too!

General Motors destroyed the perception of diesels in the USA with a horrible line up of diesel cars in the 1980s..I can't believe a diesel at 40 mpg is putting out more emissions than a gas car at 20 mpg or worse in the city

Some of you are getting VWs design engineering failure (and subsequent 'coverup') confused with what modern diesels are capable of. Modern diesel engines can meet US emissions standards. They do all the time.

Volkswagen's problem was that they tried to do too much with too little (engine displacement). Had they modestly stepped those engines up to 2.0-2.2L they probably would have met both consumer performance expectations as well as US emission standards. Instead of scrapping their inadequately small under powered diesel engine and starting over (to design a somewhat larger displacement engine that didn't have to be jack-tuned to achieve adequate performance), they modified the ECM software to modify injection timing + 'rich and dirty' to beef up power output. This is not an example of diesel technology being 'incapable', but of a company trying to cheat the system/standards that have been put in place ***for good reason***.

Diesels are very popular here in the states, just not in passenger vehicles. I've read up quite a bit on this subject. The primary reason diesels aren't popular here isn't because of emissions standards or the 80s GM diesels that have largely been forgotten by the general population. It's because of lower consumer demand stemming from federal and state sales and excise taxes on diesel fuel at rates approaching 1000% over that of gasoline. Because the price of diesel fuel is so much higher here (as opposed to Europe where petrol and diesel are roughly the same price at the pump) the cost per mile to run a diesel car isn't particularly advantageous over gasoline in the US. So a diesel car gets 30-40% better mpg, but the fuel costs 30-50% more than petrol. In cost per mile there is no specific advantage to owning one except to be able to run longer without stopping (on the same size tank of fuel).

Therefore diesels here are reserved for high torque applications such as heavy vehicles, towing, and heavy equipment that if run on petrol would need to utilize ridiculously large engines + turbo. At that point a smaller turbo diesel becomes more economically feasible to both manufacture and run. And indeed, in the arena of heavy vehicles and equipment diesels are very popular.

That's the real reason we don't get them...unequal higher taxes levied on the price of diesel fuel. Put in place by some corrupted government lobby that for whatever reason doesn't want diesels to become popular here.

It's not because diesel engines can't be designed to meet US emission standards. They CAN. Automakers just need to accept 'realistic limits' with regard to smaller displacement, expected performance, and tailpipe emissions. VW wasn't willing to work within these confines and burned themselves multi-billion dollar fines as well as punching a fresh black eye on the entire auto industry.

IIRC the higher diesel tax is because of big rigs and the way that roads are paid for in the US. Diesel trucks get better mileage than gas powered big rigs. so, they cause the same amount of wear and tear but paid less fuel tax per mile. So basically they raised diesel tax in the early 2000's to correct that. We've having the same problem with high mpg gas (petrol/benzine) vehicles. Higher mpg = less $ per mile in fuel taxes. I was reading an article awhile back about how "they" were considering leveing higher taxes on hybrid vehicles because they weren't paying their fair share of road taxes. Either way with the increasing mpg standards taxes will be coming up on fuel. Either that or more gravel roads! Hahaha!

I would buy a diesel car. I was going to buy a VW tdi and then... Well you know...
Sorry for the thread jack! I'm excited to learn more about diesel Volvo's!

[WhatAmIDoing]

IIRC the higher diesel tax is because of big rigs and the way that roads are paid for in the US. Diesel trucks get better mileage than gas powered big rigs. so, they cause the same amount of wear and tear but paid less fuel tax per mile. So basically they raised diesel tax in the early 2000's to correct that. We've having the same problem with high mpg gas (petrol/benzine) vehicles. Higher mpg = less $ per mile in fuel taxes. I was reading an article awhile back about how "they" were considering leveing higher taxes on hybrid vehicles because they weren't paying their fair share of road taxes. Either way with the increasing mpg standards taxes will be coming up on fuel. Either that or more gravel roads! Hahaha!

I would buy a diesel car. I was going to buy a VW tdi and then... Well you know...
Sorry for the thread jack! I'm excited to learn more about diesel Volvo's!

Don't forget about toll roads. Because the gas tax wasn't bad enough, now it costs $20/day to commute to work.

I definitely recall seeing an 850 with a Volvo D5 engine somewhere at a car show in Ontario. Wonder what that swap entails.