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Another Anti-Skid Question

Help, Advice, Owners' Discussion and DIY Tutorials on Volvo XC90s. The XC90 proved to be very popular, and very good for Volvo's sales numbers, since its introduction in model year 2003 (North America).
352pro
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352pro

Another Anti-Skid Question

Post by 352pro » Fri Jan 04, 2019 6:00 pm

Hello. Thank you in advance for anyone who will try to help me with an "Anti-Skid Service Required" issue. I have attempted to solve the issue by reading archived discussions on the topic, but I have been unable to make any progress. Here are the basics:

-2008 XC90 3.2 AWD
- Anti-skid message came on at 78,000 miles. Vehicle now has 150,000 miles.
- All wheel drive stopped working when the message came on. Power is only delivered to the front two wheels.
- I inspected under the passenger seat to see if there were signs of water intrusion from clogged sunroof drains. There is no sign of water entering the area under the passenger seat directly below the stereo amplifier.
- Regardless, I changed the yaw rate sensor. Changing the sensor did not fix the problem.

I then brought it to the Volvo dealer and they told me that the culprit was most likely a steering column sensor, but that they could not say for sure. I then brought it to a local Volvo mechanic specialist with 40+ years experience. He too detected a steering column sensor error message, but he was able to clear code and the code has not surface again (thank God and this community that I didn't pay Volvo an arm and a leg for something I apparently did not need).

The specialist spent a good amount of time with my car as it was hooked up to his diagnostic machine. He was unable to clear a code for the rear differential in that the code would come back up after a few seconds. He then determined the following to correct the problem: Replace the entire rear axle. He said this must be done for the following reasons:

- The sensor in the rear differential is not communicating with the drivetrain and is therefore not sending power to the rear wheels.
- The sensor cannot be serviced on my model.

Though the specialist has a ton of experience, I am not confident that he is correct regarding the need to replace the entire rear axle. Your thoughts are super appreciated. I absolutely love this car and want her to run with all four legs! Cheers.



Masscomguru
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Masscomguru

Re: Another Anti-Skid Question

Post by Masscomguru » Fri Jan 04, 2019 7:05 pm

There is either a bad Haldex pump (happened to me) or the DEM. Both are replaceable, reparable. First thing to check is the fuse. Here’s a good thread. https://forums.swedespeed.com/showthrea ... Haldex+dem



352pro
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352pro

Re: Another Anti-Skid Question

Post by 352pro » Fri Jan 04, 2019 7:48 pm

Fantastic! Thank you. This is a very helpful place for me to start. Super appreciated my friend.



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Re: Another Anti-Skid Question

Post by cn90 » Fri Jan 04, 2019 10:03 pm

In my case, it is probably clockspring issue.
I just left it alone and never fix it.
Search forum and you will know why...


2004 V70 2.5T 100K+
2005 XC90 2.5T 110K+

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ggleavitt
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ggleavitt

Re: Another Anti-Skid Question

Post by ggleavitt » Sat Jan 05, 2019 3:56 pm

I'm guessing these are two different problems but the best way to figure it out is to post the Volvo codes (DEM-xxxx, BCM-xxxx, anything else) and folks can take a look at what the car itself is suggesting is wrong.

You noted the SAS code went away, it may or may not come back. I'm not 100% sure that when you trigger an SAS code that you'll lose the Haldex, I thought it was just that you would get some codes, an antiskid light/message, and the DSTC gets disabled (default to STC?). I might be wrong about this, would be happy if someone could confirm, specific to the XC90.

Having a broken AWD in an XC90 is no fun in my personal opinion. If the problem is the Haldex (aka AOC clutch) as Masscomguru's experience suggests, it’s often reported as DEM and/or the pump, but usually not the entire unit. The AOC clutch (PN 36000565, exch) is specific to the XC90 05-08 for V8 and 07-08 for 3.2, I’m “guessing” it's a Gen III so if at some point the entire AOC unit needs replaced, grab used from any car noted previously. The pressure sensor 30759668 can also be replaced separately for this version of Haldex (needs kit 30783288) if it’s part of the problem.

Xemodex has a troubleshooting flow chart for a variety of models and issues https://xemodex.com/us/diagnostic-flow-charts/ , I had to use Firefox to get the files to display. If the DEM flowchart has not already been followed, would not hurt to do so. It’s pretty rudimentary but will omit REM power and pump as an issue. Xemodex repairs these units as well, I’ve used them before with great satisfaction and they have excellent turn-around times if it's a send-in. If the problem is the DEM, you could look around for a used module but this thread- https://forums.swedespeed.com/showthrea ... n-3-Haldex reminded me that they are usually in short supply anywhere close to cheap.

Regardless, the Volvo codes are pretty integral to resolution of your problem (you’re “guessing” otherwise), if you can find them please post and someone can try and help above and beyond what’s already been suggested.

This brings up the opportunity to remind folks that there is no such thing as a "lifetime fluid" on this car, regardless as to what might ever be said or written. No such thing.

Haldex fluid replacement intervals may vary in folk's minds but at some point the fluid starts to degrade and will get the filter and/or pump, pressure switch and/or solenoid gunked up. Some other car models using pretty much the same Haldex unit swap out their fluid at 30-50k mile intervals (I do 50-60k), Volvo maintenance documentation does not call out the AOC fluid as a regular service item to be replaced.

Last but not least, cn90’s post on fluid changes is one of the best around, I’ve been using it for years- https://www.matthewsvolvosite.com/forum ... hp?t=64335 , it was written for an earlier model powertrain but if you use this post as a general guide then look at some threads for your specific model year transmission, angle gear D&F port and Haldex filter location variances, you’ll find the job relatively easy to perform.

1/6/19- fix typos (3x)


2005 2.5T AWD-194k
2008 V8 AWD Sport-124k

352pro
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352pro

Re: Another Anti-Skid Question

Post by 352pro » Mon Jan 07, 2019 8:46 pm

IMG-1281.JPG
This community is absolutely excellent! I appreciate all of you endlessly and I will do my part, to the best of my ability, to contribute to others' questions as well. Though I only made minute progress this weekend, I feel very optimistic that the solution to the problem is within reach. After reading Masscomguru's comment and the link provided, I decided to take a look at my fuses. Fuse #27, as shown in the attached image of the users handbook, was in a healthy state and showed no signs of being blown; however, fuse #23 (Park assist) was blown. What a great feeling it was and indeed still is to know that this blown fuse is telling me something that neither the Volvo dealership nor the Volvo specialist could tell me. Whereas the specialist was suggesting that I needed to replace the entire rear axle, but that in doing so he could not guarantee it would fix the problem, and Volvo recommended replacing all kinds of things for an enormous sum of money while simultaneously being unable to guarantee a solution, this community has been far more helpful, and for that I am super grateful.

I proceeded with replacing the blown fuse, but the fuse subsequently blew again pretty much immediately. I felt both disappointed that I could not fix the problem for the cost of a new fuse (ridiculous, I know) and excited to know that this fuse, but especially this community, is revealing the root cause of the Anti-Skid issue.

Immediately after discovering the issue with the fuse I decided to detail the car to an extreme degree and had the absolute pleasure of driving her spotless self all weekend knowing that, perhaps, I could also give her her legs back soon. Please let me know if this particular fuse closes any particular doors of potential causes and reveals anything worth exploring further.

I have made arrangements to access a car lift to replace the pump if that is the most logical thing to do. If so, I will surely document the process thoroughly for the purpose of contributing to the cause of this terrific community!

Cheers!
Last edited by 352pro on Mon Jan 07, 2019 9:15 pm, edited 6 times in total.



352pro
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352pro

Re: Another Anti-Skid Question

Post by 352pro » Mon Jan 07, 2019 8:59 pm

ggleavitt wrote:
Sat Jan 05, 2019 3:56 pm
I'm guessing these are two different problems ....

Thank you, ggleavitt, you are excellent to the max! Could you please recommend the most convenient way to access these codes? Do I need to bring it to Volvo, or is something that can be obtained from a local autoparts store that offers the service of pulling codes?

You noted the SAS code went away, it may or may not come back....

Does SAS code refer to the steering column code I had been dealing with?

Having a broken AWD in an XC90 is no fun in my personal opinion. If the problem is the Haldex...

This is incredibly, I mean absolutely helpful! Thank you so much!

Xemodex has a troubleshooting flow chart for a variety of models and issues ...

Thank you! I will look into this thoroughly in the coming days. I am super appreciative of you taking the time to provide me and the community with such detailed reference material and resources for a solution!

Regardless, the Volvo codes are pretty integral...

Thank you. I will provide the codes as soon as possible.

This brings up the opportunity to remind folks that there is no such thing as a "lifetime fluid" on this car, regardless as to what might ever be said or written. No such thing.

Confirmation indeed. I remain perplexed by Volvo's recommended intervals.

Haldex fluid replacement intervals may vary in folk's minds but....

Yes! I also find it revealing that they vary their recommendations on the basis of how much demand is placed on the car (i.e., whether or not the car is used to pull a trailer). I mean, I just want to show this car as much love as possible. Please take this into consideration, Volvo engineers and technical writers!

Last but not least, cn90’s post on fluid changes is one of the best around, I’ve been using it for years....

You get a full and complete bow of appreciation, my friend. Thank you!

1/6/19- fix typos (3x)



352pro
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352pro

Re: Another Anti-Skid Question

Post by 352pro » Mon Jan 07, 2019 9:09 pm

cn90 wrote:
Fri Jan 04, 2019 10:03 pm
In my case, it is probably clockspring issue.
I just left it alone and never fix it.
Search forum and you will know why...
Very much appreciate your thoughts! I will check it out. Thank you!!!!



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ggleavitt

Re: Another Anti-Skid Question

Post by ggleavitt » Tue Jan 08, 2019 4:04 pm

Volvo specific code reader, this will require a Volvo VIDA/DICE or another unit which is designed to interpret the Volvo module level (BCM-, ECM-, DEM- as examples) error codes. Someone on the forums is probably aware of other "Volvo" code readers by name and can offer suggestions, I am only familiar with VIDA/DICE.

Most auto parts store readers will produce a generic P-code and that probably won't get to the bottom of your AWD specific issue, dealer for sure but a good independent who specializes in Volvos should also have something compatible to read your car. See if whoever you've visited already can give you an idea as to what the car reported at the time they did the work if you cannot get the car re-read. I suspect there's a BCM something and/or a DEM something being actively reported but get every code that you can, with or without event history.

I believe AOC driveline flange comes off for GEN III if you're replacing the pump, at least that's the way it's documented in VIDA. One write-up on the different Haldex versions and service component locations/instructions is here https://forums.swedespeed.com/showthrea ... t-the-same , there are some links inside the thread for additional visuals.

**My apologies for the cross-site link posting. This information may also be in MVS, I did not see anything similar to what I'm linking at first glance before writing. I'll always try and use what's on this site first, if folks see something obvious where I'm double-posting, please let me know and I'll fix it.
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352pro


2005 2.5T AWD-194k
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352pro
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352pro

Re: Another Anti-Skid Question

Post by 352pro » Wed Mar 06, 2019 6:22 pm

I apologize for the delayed replay, as I was only able to bring my XC90 in today to have it inspected by a Volvo dealership to help me identify the cause of the Anti-Skid message. After going over the entire car, the dealership determined that the only thing wrong with the car is the steering wheel column sensor. They were certain that changing the sensor would correct the problem, so I will explore this solution in depth and will keep the forum posted on the outcome. Assuming I do make the change myself, I will be sure to document the job as thoroughly as possible to contribute to this wonderful forum. I appreciate all of your very much!



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