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Vacuum hose to banjo bolt broke, where and what does it do?

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abscate
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Re: Vacuum hose to banjo bolt broke, where and what does it do?

Post by abscate »

cn90 wrote: 02 Dec 2019, 17:18 To revisit this issue of the Black Hose. Sure I can buy the T6 kit ($40) as June posted above and use only the black plastic hose, which is a waste of money for something like this...

I need someone to help me with actual measurement of the hose itself (not the barb fitting).
- I.D. = ___?; O.D. = ___?
- I see white plastic hose sold at Ace Hardware, the stuff used for fridge water line, for about $0.50/foot.
Is this hose (used for fridge water supply) a good idea?
- How about regular rubber hose (which I have at home), can it handle vacuum under boost without collapsing inward?
That line will be under pressure when boost is on, and under vacuum when the car is on overrun - just like the Purge system, Volvo designed a way to clear the PCV box under both conditions

I think it needs to be pretty rigid to perform that function, as long as you secure both ends well, though, a number of fairly thick wall hoses should work as long as they are oil resistant.
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Post by cn90 »

I am just curious, if the factory design is the "crankcase pressure is on when boost is on", then it will blow out the seals?
No? Just an engineering question...
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Post by abscate »

If I can get to my old parts bin in the shed this holiday I might have this part still.

This is a tough application as this hose sees both vacuum and boost during operation, so cheap flexible hose won’t work. Fridge feeder hose might work if you bond it to the fittings.

At $25 bucks an hour self-rate, though, that $40 kit looks attractive. It’s not a $400 bmw part

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Post by June »

cn90 wrote: 02 Dec 2019, 17:18 To revisit this issue of the Black Hose. Sure I can buy the T6 kit ($40) as June posted above and use only the black plastic hose, which is a waste of money for something like this...

I need someone to help me with actual measurement of the hose itself (not the barb fitting).
- I.D. = ___?; O.D. = ___?
- I see white plastic hose sold at Ace Hardware, the stuff used for fridge water line, for about $0.50/foot.
Is this hose (used for fridge water supply) a good idea?
- How about regular rubber hose (which I have at home), can it handle vacuum under boost without collapsing inward?
If you get something from the hardware store to work, take lots of pictures and exact measurements and if course post them here! Volvo does ask a premium for their parts. Shortly after replacing the PCV that started this thread, the rear main seal started leaking anyway.

I picked the car up yesterday and one more of the hose assemblies under the intake manifold was replaced due to cracked hose causing a purge valve code and a vacuum leak. I still have the weird metal line with the coolant and vacuum lines waiting to cause issue... :o June
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Post by cn90 »

- Just broke the hard plastic hose on the 2007 S60 with 115K. I think during removal of the 17-mm banjo bolt,
the banjo side was twisted and broke, otherwise that hard plastic pipe seems to be fine.

- For now, I am using a Gates 4219XL (I.D. = 6.0 mm) fuel hose and slide over the broken ends. It is a tight fit and seems to be fine.

Anyway, this Gates hose is a Godsend. It fits perfectly.
And it is very thick-walled, I don't think it will collapse or blow under pressure.

- Does anyone know the highest pressure that a Turbo can generate for this hose?

- Here is a sketch of my current setup:

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Hose.jpg
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Last edited by cn90 on 23 Mar 2022, 10:28, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by cn90 »

abscate wrote:...That line will be under pressure when boost is on, and under vacuum when the car is on overrun - just like the Purge system, Volvo designed a way to clear the PCV box under both conditions...
Hi @abscate,

I just want to clarify this point. I believe the plastic pipe only sees vacuum, not pressure.
I have a brand-new banjo bolt, so...

- The banjo bolt with check-valve. Some early versions had no check valve: not good bc boost can increase
crankcase pressure, which itself should be negative (under some vacuum), not positive pressure.

- The check valve is just a piece of steel that falls by gravity. Testing the new banjo bolt: when I suck
on the threaded end of the banjo bolt (the I.M. side), it allows me to suck air in. When I blow air into the threaded
end, it blocks the air flow bc the check valve falls down by gravity and blocks the air flow.

- To summarize it:

1. During normal operation or deceleration: the I.M. is under vacuum and it sucks air from crankcase
into I.M.

2. During boost, the I.M. pressure is positive, the check valve prevents air from entering the crankcase,
which makes perfect sense.

Anyway, this proves the point that a thick-wall fuel hose should be fine for the repair of broken plastic pipe.
I will use the fuel hose as a repair with some clamps over the broken ends of the plastic pipe.

This is a photo I sketched to show the flow of air in the PCV system: GREEN = normal flow; RED = boost phase ---> there is no air blowing back into crankcase.

HTH...

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PCV-Valve.jpg
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Last edited by cn90 on 29 Mar 2022, 16:45, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by cn90 »

I borrowed a photo from Swedespeed forum to show the way people fix this problem:

- A hose spanning the broken ends of the hard plastic pipe.

- Here you can see a rubber hose + green clamp...

- For those who want to do this patch work of broken plastic pipe using fuel hose...

1. Gates 4219XL (look for hose with I.D. = 6.0 mm) is the ticket or any fuel hose with I.D. = 1/4 inches or ~ 6mm is fine. The O.D. of this hose will be ~ 12 mm.

2. The spring clamp you see in the photo below is available at Ace Hardware for $0.49/ea.
Look for "spring clamp for 7/16-inch hose" (which is designed for hose with O.D. = 11 mm).
The actual diameter of this spring clamp from the store is 10 mm, so it can clamp a hose with O.D. = 11 mm or 12 mm.

I tried and it works perfectly.

PS: I think it is best to leave some hard plastic pipe alone. In other words, don't try to remove the hard plastic pipe,
you risk damaging the plastic nipple on the other end. In the event that you succesfully remove the hard plastic pipe, then use appropriate fuel hose with correct I.D. = 3.5 mm or so.
I find it easier to leave some hard plastic pipe intact and just slide the hose with I.D. = 6 mm over, as mentioned above.


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Post by cn90 »

Minor update,

For the Gates Fuel Hose I mentioned above: Gates 4219XL with I.D. = 1/4" (~ 6 mm), the
spring clamp that works perfectly is 1/2-inch spring clamp as shown below.

Anyway, the size of the spring clamp depends on the O.D. of the fuel hose.
If the O.D. of your fuel hose is smaller, then use smaller spring clamp such as 7/16" type.

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Volvo-PCV-Hose.jpg
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Post by cn90 »

Just a quick update on the Gates Fuel Hose I did above for the vacuum line. A few hundred miles later, it works fine, zero issues...
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Post by Kanihinaha »

Same question but asked in a different forum.
I got 2 separate answers, one said 4 mm, the other said 3 mm.
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