Suspension Noise- Dump of thoughts welcome

[scot850]

Sorry can't answer the question as it was the only part not returned so none the wiser.

What I can tell you is that after about 20 miles the noise is back and getting back to it's vocal self. So everything has been replaced at least once. Even checked the part number of the Bilstein Touring shock as the part number of mine is not what is listed on FCP for my car. Turns out has had the part number changed.

To date:

1) 3 times anti-sway bars. IPD HD was on the car when bought. Replaced the bushes twice, first with IPD new mounts and then with Energy Suspension greasable boots with a grease nipple. Still the same. Swapped the Anti-sway bar for what looked like a really good non-floppy bar from a 2000 V70XC. The bar is actually slightly thinker than 'R' at 21.5mm v's 20 of the R v's 25 of IPD HD.

2) Endlinks - Volvo-IPD HD -Meyle HD - Volvo

3) Shocks - Only one change due to broken valve on a Bilstein HD that was fitted by PO. Far too hard for roads here so went to Bilstein Touring

4) Spring Seat - IPD HD

5) Top bearing plate - Sachs (OEM) from IPD.

This car continues to be an endless pain in the A$$.

I guess next think is to pull the RH strut and disassemble it to see if I can find anything wrong with it like the spring is moving or the bearing plate is bad whatever...

Stupid cars..

Neil.

[theWIFES_S70]

Yeah... i know what you mean. There's so much we love about oir car, but noises that can't be pinpointed are aggravating! I was thinking about leaving it be, but it's starting to get worse... Sigh!

I bought new KYB struts, OE XC90 spring seats and OE strut bearings to replace my Gabriel Readymounts. They've done about 12K over 2+ years in NYC, I hope they're the cause of this noise. Now I just need to find the time to do it all. And the power steering is a little funny, I wonder if these things are related... Oh well.

Have a good weekend, Neil!

[scot850]

Had a look at the RSF corner again today. Up until now I have not been able to replicate the noise with the car stationary, but today with the steering turned to the left, I was able to get the clunk/groan to happen. Problem was I asked my son to bounce the car on that corner so I could try to figure out where it was coming from, and he is not strong enough and weighs way less than me, so I bounced the car and he tried to feel the vibration. He could feel it through the anti-sway bar and end link.

I jacked the car up and removed the wheel and then carefully jacked the RH control arm with a jack (car was supported on an axle stand under the sub-frame). Again was able to get a noise. Removed the new Volvo end-link at the top fitting and looked at the mounting face on the plate on the Bilstien strut. Not impressed as it looks like the 2 plates the end-link stub goes through has a gap between them and it looked like the 2 parts were pulling together in the middle causing it to have a concave. This would mean the nut would only touch on the outer edges. I ground it flat and tried again but no different.

Decided to look elsewhere and found there is a vibration between the RHR sub-frame mount when the suspension is jacked on that side. I think the bush has collapsed and that may be the issue. I did ask the dealer to check that last year when they re-aligned the sub-frame (breaking the radiator top pipe) and they said it was good, but not convinced they actually checked it.

I think the next thing is to replace the sub-frame bushes and see if that is the issue after all.

What I am curious about is there looks like there is grease around where the body meets the bush, and also a large washer. Weird thing is I can find no pictures with that washer in there and no reference in Vida either. Looks like the bush should mount directly to the bottom of the car with the rubber touching there. Need to go check it again.

Still don't like the look of the front coil springs either. Looks like the top coil is wider than the others. Even with no weight on the strut, the springs bend in towards the inner fender. No idea if the springs are OE or aftermarket.

Neil.

[scot850]

So here are differences between the 2000 V70R AWD and the V70 NA FWD. Didn't know there was a difference, but the AWD would appear to use a spacer between the bushes and the main vehicle frame:

V70R AWD rear subframe mount with spacer

Sub-frame pictures P80 006.JPG (3.05 MiB) Viewed 1666 times

V70 NA base model rear subframe mount with no spacer

Sub-frame pictures P80 007.JPG (2.76 MiB) Viewed 1666 times

Not sure why the spacer is needed on the AWD, but the sub-frame bushes appear to be the same. Volvo used to list 2 types of sub-frame bushes with different part numbers. Strangely they used 3 x # 3507923 and 1 x # 3507924. I'm not sure what the difference is but think the 24 version had an oval hole and the 23 has a round hole in the bush. I'm guessing this was to aid alignment.

Noe the 24 part # has been superseded by the 23 part number so now it would appear to use 4 of the same part.

Not sure this helps anyone, but it may in the future.

Neil.

[theWIFES_S70]

I wonder what that spacer does. Is it metal? If so, I could definitely see it creating a rubbing sound.

I'm more curious about your comment about some grease that you discovered. Where was it?

This is what I found when I did my subframe bushings...

[scot850]

The picture of the spacer is from the LHS rear mount. The RHS rear mount i the one I can feel movement in and the grease looks like a thick green aqualube and it is between the spacer and the floor above it. Not sure why it would be there.

Only reason for the spacer I can think of is because perhaps the AWD needs to drop the engine assembly slightly to allow the prop-shaft the correct angle for clearing the underside of the car?

Neil.

[scot850]

Well finally got the call from the dealer that they believe this time the suspension groan is fixed. Surprisingly, they came to the same conclusion as I had it was a bad RHR front sub-frame bush. They removed the sub-frame and used the special Volvo cutter to remove the old bushes. Strangely (financially?) they left the suspect one until last, and when they tried to use the cutter they found the bush just spun in the sub-frame! So probably $3500 later they say the problem is fixed. My issue is of course I am expected to pay for another alignment after the last one was done following the replacement of the end-links and the control arms (none which were needed). So not eh car has new OE 4 bolt front control arms, new OE end-links, new OE anti-sway bar and all 4 sub-frame bushes. The foreman has been given my authorisation to take the car home and back tomorrow to ensure no issues re-occur, as the last time they said it was fixed, it started groaning again by the time I got home.

Tomorrow we have the conversation on the 2 x alignments (actually 3 x as they did the one they forgot last year after realigning the sub-frame that they fitted wrongly last time).

This car has had more alignments than any car I have ever owned!

Neil.

[theWIFES_S70]

This car has had more alignments than any car I have ever owned!

Neil, this is the first reported case of a OE Volvo subframe bushing going bad so quickly! Ahhhh! I put in XC90s two years ago, maybe one went bad? I have to get an inspection in a month I might throw this at my indy if the new spring seats doesn't fix it... #kerflunks4eva

[scot850]

Maybe you misunderstood, the bush is the original from new so 17 years and 165,000 miles old. However it is strange that one failed and the other 3 were OK. Like everything else on that car, it is just a pain. I'm not surprised at this age and mileage they need done, but what would have been better if they listened to me in the first place and looked at the bushes and that would have saved me about $2000 in parts and labour.

Neil.

[theWIFES_S70]

Oh, my mistake. Well, glad you figured out your suspension noise, Neil! 17 years is what you're supposed to get out of a subframe bushing! When I replaced mine, one fell out as soon as I removed the bolt. You really never know with those things.