New to Volvos, 97 850 base, a few issues

Brewmaster · Post by **Brewmaster** » 09 Feb 2010, 18:57

Hey there, Mr. New Guy here. I recently acquired this 97 850 as an (interim?) replacement for my SPG. It's a decent car, albeit slightly under-maintained and really just not what I'm used to (but that's beside the point.) Black w/tan leather interior, N/A, autotragic, 130k (or so the papers say.) It has some issues tho, and I have some questions about it too. Let's start with the issues:

Other than the standard (secondary air pump, rear main seal, etc.),
ABS light - comes on and off of its own volition, sometimes the pedal will vibrate for no reason. No clue with this one.
CHMSL - It will work if I unplug the bulb and put it back in, as long as I don't start the car. If I do, it'll work twice before stopping. Also I notice that the brake lights get real bright, then dim pretty drastically when the bulb actually works. Gonna take a multimeter to it sometime soon.
Sunroof - will open just fine, but closing is a 2 hour ordeal as the driver side won't move without major pressure.
Driver mirror - I think it's heated, the passenger is, but it doesn't do anything.
Performance in general - it just seems anemic. For 168 hp, I have a hard time accelerating to freeway speeds (did the airbox tstat mod, helped a bit but still feels weak)

Question:
Does 22 mpg mixed (70h/30c) sound about normal? Seems like it guzzles a bit for the power it makes...

Not really looking to you guys for the quick fixes for all the issues, just wondering if anyone's run into these and may have some helpful hints. Thanks

Post by **kcodyjr** » 09 Feb 2010, 19:38

ABS - failed controller. There was a manufacturing defect in all of them, cold solder joints on the heavier pins. There's a thread about how to take it apart and reflow the joints. I've just been ignoring it in mine, I dislike ABS.

CHMSL - that sounds really odd, I'd start with looking for an intermittent short in the wiring.

Sunroof - sounds like a physical jam or need for lube in the tracks.

Performance - expect to have to stand on it getting on the freeway. Still, check plugs, cap, rotor, wires, coil, air filter, etc etc.; the K&N air filter for the factory box is a big help.

Note: Don't use fancy spark plugs. They really want the OEM copper ones that have a wide temperature range. I think Motorcraft and Champion make an acceptable equivalent substitute, try searching around on the forums. It's a frequent topic.

Is the Check Engine Light on? Even if not, try connecting an OBDII reader anyway. Pulling codes is your best diagnostic friend with these.

That mileage seems a hair low for mostly highway, but not grossly so. Could just be your city driving is particularly burdensome.

- Kevin

Brewmaster · Post by **Brewmaster** » 09 Feb 2010, 20:22

Cool thanks. I'll search for the ABS etc (if I end up selling the car, I won't do it with lights on the dash) and see what I can figure up.

And yeah it does have a CEL - I pulled it a while ago and the code was (I can't remember but it showed proof that the secondary air pump was shot)

Post by **jblackburn** » 09 Feb 2010, 21:27

Check the computer for ABS codes and check your wheels sensors before assuming the module itself is bad. I had a loose connection to the right wheel sensor dislodged by snow that turned my light on.

I saw a car with a sunroof that did exactly that as you describe. I'd look to see if it has come off-track. Pull it back slightly and tug forward on it firmly on both left & right ends. Mine has jammed on something a few times that I don't even see in the track, and a good slam has fixed it to this day.

For the air pump, there is a write-up here to fit a VW air pump to the original Volvo assembly, and save yourself quite a bit of $.

The heated mirror might be easier fixed just by buying a new assembly, or getting one from a junkyard.

If you haven't, look up the '960 throttle plate mod' for the 850. It will give you a bit more pep than the standard 850 plate.

That's sad to hear about your Saab - I had an 85 (definitely no SPG, I had the no-frills 8V version) that I loved dearly but couldn't find a replacement engine for. Those things will live on forever!

Post by **kcodyjr** » 09 Feb 2010, 21:53

Fair enough about checking the ABS codes first; however I'd give betting odds that the ABS module has cold solder joints, whether or not they've broken contact yet. A manufacturing defect will almost definitely show symptoms eventually, and they never fixed it so there are no good years.

Don't assume the pump is shot either, you may have a cracked hose or elbow that is making the computer -think- the pump is useless. That said, they are also known to go. The difference is that buying a new pump solves the problem, but another ABS module will have the same flaw as the one you're replacing.

There is some dissent about the throttle plate mod; seems to me it should give a slight improvement at peak power, at the cost of being easier to spin 'em in sandy parking lots. I was going to do it to my NA but not my 97 GLT.

I wonder if some enterprising high-quality parts distributor in Connecticut could track down a replacement throttle cam that would open slower in the first few degrees off idle?

I wouldn't sell that car unless there's something about it you really just don't like. 96, 97, 98 were the golden years of the 850 platform. I'm told 95 and prior had more maintenance issues, 93 especially, and 99 introduced the accursed electronic throttle system. Come to think of it, even if it is for some reason distasteful to you, personally I'd save it until someone in the family is up for their first car.

-Kevin

Post by **jblackburn** » 09 Feb 2010, 22:01

I was going to do it to my NA but not my 97 GLT.

I THINK the turbo plates are different from the N/A's anyway, but I'm not actually sure about the GLT model. That might be interesting to find out for yourself if you're ever in there cleaning it. Nothing can spin tires as easily as our blasted Honda does in snow anyway. Big car + lightweight, rev-happy engine = no traction.

Look up Vic Rocha's site for more information on the ABS module

Post by **kcodyjr** » 09 Feb 2010, 22:12

Yeah, GLT has been a pain in the butt like that. Most websites give you two choices; 2.3T or 2.4NA. Kinda leaves me guessing for most engine stuff, especially induction and exhaust.

Sounds like your Honda wants some snowshoes...

My first car, an '81 turbo coupe, had oversize tires on the rear and still lit 'em up off the line, whether you wanted to or not, if the road was wet. Hill starts in the rain weren't easy with that heavy clutch. Let's not get started on the 240's snow performance.

- Kevin

Brewmaster · Post by **Brewmaster** » 10 Feb 2010, 08:34

Now it's not that I hate the car, it's just not anything like I'm used to. Personal preference entirely, I like the lightweight cars that are awkward enough to turn heads. People would still crane their necks when my 23 year old Saab would spool up and fly by! It's a good utilitarian car, but I don't think it will last another 18+ years in my care. Maybe if it was a T5...

As for the pump, I'm certain it's shot. We had a very wet summer (which I'm told is when the CEL came on) and the intake tube is rusted clear through.

Pull it back slightly and tug forward on it firmly on both left & right ends. Mine has jammed on something a few times that I don't even see in the track, and a good slam has fixed it to this day.

How do you move that thing by hand?! Maybe this is my problem but I can't get that thing to budge without using the button.

Post by **kcodyjr** » 10 Feb 2010, 08:48

Utiliarian, yes. Underpowered, yes. Comfy though, and if there's such a thing as a an anti-cop-magnet (cop repulsor?), this is surely it.

Also very unlikely to attract members of the opposite sex, which is a good thing especially for a daughter or niece. Then again, I remember seeing a photo of a black 850 wagon with the telltale marks in the dust from someone being bent over the hood. Then again again, the hand and breast prints didn't look like they moved, so it was probably just a pose for the camera. See? Photographic proof that someone got laid with a Volvo, and still nobody believes it.

It could very well last 18 years, being the NA model. These cars were not particularly rust prone and those engines are all but bulletproof, -if- you stay on top of the maintenance.

My old man gave me an '81 turbo coupe for my first car, with predictable results, both for the fact of the crash and my odds of walking away. For what it's worth that car never got me laid either.

Saab to me, is a strange animal but a good one. Who puts the ignition switch between the seats??!! I imagine you feel the same way. Who puts the window controls between the seats??!!

At least it's the "other" Nordic car. From either perspective.

- Kevin

Post by **jblackburn** » 10 Feb 2010, 09:24

Electrical problems will eventually start to drive you crazy with the Volvo, but my Saab was no different. It's every bit as tempermental as that Saab was...things work exactly when THEY want to, and there is nothing you can do to convince it otherwise. Somehow, I never had a single electrical issue in the 3 years of owning an 88 Honda...just purely every mechanical issue short of the engine itself imaginable...

My girlfriend absolutely loves my Volvo, I don't know what you're talking about. It's our designated "trip" car too, even though her Honda gets nearly twice the gas mileage of mine. Maybe it's the color

My sunroof has come off track pulling back into the roof and gone slightly cockeyed...I was able to get it back on track once by tugging on it, and the second time I actually stood through the opening and slamming it with my shoulder (ouch). Look for things stuck in the tracks...leaves and all kinds of things will get back in there. If you can't see anything, some silicone grease in the tracks might help. Hopefully you won't have to go as far as actually removing the glass and having a look inside.