No start, no spark? I'm thinking ignition coil...

850_GLT_Owner · Post by **850_GLT_Owner** » 19 Feb 2011, 16:05

97 850R. This started yesterday. I was going to replace my spark plugs, but was delayed removing some of the torx screws that hold down the spark plug cap. I ran out of daylight and left it for today, but i didn't tighten those screws down all the way, but the cap should have been secured. I started my car fine after that, and again later at night. It then started to rain. I started the car up again, and within 10-15 seconds, the car died, and hasn't started since. It wasn't raining too hard, but I assumed thats what caused the problem.

Today I still couldn't start the car. It cranks, so i don't think its the starter, but thats all it does. Not even a hint of it igniting. I opened the hood, and the ignition wire had popped off.The ignition wire had greenish white (electrical corrosion?) stuff on it, I wire brushed it, and plugged it back in. Still the same symptoms.

Luckily, i was planning on doing the cap and rotor also. So today, I replaced the cap, rotor, and the plugs. There was oil under the spark plug cover, especially near oil filler cap(which i will replace). After all was said and done, there was nothing different except the battery sounded weaker because of my stubborn cranking of the engine.

I hear the fuel pump engaging. Even after I remove the key, i still hear it working for at least 20 seconds(is that normal?).

A few weeks ago i replaced the crankshaft position sensor because of a code. I also had a code of cylinder 1 and 5 misfiring when i checked it. No camshaft code. Does this sound like a bad ignition coil to anyone? I have a 93 850 in my driveway that I replaced with the newer R, so i'm going to try to replace the ignition coil with the one from the 93(part numbers match) to see if it is the problem. But before I do, how can i test to confirm the ignition coil is the problem? Is it as easy of a job as it seems? Could the ignition coil failing cause the plug to pop off the distributor cap, or could the combination of moisture plus the plug being off cause a short/fry the ignition?

Thanks

Post by **misha** » 19 Feb 2011, 16:25

850_GLT_Owner wrote:I hear the fuel pump engaging. Even after I remove the key, i still hear it working for at least 20 seconds(is that normal?).

No that is NOT normal.

When you turn the key to position II you should hear the fuel pump for about 2 seconds (that's called priming).

Post by **BEJinFbk** » 19 Feb 2011, 17:46

Why blame the coil when you haven't really messed with it?
Have you even checked for spark? Coils rarely fail.
With fresh wires, look for a spark from the coil output.
And I'd suggest replacing rotor, cap, plugs and wires all at once.
And from all accounts out there, stick with OEM Bougicord wires.

Post by **precopster** » 19 Feb 2011, 20:04

What you are probably hearing is the electric antenna. If unsure remove the radio fuse and see if the same noise exists.

Does the Schraeder valve at the fuel rail have pressure. Remove the throttle cover, then unscrew the valve cap and press it. Fuel should squirt.

I would most likely be looking in the direction of wires. Use Bougicord only.

850_GLT_Owner · Post by **850_GLT_Owner** » 19 Feb 2011, 23:47

Could wires just all suddenly fail like that? It was running fine until the ignition wire popped off the distributor, thats why i was thinking it could have fried something in the ignition coil, especially because of the wet weather. How can i safely test the spark off of the ignition? I'm in a good place because i can just pull of known working parts off of my white 93 850(which i'm parting out(bad RMS)), if anyone is interested, first come first serve

) and use that to diagnose the problem. I'll test the spark, if that works i will change out the plugs with the old ones until i get the new bouci's.

Post by **jblackburn** » 19 Feb 2011, 23:52

Steal that and the wires from the 93 and see what happens

I've never heard of a wire blowing off on its own.

850_GLT_Owner · Post by **850_GLT_Owner** » 20 Feb 2011, 11:39

Swapped out the wires, no dice. How can i test my spark from the ignition coil? So far I've replaced the spark plugs, wires(old,but definitely working), cap, rotor, and the ignition cable(old but working). The ignition plug on my distributor cap popped off due to stress from the air box. I had removed my air box when doing the crank sensor, and must have put it back on and stressed the connection, causing it eventually to fall off(which just happened to be when it was raining, maybe assisted by the moisture). It was working very well until the ignition cable popped off. Since then I've replaced everything that has to do with spark from the ignition coil wire plug down to the spark plugs, and there has been no change in how the car sounds when cranking.

I got fuel out of the schraeder valve, not sure how much there is supposed to be but there was definitely some there. The buzzing sound that i hear after the key is out of the ignition is around the schraeder valve, under the throttle cover, definitely not the antenna, i know that sound.

How can i test the spark at the coil? If there is no spark at the coil, what else could it be that is causing that(I have a new battery) Could the crank/camshaft sensors cause no spark? I'm going to check for human error on my part, maybe i didn't tighten down the crankshaft sensor or something.

Post by **jblackburn** » 20 Feb 2011, 11:46

Crank the car and ground the distributor end of the ignition coil cable to something metal.

If there's no dice there, swap coils. If still nothing, let us know - you will have to pull out a multimeter and start testing things.

850_GLT_Owner · Post by **850_GLT_Owner** » 20 Feb 2011, 15:19

No spark off of the ignition coil. Replaced it with my old ignition coil(93) and it fired right up. All good i thought, but then I noticed it was running a little rough. I shifted into reverse, and it died instantly. Now Its back to turning over and not sparking.Ugh

Post by **jblackburn** » 20 Feb 2011, 15:27

Ok, time to get out the multimeter! I would start with the crankshaft position sensor, which is located under the distributor cap here:

You should see between 200-500 ohms of resistance between the leads; if it isn't in that range, it should be replaced.

If that one tests ok, switch out the camshaft position sensors between cars. It's located here:

Make sure the sensor wires are as far as possible away from the ignition coil to distributor wire.