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1997 850R - Stumped - Boost Issue Topic is solved

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diggler30
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Year and Model: 1997 850R
Location: Puyallup, WA
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1997 850R - Stumped - Boost Issue

Post by diggler30 » Mon Jun 11, 2018 1:18 pm

Hello,

When I punch the throttle I get an overboost and then it cuts back too far and sometimes will settle on a number and sometimes will keep going back and forth a few times. Typically it will hit 19 or 20 which isn't bad but it cuts back to 13 or 14 which is horrible. It reacts different every time.

Also, if I ease into the throttle it will boost just fine with no over/under but it will settle at 17 and then the next time 18, etc, etc. Its never consistent. But the fact that I can ease into the throttle and it works great is what gives me hope haha.

Here is a list of what I have done to correct over the past 2 years:

*New Wastegate
*Vac lines
*Spark Plugs
*Wastegate adjustments (a ton of them! From backing wayyyy off until it stops to advancing a few turns)
*Tuning adjustments
*Replaced the BOV set up with the stock CBV set up
*Plug wires
*Tried different TCV's (stock, IPD, Pierburg)

I am sure there are other minor things I have tried. I dont know what else to do and its been so annoying that I get a different result every time I want to step on it and most of the time it is all over the place.

Any advice would be appreciated. I am not sure what else to do at this point. Cap and rotor? Not sure if that has anything to do with it but they were replaced a few months before the issues arose so I doubt it.

Thank you everyone for your help!!!!

Derek


1997 854R
IPD Intake
Ported/Polished Intake Manifold w/3" Throttle Body
Old IPD Strut Brace
ARD Stage 2 Tune
IPD/TME Exhaust
IPD/Koni Suspension
Manual Swap

scot850
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Re: 1997 850R - Stumped - Boost Issue

Post by scot850 » Mon Jun 11, 2018 1:35 pm

Is your car modified in any way? Larger Turbo, modified ECU, or anything else? If not, and not knowing how you are measuring the boost, your car is running way too high a boost. Standard TCV is only good to 12 psi and beyond that can be intermittent.

There is a problem with the IPD TCV that they don't tell you about. The '3 legged' TCV they sell has 2 legs on the sides opposite each other, which are fine to screw in fairly tight. HOWEVER, if you screw the one on the front wider face in too hard (more than say 3-4 rotations) you will crush the small mesh behing that and push it onto the valve preventing proper operation. I high lighted this issue to them several years ago when I had a similar issue and got a replacement FOC. Yes the front 'leg' feels loose, but they said that is how it should be.

Are you running a standard BOV or heavier springs from IPD?

Neil.


2000 V70 R - still being an endless PITA
2006 XC70
2003 Toyota 4Runner V8 Limited
2015 Kia Sportage EX-L
1993 850 GLT -Sold
1998 V70 XC - Sold
1997 Volvo 850 SE NA - Went to niece in California - Sold
2000 V70 SE NA - New project and test bed - Sold

diggler30
Posts: 52
Joined: Mon May 20, 2013 1:58 pm
Year and Model: 1997 850R
Location: Puyallup, WA
United States of America

Re: 1997 850R - Stumped - Boost Issue

Post by diggler30 » Mon Jun 11, 2018 2:04 pm

Yes, I have a Stage 2 tune from ARD (see signature for mods). Have had the same tune for 3 years now (~17psi) and it was fine before this started up. I spent some time with Robert and he put in a flat boost curve and it still danced all over so the tune is good.

As for the TCV, I am currently using the Pierburg HD unit. The IPD one did the same thing and there wasnt much of a difference between the two so I just run the Pierburg HD as that was recommended.

I am running the Forge BOV kit. I installed the stock CBV and removed the BOV and there was no change.


1997 854R
IPD Intake
Ported/Polished Intake Manifold w/3" Throttle Body
Old IPD Strut Brace
ARD Stage 2 Tune
IPD/TME Exhaust
IPD/Koni Suspension
Manual Swap

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Re: 1997 850R - Stumped - Boost Issue

Post by jimmy57 » Mon Jun 11, 2018 2:09 pm

Have you hooked a Mightyvac or other pump to wastegate directly and pumped it to see if it gets to some place and leaks? The diaphragm often has a fold and will leak when it moves. The flow rate through TCV is low so it will not cover for a leaking diaphragm.



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bmdubya1198
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Re: 1997 850R - Stumped - Boost Issue

Post by bmdubya1198 » Mon Jun 11, 2018 2:18 pm

My first suggestion would be to check the TCV, but you've already gone through a few, so that's probably not the issue.

Otherwise, you are 100% sure there are no vacuum leaks anywhere, That could cause a spiking issue (or lack of boost in your case). Is the CBV diaphragm in good shape?

Another thing I know that would affect boost would be the MAF. May be worth checking out. Also, I'm not sure about this, but maybe O2 sensor(s)?

I have a feeling my car may be doing the same, and mine is 100% stock other than a boost controller turned to about 9 PSI (it's LPT). The boost will back off a little bit under hard acceleration, which I am told is normal, but sometimes it'll only peak at like 5 PSI when I get on it while moving. I don't pay enough attention usually to say much more, as it's a daily and that hasn't bothered me. My R will be ready to take over daily racecar duties soon!


1998 V70 GLT Black/Beige 185,000 and counting
2000 V70R Venetian Red/Black 187k M56 Swapped
1988 744 Turbo M46 Beige Metallic/Beige 188k- Gone but not forgotten
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diggler30
Posts: 52
Joined: Mon May 20, 2013 1:58 pm
Year and Model: 1997 850R
Location: Puyallup, WA
United States of America

Re: 1997 850R - Stumped - Boost Issue

Post by diggler30 » Mon Jun 11, 2018 2:28 pm

It has a Blow Off Valve now, CBV is in good shape but in a drawer in my garage. Just put it in to check out if the BOV was an issue.

I did also do a MAF swap and it was the same result.

Yeah, not sure if O2 would be an issue but I would assume I would see a fault code for it.


1997 854R
IPD Intake
Ported/Polished Intake Manifold w/3" Throttle Body
Old IPD Strut Brace
ARD Stage 2 Tune
IPD/TME Exhaust
IPD/Koni Suspension
Manual Swap

gswede
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Re: 1997 850R - Stumped - Boost Issue

Post by gswede » Wed Jun 13, 2018 6:15 am

ARD WG you got on there?

I tried that WG and no matter what I did, it was to thight. Bosst spiked, TCV bled it back down, then it spiked again and so on, roller coaster boost. My fix was going back to OEM WG.
It sounds like you are boost spiking. I`d go back to stock WG and start off real loose. Thighten a turn at a time until your problem arise, then back off 1 turn.



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bmdubya1198
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Re: 1997 850R - Stumped - Boost Issue

Post by bmdubya1198 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 8:18 am

That sounds like a real possibility, especially if you're only supposed to be running 17 PSI on your tune.


1998 V70 GLT Black/Beige 185,000 and counting
2000 V70R Venetian Red/Black 187k M56 Swapped
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1999 Miata Sport 5 speed

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Re: 1997 850R - Stumped - Boost Issue

Post by erikv11 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 8:56 am

Where your first post says "New wastegate" do you actually mean you replaced the wastegate actuator? Replacing the wastegate would require replacing the turbo exhaust housing. Both of them (wastegate and WG actuator) need to work properly, of course.

It would be uncommon but I wonder if the wastegate valve itself is flopping around somehow and therefore not closing/opening consistently. Or if there is a crack in there that is especially bad when the turbo heats up etc. The wastegate itself may be the only thing you haven't actually looked at yet?


'95 854 T5-R || m4.4 || 185k
'96 855 NA || 140k
'98 V70 || T5 tune-injectors-turbo, LPT engine || 275k
'06 S60 R || 145k
gone: '96 NA 850 210k, '98 NA V70 182k, '98 NA S70 174k

diggler30
Posts: 52
Joined: Mon May 20, 2013 1:58 pm
Year and Model: 1997 850R
Location: Puyallup, WA
United States of America

Re: 1997 850R - Stumped - Boost Issue

Post by diggler30 » Wed Jun 13, 2018 1:34 pm

Thank you all for your replies.

I put the OEM wastegate back on a year ago maybe and it was doing the same thing. Maybe its time I try it again to see. And, yes its the one from ARD.

You know, I wondered about the actual Wastegate flap in the turbo myself. I was hoping to never have to remove it until I replaced it with an 18T or something. But maybe I do need to check that at some point. That is really the only thing left.

I'll do the WG swap back to stock and see what happens but I am not expecting anything. After that I guess I will have to deal with it until next years tax returns so i can buy a new turbo.


1997 854R
IPD Intake
Ported/Polished Intake Manifold w/3" Throttle Body
Old IPD Strut Brace
ARD Stage 2 Tune
IPD/TME Exhaust
IPD/Koni Suspension
Manual Swap

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