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Hybrid Mounts

Help, Advice and DIY Tutorials on Volvo's extremely popular car line -- Volvo's 1990s "bread and butter" cars -- powered by the ubiquitous and durable Volvo inline 5-cylinder engine.

1992 - 1997 850, 850 R, 850 T5-R, 850 T5, 850 GLT
1997 - 2000 S70, S70 AWD
1997 - 2000 V70, V70 AWD
1997 - 2000 V70-XC
1997 - 2004 C70

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MoVolvos
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MoVolvos

Hybrid Mounts

Post by MoVolvos » Sat May 25, 2019 3:27 pm

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Hi Everyone. Since I use to run in this forum several years ago as BKM S70 T5 I hope Matt won't mind me posting something generic here as I would like some feedback before proceeding with my experiment, thanks. The 98 S70 T5 was sold and now I have a 2003 S80 T6 and a 2008 C30 T5 V2.0.
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I am intending to make all the mounts in the S80 T6 into Hybrid Mounts of Rubber and Poly. This in hope of getting the best of all three worlds, firmness without vibration and longevity. Below is what led to wanting to build a better mouse trap besides how I intend to accomplish this with pictures. I am hoping for feedback before using the Poly for the build. Thanks.

I have been doing DIY alignments since the mid 90's. Can't remember the last time any of the cars have been on a rack. Rarely have any feathering or uneven wear. Recently did one on the T6 and the steering is now centered and drives straight on the freeway for some distance without hands on the steering on a fairly flat road. It will wander slowly as the road begins to pitch. Toe is probably 1/16 inch toed in and the tires are almost new.

There is however a slight pulled of the steering to the left for a split second when moving from a stop. I suspect it could be the lower control arm bushing as most the mounts except the transmission torque mount looks pretty good. It could potentially be the sub-frames bushings also. The thought of removing the bolts on the driver's side control arm front bushing just wasn't appetizing as the Trans-Pan is almost next to it. Seems like you have to jack the engine up a little to get to it. I thought of what I can do to maybe insert some spacers into the bushing in case the rubber was not torn, if indeed it was the bushing.

Anyway, the car runs quiet and the transmission still shifts excellent after the Trango-Shift Kit so I thought I might stiffen the chassis some, hopefully without the penalty of interior vibration while eliminating the torque steer for lack of a better term. Besides wanting to eliminate the torque steer I was curious how stiffening each mount would affect the handling instead of just replacing everything at once.

After some research I decided I didn't want to go with the Poly in fear it does cause vibration. Didn't want to take a chance of having a bunch of new parts I can't use just sitting around. After Youtubing I found several people using Poly Sealants as a cheap DIY either to make their own or to repair various types of mounts. Please see video link.



The two common products used are the following:

3M 08609 Window-Weld Super Fast Urethane Black Cartridge
https://www.walmart.com/ip/3m-08609-Win ... e/17039480

PL 10 fl. oz. Black Polyurethane Roof and Flashing Sealant - New Stock Does Not Have S30 On Label @ HD
https://www.homedepot.com/p/Loctite-PL- ... /203163733
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Poly has good adhesion and flex.
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Upper 0 Poly.jpg


I plan on starting at the top and later to the torque mount, sub-frame bushings, control arms and lastly front engine mount. Everything will be cleaned de-greased and sanded where possible for adhesion. The Upper Mount inserts are shorter allowing for a greater amount of Poly while the bottom will provide a connection for the inner and outer poly. The white PVC Cap (Home Depot) was trimmed in two spots so it can be centered on the mount. Doing one side at a time for better curing.

Upper Engine Mount - Saw IPD selling inserts for their Poly Mount so came up with this before applying the Poly to the entire cavity. This alone would add longevity to the mount.
Upper 0 Hose.jpg
Upper 3.jpg
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If you want to try this and think the hoses might slip out just use a zip tie around each or a little Poly Sealant.
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Upper 4.jpg
Upper 0 Cap 1.jpg
Upper 0 Cap 2.jpg
Upper 5.jpg
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Strut Bar Mount I discovered I couldn't use the IPD Poly Inserts as one is solid on the bottom. Will try using the middle washer to tie it solid to the Strut Bar and hopefully the extra Poly will absorb some of the vibration. If not the center washer will be remove to allow a little more flex. Regardless both will receive the Poly treatment including what little I could put on to the top of the mount.
Strut Bar Mount 2a.jpg
Strut Bar Mount 2b.jpg
Strut Bar Mount 3.jpg
Strut Bar Mount 4.jpg
Strut Bar Mount 5.jpg
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Strut Bar Mount Lastly, the strut bar mount. This is a solid mount but if you hit it with a dead blow hammer you'll see it shift some what easy from side to side so Poly will be added and smooth out with the finger around the bar and washer.
Upper Solid 1.jpg
Upper Solid 2.jpg
Upper Solid 3.jpg
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I will apply a thin coat of dielectric grease on the the PVC cap and washers in hope it can be removed easier after everything cures. Read somewhere that Volvo should have used a slightly larger bolt or have smaller holes so the bolts don't bounce around. During installation the bolts will be coated with Poly to fill the gaps and provide some vibration and dampening properties. Let me know what you think whether good, bad or improvements. Thanks.
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Blessings,

BKM

1998 S70 T5 - Donated
2003 S80 T6
2003 GS300
2003 Odyssey
2008 C30 T5
2019 Atlas SE 4 Motion

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wizechatmgr
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Re: Hybrid Mounts

Post by wizechatmgr » Sat May 25, 2019 5:32 pm

I'm interested in following this to hear what the outcome and longevity ends up being.


Wisdom requires knowledge as a prerequisite, but knowledge can be developed due to a lack of wisdom.
In order to learn how to fix something, you must first learn how to break it.
1999 V70 XC AWD - ~183k miles

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wizechatmgr
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Re: Hybrid Mounts

Post by wizechatmgr » Sat May 25, 2019 5:38 pm

One other idea I have is sacrificial temporary inserts for where you want gaps, possibly 3d printed that could be removed with water (pva perhaps??) This will allow you to use additional shapes that might be more in line with what you're attempting to achieve.


Wisdom requires knowledge as a prerequisite, but knowledge can be developed due to a lack of wisdom.
In order to learn how to fix something, you must first learn how to break it.
1999 V70 XC AWD - ~183k miles

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MoVolvos
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MoVolvos

Re: Hybrid Mounts

Post by MoVolvos » Sat May 25, 2019 10:13 pm

wizechatmgr wrote:
Sat May 25, 2019 5:32 pm
I'm interested in following this to hear what the outcome and longevity ends up being.
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Starting the experiment this evening with the Strut Bar Mount that could fit an IPD insert. Wanted to first try an area that can be shallow filled to test for cure time and bond. Was going to use a clamp but the Poly flows like chocolate pudding and even smells like chocolate pudding. Hope it doesn't tastes like it.

I cleaned the part with a tooth brush and 90% alcohol besides sanding where I could. Only put a thin film of Die-electric grease on the blue tape of the washer. Will see if it reacts with the Poly and if the blue tape around the hose clamp sticks or can be peeled off easily.
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Strut Bar Mount 2b.jpg
Strut Bar Mount 6 Poly Filled.jpg
Strut Bar Mount 7 Poly Filled.jpg
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Blessings,

BKM

1998 S70 T5 - Donated
2003 S80 T6
2003 GS300
2003 Odyssey
2008 C30 T5
2019 Atlas SE 4 Motion

User avatar
MoVolvos
Posts: 2071
Joined: Sun Jan 15, 2012 6:47 pm
Year and Model: 03S80T6~08C30T5
Location: NC
Has thanked: 23 times
Been thanked: 44 times
United States of America
MoVolvos

Re: Hybrid Mounts

Post by MoVolvos » Sat Jun 01, 2019 10:01 pm

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Verdict:
Overall the results are noticeable chassis firmness but it is not a substitute for the hard automotive Polyurethane.
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Cons:
1) Too soft
2) 7 day or more cure time
3) Slight transmission of sound from engine bay into cabin
4) Not a substitute for Automotive Polyurethane
5) Supports rather than act as foundation to stiffen like Automotive Polyurethane
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Pro:
1) Acts like memory foam, isolates / dampens vibration and bounce around it
2) No noticeable vibration in car cabin or steering wheel
3) Supports and extend life of parts
4) No Strut Bar movement, noticeable overall firmness in chassis (Washers helped a great deal)
5) Basically no Engine Mount movement
6) Quicker throttle response
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Improvements:
1) Use stiffer PEX Tubing instead of rubber. Would work well to fill larger part of gaps in Sub-frame bushing
https://www.menards.com/main/plumbing/r ... 5&&ipos=24
2) Use 3M 08609 Window-Weld Super Fast Urethane - Fast Cure Time
https://www.amazon.com/3M-08609-Window- ... B07RXLVF3M
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Conclusion: The overall effect the Poly made the car feel like solid Strut Tower Bar was installed. Quicker steering response (turn ins), firmer chassis, feels almost like the Neuspeed Strut Bars and Zender lower Trangulation Bars on an 83 VW GTI and 2 VW Diesel Trucks we use to own when I was younger.
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Engine Mount: Decided not to use the white End cap in previous post to extend the width of the Poly as cure time was too long. Filled engine mount pivot with Poly (forgot picture). No noticeable movement of engine when revved causing the feel of quicker throttle response while driving.
Engine Mount Poly.jpg
Engine Mount Poly Installed.jpg
Engine Mount Pivot.jpg
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Strut Bar Mount - Used hose clamp to build extra Poly on bottom. Used washer to tie entire system together. Used Poly to fill bolt hole to further eliminate potential movement.
Strut Bar Mount 1.jpg
Strut Bar Mount 3.jpg
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Strut Mount & Bearing - Since the car has KYB's (Don't Care For Them) I decided to stick the two parts together and see what it's like when the mount separates. Fill the inside but clearing the star nut.
Strut Mount & Bearing 1.jpg
Strut Mount & Bearing 2.jpg
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Blessings,

BKM

1998 S70 T5 - Donated
2003 S80 T6
2003 GS300
2003 Odyssey
2008 C30 T5
2019 Atlas SE 4 Motion

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