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S60 2005, fuel delivery problems...

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Julenzo
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S60 2005, fuel delivery problems...

Post by Julenzo » Sun Jul 28, 2019 6:00 am

Hello there. New to this site with pretty poor mechanical knowledge....

I recently bought S60 2.5T FWD 2005, supposedly 108k miles.

VIN: YV1RS592952438783

It had P0089 (Suction control valve stuck) and P0087 (fuel pressure too low) codes at the start, but no noticeable driveability problems. After some time of driving my gas was running out, light came on, filled it up, tried to start it - nothing. Well, eventually me and my buddy managed to get the engine running. After that the engine started to fluctuate a little bit, it was not working very nice. Plugged in my OBD reader to check real time stats. The strangest thing was fuel pressure. While idling FP kept dropping down to ~250kPa and I was hearing high pitch sucking noise from the pump, engine shakes a little bit, the noise disappears and at the time when engine stumbles - fuel pressure jumps to ~450-500kPa and the story starts over. That got me scared a little bit... Fuel pressure sensor was replaced by the previous owner sometime in the previous 4 months (still have the old one), as well as some wierd fuel pump. According to him, the errors and check engine light remained.

Went sraight to the local reputable garage to diagnose what is going on. From the pump noise they immediately suggested to change the pump. Before that we changed spark plugs, air filter, fuel filter, couple of hoses.
Looked up the code for the pump - plenty of choices... According to VIN number, I am supposed to have a pump with OE 30761745. After calling the Volvo dealership in my country, they said they only suggest the pump by number 30761747. I trusted the dealership so I bought an aftermarket pump according that number. After the replacement it was pretty hard to start an engine for some time, but after some attempts it was starting pretty normal, with just couple of cranks. Yesterday I drove a little bit to the town to test drive, filled it up with gas (~70% full). Same codes reappeared, the gas needle started to fluctuate between real real level and absolutely empty (most of the time showing empty...). But it felt that the engine was running more smoothly, fuel pressure was staying at ~300kPa. While staying at the light, the engine stumbled a little bit, but it kept runnong pretty ok after that. Stopped at the parking lot, checked my OBD, didn't see anything wierd, shut off the engine aaaand... Couldn't start it. Just, died. It was cranking, but it just felt that there was no fuel delivery at all... Just towed it to the same garage and left it there until Monday. No idea what happened and what to do next...

Also I did some reading, stumbled across this topic:

viewtopic.php?t=83957

Insane research, but have no real accessibility to treat her that way... Thought the pump would fix the problem, but it didn't...

1.) What should I do next? Should I replace fuel pressure sensor (FPS) "again"? Pump control module (PEM)?
2.) According to VIN, the PEM in my car should be 30742823, but the one there is, is 30769225 (with the FORD logo). Could that be a problem? I read that there is no difference between those, any confirmation to it?
3.) What is the difference between these two pumps? Both of them show different BOSCH products...
4.) What is that "suction control valve" in the code of P0089?

Waiting for any opinions and answers...



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Re: S60 2005, fuel delivery problems...

Post by oragex » Sun Jul 28, 2019 6:04 am

Google up a bit about FPS (if equipped) and PEM. You can install any used PEM regardless the numbers, without programming. See Youtube for location



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Re: S60 2005, fuel delivery problems...

Post by Julenzo » Sun Jul 28, 2019 8:57 am

Yeah I read about them. I am just wondering whether I should change them or not... as I said FPS was alreary replaced at least twice, PEM is already under the rear seats, which means it was already replaced, or at least relocated. Mechanic that was working with it said there were some extra random wires going out of the main harness under the rear seats. After that post that I mentioned, I was thinking maybe it was from the previous PEM...



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Re: S60 2005, fuel delivery problems...

Post by oragex » Sun Jul 28, 2019 10:19 am

Just for my information, where under the rear seats, under the right rear seat ? Sometimes we look for these but don't realize where the main dealer relocated it.

A small tip, you can read on the PEM the manufacturing date, on the sticker, can give you an idea when it was replaced. Also see if there is any corrosion on its metal plate. Again, most numbers will work. I've hear only about the R engine having a different PEM, not sure about it, and unfortunately don't know it's part no. But for all other engines is the same module with various numbers due to the brackets and attachments. Basically from 2003 up to around 2014 the same electronic board was used on all gasoline Volvo cars, including the S40 and V50 (these have the module under the left rear seat, under a corner of the carpet). Some had the Ford logo (yet sold by Volvo), other not.

Your turbo needs to have the gas close to 400 kPa pretty much at all time.

I'm not aware what the Pressure valve does or it's located. Do you see a round metallic part attached behind the rail where goes in the fuel line ?

I would first take the numbers of the replacement FPS, Fcpeuro.com has a fitment button, good to verify. Also see if it's a Bosch unit - there are also cheap chinese units on the market

Post #22 here talks about an owner who had to fix the CEM in the end, worth looking at it with a flash light for signs of water on the plastic box https://volvoforums.com/forum/volvo-s60 ... 179/page2/

Depending on how the PEM looks, may try a used one or even one from another car. That garage may have one somewhere and let you test with it.

Lastly, on the fuel pump, there is a chance cheap aftermarket ones to cause troubles. Also with the pump, sometimes a mechanic may install it the wrong way, either not connect the cables correctly, or kink or block the suction tube inside the tank. Already happened to other owners. Also, the gas needle jumping may indicate a current problem (this would send back to the CEM). If going to replace again the pump, I'll get a used genuine unit off Ebay. These pumps very rarely fail (unlike on other cars) so a used genuine one is usually a safe bet.



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Re: S60 2005, fuel delivery problems...

Post by abscate » Mon Jul 29, 2019 7:13 pm

Are you near Vilnius? Rhetorical for an American. If I can find my spare PEM I might be able to do a interPEMtiom on Friday’s depending on my schedule


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Julenzo
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Re: S60 2005, fuel delivery problems...

Post by Julenzo » Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:17 am

oragex wrote:
Sun Jul 28, 2019 10:19 am
Just for my information, where under the rear seats, under the right rear seat ? Sometimes we look for these but don't realize where the main dealer relocated it.

A small tip, you can read on the PEM the manufacturing date, on the sticker, can give you an idea when it was replaced. Also see if there is any corrosion on its metal plate. Again, most numbers will work. I've hear only about the R engine having a different PEM, not sure about it, and unfortunately don't know it's part no. But for all other engines is the same module with various numbers due to the brackets and attachments. Basically from 2003 up to around 2014 the same electronic board was used on all gasoline Volvo cars, including the S40 and V50 (these have the module under the left rear seat, under a corner of the carpet). Some had the Ford logo (yet sold by Volvo), other not.

Your turbo needs to have the gas close to 400 kPa pretty much at all time.

I'm not aware what the Pressure valve does or it's located. Do you see a round metallic part attached behind the rail where goes in the fuel line ?

I would first take the numbers of the replacement FPS, Fcpeuro.com has a fitment button, good to verify. Also see if it's a Bosch unit - there are also cheap chinese units on the market

Post #22 here talks about an owner who had to fix the CEM in the end, worth looking at it with a flash light for signs of water on the plastic box https://volvoforums.com/forum/volvo-s60 ... 179/page2/

Depending on how the PEM looks, may try a used one or even one from another car. That garage may have one somewhere and let you test with it.

Lastly, on the fuel pump, there is a chance cheap aftermarket ones to cause troubles. Also with the pump, sometimes a mechanic may install it the wrong way, either not connect the cables correctly, or kink or block the suction tube inside the tank. Already happened to other owners. Also, the gas needle jumping may indicate a current problem (this would send back to the CEM). If going to replace again the pump, I'll get a used genuine unit off Ebay. These pumps very rarely fail (unlike on other cars) so a used genuine one is usually a safe bet.
Yes, under the rear right seat, next to all the wiring harness.

Yes, I have found an original Volvo "manual" of replacing the PEM. R has different one - all others have the same. The one with the Ford logo is the replacement. So it is pretty unlikely that my PEM is faulty (there is a chance, of course...).

I have contacted the local garage that focuses and fixes only Volvos and they agreed that there should be 400-450kPa pressure, where I see only ~300kPa.

From my research, if there is any kind of valve - it is inside the fuel pump assembly. Other than that - no idea where it could be either...

My FPS is the correct one, from Bosch. As I said it was replaced, and I have the old one that the previous owner replaced from. Would be interesting to plug that one back in and see what it does.

Yeah, I have already read that post before. Poor man... Didn't have chance to check the CEM of any water or corrosion on it yet, since the car is at the garage... Hopefully it's not the same case here...

That garage does not have a spare PEM... AND they didn't fix anything, since they said that they have NO IDEA of what is going on and what to do. Thus I contacted a mechanic who fixes only Volvos. He of course heard of same problems before, hopefully he will be able to help me. Although he's only available the upcoming week...

Today at work, one guy said he has one S60 with 2.5T, offered me to swap PEM to check it out. Worth a shot, since it's only plug n' play.

Since I am not from USA, eBay is not really a good option for me yet... I might find one from a salvaged car. Also, the mechanic tested the pump itself - it's working just fine. But there is just no contact from the computer, when the pump is plugged in. It's like something got disconnected (remember the engine stumble at the traffic light I mentioned before?).



Julenzo
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Re: S60 2005, fuel delivery problems...

Post by Julenzo » Fri Aug 02, 2019 10:18 am

abscate wrote:
Mon Jul 29, 2019 7:13 pm
Are you near Vilnius? Rhetorical for an American. If I can find my spare PEM I might be able to do a interPEMtiom on Friday’s depending on my schedule
Kind of. I am from Kaunas. ~60 miles from Vilnius. Since my car doesn't start, I cannot really get to Vilnius to test it out...



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