Looking for leads/help

ctw · Post by **ctw** » 20 Jan 2011, 21:14

Howdy guys
Well 10,000 miles in the new to me Volvo and I love the car. Now here is the problem today (plenty cold here) when I went out to warm up the car she fired up and immediately stalled and would not restart fired a couple of times but no start. Rolling the engine over it does not sound right could it have jumped time when it stalled? I have a small hand held code reader and it showed no codes. Any thoughts or suggestions? A direction would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks Chris

Post by **jimmy57** » 20 Jan 2011, 22:31

I don't think this is it but have someone crank engine over while you look inside engine through the removed oil filler cap.
If you see cam turning while starter is moving then skip the stroke you'll have when the idea cam belt broke hits you.
If the starter seems to crank it over too fast then you probably have "lawn mower syndrome". Search here and ye shall find.
Here's the quick fix: crank car over with accel pedal at least half way down for one minute, give starter a rest for a minute and while still holding throttle half or more down do another one minute crank. If you have any doubts your battery is strong use jumper cables and another vehicle to boost cranking. It likely has slightly stuck open exhaust valves and the compression is low and it is flooded. Usually the engine will begin to pick up a cylinder at about 30 seconds into the second cranking minute.
Do not release key from START to RUN until engine out runs starter and keep throttle applied until you get 2000 RPM out of it. Keep it at 2000 RPM until it runs smoothly. It may take a third minute of cranking if it is really cold. If so, repeat the minute starter rest and keep pedal down!
Then go drive car somewhere in low gear with engine at 4500-5000 RPM for about 2 minutes. This really was the Volvo issued procedure! Volvo also had the techs change the spark plugs to a multi-electrode plug for lesser chance of fuel fouling.
The cars will still do this with the multi-electrode plugs!
You don't mention it but the usual scenario for this occurrence is the car was started in cold weather at least once for a brief run ( less than a minute) some hours before the start attempt that yielded the no-start with too fast, no compression cranking. The real fix is to never run the car briefly like that in cold weather.
If this fits try it. If the situation is different or if the engine fails to start with extended cranking as described, let us know. If it does start please let us know.

ctw · Post by **ctw** » 21 Jan 2011, 12:54

Still no go. Things I have verified.

1 Both the top and bottom of engine spin.
2 has fire
3 has fuel
4 replaced plugs
5 unplug fuel injectors to stop fuel flow
6 roll engine over without plugs in to dry the thing out
7 install plugs fires briefly but soon floods

So if the only thing wrong flooded it how do I go about drying it out? Any other thoughts?

Thanks Chris

Post by **jblackburn** » 21 Jan 2011, 13:09

Put about a teaspoon oil oil in each cylinder. Then crank til it will fire on its own, and hold throttle with your foot til it can idle on its own. You'll have a huge cloud of smoke

ctw · Post by **ctw** » 21 Jan 2011, 13:35

Thank you I will give that a go Will penetrating oil do the trick?
Also I cranked on the car enough for it to throw a couple of codes
P0102 mass air
P1617 with no explanation.

Thanks Chris

Post by **Ozark Lee** » 21 Jan 2011, 14:02

Thank you I will give that a go Will penetrating oil do the trick?

Use engine oil, penetrating oil might actually make the situation worse.

...Lee

ctw · Post by **ctw** » 21 Jan 2011, 14:25

I must be doing something wrong still no go. If it is simply flooded I understand the fuel can wash the cylinder to the point it will loose compression but have never had this much trouble before with any car. I wrapped the front of the volvo with a tarp and stuck a 1500 watt heater under there but I don't think it will do much at 10 degrees. Maybe I got a bit of bad gas? I did drive 250+ miles since the last fill up though.
Thanks Chris

Post by **jblackburn** » 21 Jan 2011, 14:54

The P0102 code may actually have something to do with this.

Unplug the wire from your mass airflow sensor and see if you can get it going before trying any of the more drastic things. A crank or two will let you know if that is the issue or not.

ctw · Post by **ctw** » 21 Jan 2011, 16:25

THANK YOU returned from picking up the wife, removed the tarp replaced the plugs, plugged back in the fuel injectors unplugged the MAS and she fired up. It idled very rough, replaced the MAS plug and she stalled upon restart she idles fine now and is outside warming up.
The last few weeks I have noticed less fuel economy and think these two are linked? To much fuel not enough air? How do I test the MAS?
Anyway I am greatly relieved that the problem is probably nothing more than a sensor.

Post by **Ozark Lee** » 21 Jan 2011, 16:35

How do I test the MAS?

You pretty much just did and your test says it is bad. You can try spraying the element with MAF cleaner but I doubt it will work. The MAF cleaner is dirt cheap though when compared to the MAF sensor itself, they are pricey little buggers.

When cleaning a MAF sensor just spray the element and let it dry. Don't scrub it or even touch it.

If you replace it be sure to go with an OEM Bosch sensor.

...Lee