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My radiator cooling fan isn't working, can't figure out!

Help, Advice and DIY Tutorials on Volvo's P80 platform cars -- Volvo's 1990s "bread and butter" cars -- powered by the ubiquitous and durable Volvo inline 5-cylinder engine.

1992 - 1997 850, including 850 R, 850 T-5R, 850 T-5, 850 GLT
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shiloh51933
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Re: My radiator cooling fan isn't working, can't figure out!

Post by shiloh51933 »

tomellis wrote:This may be a silly question, but have you run power straight from the battery to the fan to make sure the motor is good? I didn't see anywhere in your posts that you have done this. If you haven't done that yet, it is where you need to start.

Yeah I finally tried to hook it up directly and it looks like the fan motor is done/finished!! Oh well, guess I'm spending another 50 buck to the 1200.00 in parts I've spent already...it's all good though and is well worth it.
If U Wanna Play U Gotta Pay!!
Present Volvo Ownership:
2008 Volvo XC90 V8 Black
2004 Volvo XC70 OEM-HID model Silver
Previously Owned Volvo:
1996 Volvo 850 GLT Silver
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1998 Volvo V70XC Dark Blue
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2004 Volvo XC90 T6 Gold

holler1
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Post by holler1 »

Maybe I should start a new thread, but a lot of the info in this one seems to apply. However, my problem is slightly different. A few weeks ago I had a CEL indicating a bad ECT and the ECT temp was going all over the place. I replaced the ECT and that corrected the CEL and the ECT reading on my real time monitor is in a more normal range. However, the cooling fan doesn't seem to be coming on right. The fan does run when the AC is on, but if AC is off the fan doesn't seem to run at all either on low or high speed. I ran the engine up to a temp above 210 F with AC off, and neither speed came on. When driving I have not seen any overheating, but this time of year I normally run the AC so the low speed fan is running most of the time anyway. The engine doesn't overheat sitting at idle, but the temp gauge does seem to sit a little higher, right around 3:00, where it used to sit at around 3:10 or below. You might say there is no problem, since the car is drivable, but it seems to me that at least the LS fan should come on at a lower temp than 210 F. I'm going to try driving it with AC off and see how it does- just thought of that test.

I tested the fan and relay by grounding the yellow or y/w wires on the relay, and both speeds of the fan come on, so the fan itself is OK and the relay seems to be working as it should. My question is whether the problem is likely due to bad contacts where the yellow and y/w wires go into the ECU, or where the ECT signal goes to the ECU. Hopefully it isn't the ECU itself. After reading Lee's comments in this thread, I'm going to try wiggling the wires at the ECU end and see if that helps.
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Post by jimmy57 »

The on temp for the fan is about 220F, maybe 225F.
Remember the coolant temp sensor is on the outlet from engine at the hottest place. They want the fan on if the temp gets too hot. 210 is not too hot.
If you take a properly operating fan system when these cars were new and you took off the tank cap, the fan would some on right at the instant the non-pressurized cooling system would boil the coolant and coolant dosed water boils at 220F.
Sounds hot but the fan would run a LOT more if they switched it on at 210. The fan will run until it drops the ECT to 192-195.
I think the fan strategy assumes you will use A/C in temps where temp would raise coolant temp to the fan on temp very frequently.

holler1
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Post by holler1 »

Jimmy57,
Thanks. I'm going to let it run hotter and see if it comes on. I suppose from what you're saying that the low speed of the fan is only used when the AC is on? This is the first time I've done a close check on the actual temps from the ECT sensor using my code reader, but I seem to recall that the fan used to come on sometimes after I shut off the engine, and it isn't doing that now. Also, the gauge seems to sit a fraction higher than it used to. If it does come on at 220 or 225, I'll admit it's my imagination playing tricks on me.

I do have to say these cooling systems are well-designed. They don't seem to need the fan much. I used to have a 92 Taurus that gave me fits because the cooling system always ran on the ragged edge. I guess Ford learned something from Volvo, because my Fusion has never shown this problem. I just wish Volvo had figured out how to design an ebrake.
1998 Volvo V70 AWD 165000-R muffler, HD endlinks, boost gauge
2008 Ford Fusion AWD 107000
2000 Ford Ranger 4wd 172000
1991 Toyota Camry 160000#1
Previous: 1982 Volvo DL (240) 160000
1998 Tacoma, Fords (6), Dodge, Montero,
GTO, Sunbeam Alpine, VW Dasher
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jblackburn
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Post by jblackburn »

The engine doesn't overheat sitting at idle, but the temp gauge does seem to sit a little higher, right around 3:00, where it used to sit at around 3:10 or below.
That's exactly where it should sit. I'm guessing you changed the thermostat out too? A failed-open thermostat (or an old sensor even) could have made the needle sit lower.

My cooling fan will usually be running as I get home after some around-town driving on 80 degree days when I'm not running the AC.
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shiloh51933
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Post by shiloh51933 »

holler1 wrote:Maybe I should start a new thread, but a lot of the info in this one seems to apply. However, my problem is slightly different. A few weeks ago I had a CEL indicating a bad ECT and the ECT temp was going all over the place. I replaced the ECT and that corrected the CEL and the ECT reading on my real time monitor is in a more normal range. However, the cooling fan doesn't seem to be coming on right. The fan does run when the AC is on, but if AC is off the fan doesn't seem to run at all either on low or high speed. I ran the engine up to a temp above 210 F with AC off, and neither speed came on. When driving I have not seen any overheating, but this time of year I normally run the AC so the low speed fan is running most of the time anyway. The engine doesn't overheat sitting at idle, but the temp gauge does seem to sit a little higher, right around 3:00, where it used to sit at around 3:10 or below. You might say there is no problem, since the car is drivable, but it seems to me that at least the LS fan should come on at a lower temp than 210 F. I'm going to try driving it with AC off and see how it does- just thought of that test.

I tested the fan and relay by grounding the yellow or y/w wires on the relay, and both speeds of the fan come on, so the fan itself is OK and the relay seems to be working as it should. My question is whether the problem is likely due to bad contacts where the yellow and y/w wires go into the ECU, or where the ECT signal goes to the ECU. Hopefully it isn't the ECU itself. After reading Lee's comments in this thread, I'm going to try wiggling the wires at the ECU end and see if that helps.
Depending on what you have as far cooling system stat, temp sensor, ect.. My fan won't come on til' 215 degrees like it's supposed to. The stat opens up round 180 degrees I believe but in summer temps w/ac on the fan goes on immediatly... yeah Volvo's are weird like that. I thought same stuff when i put the new fan in but after researching i found that everything was good.
If U Wanna Play U Gotta Pay!!
Present Volvo Ownership:
2008 Volvo XC90 V8 Black
2004 Volvo XC70 OEM-HID model Silver
Previously Owned Volvo:
1996 Volvo 850 GLT Silver
1998 Volvo V70XC Dark Blue
1998 Volvo V70XC Dark Blue
2000 Volvo V70XC/SE Dark Blue
2004 Volvo XC90 T6 Gold

holler1
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Post by holler1 »

jblackburn wrote:
The engine doesn't overheat sitting at idle, but the temp gauge does seem to sit a little higher, right around 3:00, where it used to sit at around 3:10 or below.
That's exactly where it should sit. I'm guessing you changed the thermostat out too? A failed-open thermostat (or an old sensor even) could have made the needle sit lower.

My cooling fan will usually be running as I get home after some around-town driving on 80 degree days when I'm not running the AC.
I did order a new thermostat when I got the ECT sensor, but didn't change out the thermostat. The old one is maybe 3 or 4 years old and it seems to be working OK. My cooling fan used to come on after driving like yours. I suppose the new ECT sensor could have shifted the "on" point. The old sensor had gone wacky. I'm also wondering if the ECU needs to reset itself after the sensor change. I haven't been driving the Volvo that much lately, probably less than 100 miles in a week or two.

I'll post back after some more testing.
1998 Volvo V70 AWD 165000-R muffler, HD endlinks, boost gauge
2008 Ford Fusion AWD 107000
2000 Ford Ranger 4wd 172000
1991 Toyota Camry 160000#1
Previous: 1982 Volvo DL (240) 160000
1998 Tacoma, Fords (6), Dodge, Montero,
GTO, Sunbeam Alpine, VW Dasher
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jimmy57
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Post by jimmy57 »

holler1 wrote:Jimmy57,
Thanks. I'm going to let it run hotter and see if it comes on. I suppose from what you're saying that the low speed of the fan is only used when the AC is on?
The Engine Control Module (ECM) is what is connected to the fan relay. ECM reads the high pressure sensor on high side a/c line and the ECT sensor. The ECM will run the fan at either speed as the condition warrants.
Given ECT below 220 the a/c pressure reaching 175 +/- triggers fan to run on lo. If pressure goes above 240 +/- with lo fan then fan will be switched to hi.
With no A/C the fan will run lo at 220 +/- and if coolant temp reaches 240+/- it is switched to hi.
With a/c on and fan running already on lo and ECT goes to 220 +/- then fan goes to hi
Usually due to radiator overcapacity (at least by old RWD engine driven fan standards) the fan running on low for a/c purposes is keeping coolant temp below 200 even in 100 degree weather and the ECM is not running fan for ECT concerns.

dbeckwith
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Post by dbeckwith »

Install a manual overide. Every vehicle I have owned over over ten years old I have installed a manual overide. That way you leave nothing to chance. Not a difficult procedure.
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dcarlson12
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Post by dcarlson12 »

For a poor ignorant sod like me, please advise what ECT stands for.
Just trying to digest the thread for future reference.
Thks.

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