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95 850 T-5R Engine Twitching Randomly. Out of Ideas.

Help, Advice and DIY Tutorials on Volvo's P80 platform cars -- Volvo's 1990s "bread and butter" cars -- powered by the ubiquitous and durable Volvo inline 5-cylinder engine.

1992 - 1997 850, including 850 R, 850 T-5R, 850 T-5, 850 GLT
1997 - 2000 S70, S70 AWD
1997 - 2000 V70, V70 AWD
1997 - 2000 V70-XC
1997 - 2004 C70

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T-5RShultz
Posts: 6
Joined: 18 March 2014
Year and Model: 1995 854 T-5R
Location: United States

95 850 T-5R Engine Twitching Randomly. Out of Ideas.

Post by T-5RShultz »

Hi everyone, first post here… Sorry for the wall of text!

I’ve been trying to chase down an issue with my 1995 850 T-5R (109k miles) for a while, where the engine seems to randomly (and very frequently) “twitch” while idling. The twitches range in their intensity (steering wheel shakes mildly or very noticeably, and at no specific interval). It is especially noticeable in park and neutral; when in gear it’s still there but not as noticeable.

At idle, ignition timing advance @ cylinder 1 randomly fluctuates between 3 through 9.

I only use 91 octane fuel.

I change the oil every 3k miles and only use Mobil 1 High Mileage full synthetic.

Also, RPMs dip by about 100 when doing a “rolling idle” (no brakes, just letting car roll @ idle) but go back up to the normal 840 when at a complete stop. This also happens when coming to a stop as the car enters idle, until completely stopped via brakes when it goes back up to 840 again. Here are some more of the symptoms:

- RPM appears mostly unaffected by the twitch, but occasionally dips from 840 down to 800 (live readout using OBDII scanner) and right back up to 840 when idling in park or while stopped in drive.

- Exhaust smells pretty bad, like the engine’s running rich.

- Aside from the frequent “twitching”, the car has a slight roughness or vibration when slowly accelerating (very minimal throttle) from a stop, until around 1,200-1,500 RPM and above, where it seems to smooth out. I've replaced both front axles and wheel hubs/bearings in the last 3k miles, but that didn't fix it.

- My MPG averages 20-22 combined according to trip computer. I drive roughly 50/50 street and highway.


Here’s a list of everything I’ve attempted so far trying to remedy the issue (all parts used are Genuine/OEM unless otherwise noted)

- Replaced motor mounts – ALL of them (including tranny torque mount and firewall mount). Upper engine and firewall mount are IPD poly.

- TUNE UP - Plugs , plug wires, distributor cap and rotor @ 93k miles. I first replaced them shortly after buying the car (@ 92k miles) because it had a pretty hefty misfire that was easily felt, and doing so eliminated the noticeable misfire.

- Had to replace plugs, dist. cap and rotor again only 15k miles later because of a couple misfire codes that popped up recently. Pulled off the distributor cap (after only a year and a half of use since new) and it had signs of arcing all over the place (see picture). Codes went away after replacing components.

Image

- Replaced fuel pump (original failed) and fuel pump relay

- Replaced fuel filter

- Had fuel tank recall replacement performed, replaced all related fuel/evap hoses while in there.

- Had injectors and upper engine “seafoamed” by my indy Volvo mechanic using B&G solution/cleaner.

- Replaced entire PCV system, cleaned EGR port, and replaced PTC (came with Snaab air pipe)

- Replaced ECU (with proper Bosch 628 “R” ECU)

- Replaced both O2 sensors

- Cleaned, then replaced MAF

- Had intake and exhaust system tested for vacuum/exhaust leaks and repaired all detected leaks.

- Replaced stock ignition coil with MSD coil

- Replaced intake air filter (then later upgraded to IPD short ram because whoooosh)

- Replaced TCV with IPD HD TCV

- Replaced entire Timing assembly (Belt, tensioner, pulleys, water pump) and ensured timing is set properly

- Replaced ignition switch

- Replaced throttle position sensor

- Thoroughly cleaned IAC (twice to be sure)

- EDIT (Consolidating information from further down thread) Did a compression test about a month ago, all within spec. Cylinders 1, 2, 3, 5 had readings of mid-high 170s, cylinder 4 was mid 160s.


This problem has been there since I purchased the vehicle and has persisted through all of the upgrades/repair attempts, getting slowly worse. Any ideas or recommendations would be infinitely appreciated.
Last edited by T-5RShultz on 04 Sep 2015, 15:56, edited 1 time in total.

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abscate  
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Post by abscate »

reaching into the Obscure solutions drawer

Did you use Bougicord wires for replacements?

Is your cam sensor wire routed well away from your ignition wires at the rear of the cylinder head?

tough one..
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T-5RShultz
Posts: 6
Joined: 18 March 2014
Year and Model: 1995 854 T-5R
Location: United States

Post by T-5RShultz »

Thanks for the quick reply abscate, I really appreciate it!

It's definitely a tough one alright haha.

As for the plug wires - always and only Bougicord. :)

Good question regarding the cam sensor wire. I just got back from checking, and it clears all the ignition wires by a few inches at least. I might lightly spray the cam sensor's connectors with some CRC electrical contact cleaner to see if that helps at all.

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RussB
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Post by RussB »

Compression readings? Leak down test?
'00 S70, '04 S60 and the never ending quest for Stage Zero

T-5RShultz
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Year and Model: 1995 854 T-5R
Location: United States

Post by T-5RShultz »

Did a compression test a little over a month ago, everything well within spec. Can't remember the exact numbers off the top of my head, but cylinders 1, 2, 3, 5 were at mid-high 170s, cylinder 4 at mid 160s.

Haven't done a leakdown test since compression looked good. Should I do one?

Thanks!

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Post by scot850 »

How is the distributor shaft? Years ago I had a problem with a 240 that no one was able to cure, and after I sold it I later found out there was a grounding fault in the distributor. Also check there is no oil leaking into the distributor from a leaking cam seal. Finally, never wash the engine compartment without ensuring the distributor is enclosed from water as it tends to get into the cap and cause shorts.

Neil.
2006 V70 2.5T AWD Polestar tune
2000 V70 R - still being an endless PITA
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T-5RShultz
Posts: 6
Joined: 18 March 2014
Year and Model: 1995 854 T-5R
Location: United States

Post by T-5RShultz »

Thanks for the tip about the distributor shaft, I'll take a look into that and any potential grounding issues in there.

Thankfully there are no oil leaks at the distributor. I replaced that cam seal when doing the tune up @93k for good measure, and it was still dry as a bone when I replaced the cap and rotor the second time @108k :)

Never have and never will do any intense "washing" of the engine compartment. Mildly damp rags is the most moisture that place has seen from me, and only on non-electrical surfaces/areas.

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Post by Sommerfeldt »

My 2 cents ... check the other grounding points in the engine compartment as well - I think you've got 2 of them at least, top of block to firewall, that are easily accessible. It doesn't matter how the braided wires look - they're probably green and ugly, but if their mating surfaces are corroded or damaged, that might be your problem. Or part of it. :)

- G
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jreed
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Post by jreed »

Given that the problem with twitching appears to occur most frequently at idle, and based on my own experience with a sticking IAC valve on my '97 855 GLT at ~179K miles even after cleaning it, I'd recommend swapping in another IAC valve to see if the problem goes away.

On my car I thought I had fixed a stalling and idle wandering problem by cleaning out the varnish that had built up in the IAC valve, but the problem came back after a while. I removed the original IAC again and replaced it with another one I had harvested from the junkyard and the problem has not come back.

Once it was out of the car I inspected the original IAC valve more closely, and it felt like it was binding up at certain positions even though it was clean. I opened it up at the endcap to see if I could find the source of the binding but couldn't find anything on the motor shaft or inner wall of the case that looked like it was rubbing. The bearing at the end turned smoothly too, so I was stumped about the root cause.
1997 855 GLT (Light Pressure Turbo) still going strong. Previous: 1986 240 GL rusted out in '06, 1985 Saab 900T rusted out in '95, 1975 Saab 99 rusted out in '95, 1973 Saab 99 rusted out in '94

T-5RShultz
Posts: 6
Joined: 18 March 2014
Year and Model: 1995 854 T-5R
Location: United States

Post by T-5RShultz »

Thanks for the reply jreed, much appreciated.

When I took the IAC out to clean it both times, it moved buttery smooth, but I've had a gut feeling for a while mow telling me to swap it out with a known good one just to see if it makes a difference. Your post gave me the extra push I needed to try that next. I'll report back on that once I've had a chance to harvest and swap one in. Thanks again!

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