Shaking...a lot !

marmotteNZ · Post by **marmotteNZ** » 08 Jun 2017, 02:08

Dear all,

I have a 04 2.5T AWD with 205k miles. I have had it for 50k. I live in Colorado but I'm a new immigrant. After three garage visits that revealed disastrous in spite of recommendations, I had started learning to do some maintenance myself

but I'm still very beginner! (I've replaced starter motor, rotors and pads, flushed tranny and coolant, oil change of course, bled brakes, replaced a couple of hoses, air filter, sparkplugs...).

For quite a while it had been shaking when braking. It was obviously not the rotors ; after checking this great forum I learned it could come from the control arms bushing....which indeed were looking very bad. I had unfortunately let that aside by lack of budget for several months

Lately, it has started shaking much more (like if the wheels were a bit oval LOL) and without braking, when in straight line, above 45 or 50 mph. It has also been wearing out the FL tire like crazy. So i am pretty sure that 1. the alignment has gone banana (I live on top of a 15% steep gravel driveway and I drive 30% of the time on gravel road) and 2. the control arms are dead, and 3. I suspect quite a few other suspension parts are dead too.

I plan to replace now the control arms of course . I checked some instructions here and on Swedespeed and - whereas it is way more involved than what I have done so far, I think I am ready to go there. I will certainly need to do the tie rods (not sure of the vocabulary) BUT, considering the age and low resale value of the car, I'm not too keen into starting buying and replacing for several $100s of parts without being relatively confident it will solve the problem...
I suspected the bearing may be dead, but when trying to move the wheels with the car on stands, I can't feel any movement or hear any noise in the area of the bearing ; the noise (and the movement) comes from the suspension parts and from the steering rack. It moves also when push/pulling at 9 and 3 oclock, but not when doing 12/6 o'clock - which I read indicates indeed that it is rather the suspension parts rather than the bearings. That said, hubs are quite inexpensive and while pulling out everything to access the control arm maybe I should do them to be on the safe side?

If I could NOT have to do the struts - that would be great ($$$) . I know the car would be better with - but at this stage all I want is solve this shaking problem.

I noticed that the parts that connect to the steering rack move with some noise. Is it normal? Should I replace them too? (see video)
I noted that the CV boots look "young" for 200k - so did a sticker on one side on the axle - so I suspect some work has been done before I got the car.

I noticed also that the differential on the front axis...well it is very greasy ; when on P, spinning a front wheel will unsurprisingly spins the other one in the other direction...but this movement has a lot of play, and it is noisy, Is it normal ? (see end of the video) Could it partly explain the problem ? (I don;t think so as the shaking is there even without accelerating).

I tried moving the rear wheels - nothing there.

Last - I noted that one small silent block holding the engine at the bottom is "missing" - probably so dried out that it fell. The big one on top is cracked. Is it easy to change? (see photos)

Thanks for any advice. I'd be glad to pay a reliable person in Denver or nearby to help me out with the diagnostic

Photos:
Video

Post by **oragex** » 08 Jun 2017, 06:35

What exactly is shaking? The steering wheel, gas pedal, whole floor?

The upper engine mount is not hard to replace, you may do without removing the strut brace
Most aftermarket mounts will crack again in short time.

Struts don't cause vibrations.

The front control arm needs replaced, I only trust Lemforder.

I'd make sure the caliper sliding pins move easily by hand inside their rubber boot. I don't use any grease for these, most greases will get sticky after a few months. I also tighten the wheels in 4-5 steps to make sure the rotor doesn't bend.

The only way to test a bearing is to remove the caliper and rotor.

marmotteNZ · Post by **marmotteNZ** » 08 Jun 2017, 07:29

Thanks Oragex.
The vibration is in the whole car, i.e. passenger feels it too.
Earlier, when it was only when braking, it was mostly in the wheel.

After having removed rotor and caliper, what do you check for in the bearing? without the rotor (or the wheel), there is not much to grab to get a torque and moving the bearing?

THX for the video too.

Post by **oragex** » 08 Jun 2017, 07:37

We just turn the bearing (the plate with holes on which the rotor sits) by hand without pressure or force, and feel it: a bit rough is not a problem, too rough or even play it needs replaced. As for the vibration felt by the passenger, it usually comes from the rear wheels - could also be the rear axles or just a wheel that lost it's weights. Not sure if the awd can also cause vibrations, maybe worth a search on google

Post by **SuperHerman** » 11 Jun 2017, 11:42

If it were me the first thing I would do is inspect the angle gear oil level. You cannot let that go dry or you will be in huge trouble. I would not move the XC90 if you have any fear it could be empty. Start with a drain and fill and general clean up of outside. Then monitor if you have a big leak or a slow weep. If a slow weep keep an eye on it until you have the funds to change out the seals. Again attend to this immediately, hopefully it is not too late.

It is always hard to comment on control arm bushings via pictures. One really needs to actually feel and see how they behave while they are being "man handled". That said all of your control arm bushings look pretty tired - replace them all - cheapest route is to press bushings in although it is more work. The ball joints look visually fine as the boots all appear intact. You need to crank on these hard to see if they have play. If you want, carefully pull back the boots and clean and relube. The struts do not show signs of leaking. The engine mount you have pictured shows the inner bushing in bad shape (actually it looks like it is totally gone). Some have fashioned rubber hose to fix this and others have modified roller skate wheels - I would buy new, but it depends on your budget. Right now it looks like you have nothing there to dampen and restrict movement. I am not sure if available for the XC90, but I think I have seen a replacement part for just the inside.

Control arms - I would replace both sides all four arms - if money is short - just do the bushings rather than replacing the entire arms - the bushings are not too expensive. It is not hard if you have the right set up - which one can fashion or rent. If you have a nice set up remove the arms and press out and then press new ones in. Check that orientation is correct as required. If you have a lesser set up, then you may have to cut out the inner, then slowly cut the bushing shell to split it. Removal of bushing is normally harder than repress. It really depends on what you have access to tool wise. Once you do one side, the other side will be essentially the same. Read up plenty of creative solutions - if all else fails remove them and bring them to a shop.

After this you can further narrow issues.

Post by **SuperHerman** » 11 Jun 2017, 12:00

My mistake - I confused my cars and my XC90 was sold and I did this job a few years ago. The XC90 has only one control arm per side. Two bushings and an opening for a ball joint. So just remove the arm and replace it or the bushings. You may be able to leave the ball joint attached and press the two bushings in car. As I recall the ball joint on mine would not come out on either side.

One of your sway bar links also looks to have a torn boot. If so, try to clean it up and regrease or just replace. It will only clunk until it really gets bad.

One other possible cause is an upper strut mount bushing/seat being destroyed. Look at these - it will be obvious. I had shake on my BMW X3 and it was the top strut bushing.

marmotteNZ · Post by **marmotteNZ** » 12 Jun 2017, 12:21

Thanks a lot SuperHerman.
Sorry I did not reply earlier - somehow my notifications settings are off

I'll check about the level of my angle gear, and will also take pictures of my struts bushing seats.

I read that replacing the bushings themselves is a PITA - so I may well invest in the control arms completely. Prices go by a factor of >5x though, from $224 for the whole kit https://www.eeuroparts.com/Parts/51169/ ... oCbDfw_wcB) to >$300 for just one (volvoparts.com).

Changing the arms does not sound out of my reach - though I read somewhere that the AWD requires undoing all the engine mounts and lifting the engine - could somebody could comment on that??

I found a tutorial for the engine mounts. I could afford to replace the two that i can see (top and bottom/front) - but according to this tutorial there are "big ones" behind the engine and on the side and this looks way to involved for me (i.e.. needs special bar to lift/hold the engine).

I saw what bearing/hubs go form $60 to $250 a piece depending on brand. Are the cheap ones that bad?? At 205k miles I don''t expect to put so many years of use anyway:(

Last - as can be seen on the video, , the links to the steering rack can be moved by hand and have a clunky sound too. Is it something that needs replaced?

Thanks all for your help

marmotteNZ · Post by **marmotteNZ** » 12 Jun 2017, 13:08

doe snot look like the pictures on another thread - but I'll try to bounce the car too

Also, lower/front engine mount:

The torque mounts I think I can replace myslef, but this one (and the back one which I can;t even find LOL - not in overall right now) I would not be able I fear.

marmotteNZ · Post by **marmotteNZ** » 12 Jun 2017, 13:22

Superherman : moving the front end up and down with all my weight (I'm light framed though

)

What do you think?

Post by **SuperHerman** » 12 Jun 2017, 16:00

For your strut seats here is what Erikv11 stated in another post re this subject:

"How to test for a totally ruined spring seat: Open the hood, put a wrench on the top nut, on top of the strut tower. Try to rotate the top nut, although don't crank on it or force it. You should meet resistance. If not, if the nut spins, then the spring seat is wasted. If you meet resistance it may still be breaking down, but until it rotates it isn't completely gone. One of the spring seats is gone on my wagon right now, I am going to change it in the spring when it warms up."

You need to pull the cap off and then you should see a goldish color "+" shaped bolt. The video shows the your struts are working, but doesn't show if the spring seat is ruined.

Do a search for broken strut seats and you will see what happens and then you can figure out why the test works.

Replacing the entire arm or pressing out the bushing is up to you and your budget. Pushing out the bushing is not complicated - it is the same as most cars - getting the set up right and then pushing it out. If you replace just the bushings you can get OEM and save money. I think Myle makes a HD arm for the XC90 that looks reasonably priced.

As to your steering play - it is hard to tell when other issues are showing wear. It may be your inner tie rods are shot. I have also heard that the XC90 has a bolt that can be slightly tightened to reduce play if that is the issue.