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99 S70 GLT cranks but will not start Topic is solved

Help, Advice and DIY Tutorials on Volvo's P80 platform cars -- Volvo's 1990s "bread and butter" cars -- powered by the ubiquitous and durable Volvo inline 5-cylinder engine.

1992 - 1997 850, including 850 R, 850 T-5R, 850 T-5, 850 GLT
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Cricket502
Posts: 25
Joined: 23 September 2014
Year and Model: 99 S70 GLT
Location: USA

99 S70 GLT cranks but will not start

Post by Cricket502 »

Hey everyone, I'm reaching out because I'm running out of options here and haven't had my car for 3.5 weeks... was on my way back from vacation a few weeks ago when I stopped for gas, and my car hasn't really started since. I had about 1/4 tank when I stopped, had a lot of trouble filling up and just gave up after maybe 4 gallons (sometimes the gas pump kicks off due to the splash sensor or something... I might have a clogged vent or something, not sure. Likely not related). So I decided to move to a different gas station, since newer pumps for some reason have less of a problem with this.

Except I couldn't. I started the car, the RPMs rose like normal, then died about 2 seconds later. The second time I started the car I put my foot on the gas right after starting to try and keep the engine going, and the RPMs rose a bit higher as expected but then died after the same length of time. After that, my car just cranked and cranked but never started. No engine codes. The clock in the dashboard was also reset to 12:00 every time I tried to start, but the radio didn't lock so it wasn't a complete loss of battery power or anything. I towed it to a shop near home since I was 60 miles away from home at the time. They said that fuel delivery seems fine, the fuel injectors are getting power but have no pulse and aren't shooting fuel. So something is stopping the ECU from telling the injectors to squirt. The shop has tried replacing the camshaft position sensor and the crankshaft position sensor with no luck. They now think it is either a faulty ECU or broken wires somewhere, but they said the car isn't behaving like it's a broken wire. It's also a lot cheaper diagnostically to try the ECU next.

They said they can't 100% rule out the immobilizer, which was one of my initial ideas, but they don't think that's the problem. At this point, I'm tempted to have the car towed back to my house and try a new immobilizer (~$50) and then a cloned ECU (~$200) from ARD Tuning, since the shop has already done all the hard work of checking cam and crank sensors.

Has anyone else had similar symptoms (car initially dying on startup, cranking but not starting, and clock resetting without full battery loss) or have any ideas on how to diagnose or fix my car?

I'll post back once I figure it out... hate coming across open ended threads :x

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bmdubya1198
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Post by bmdubya1198 »

How many volts is the battery showing? I find it odd that the clock would be resetting every time, but you obviously aren't losing all power, especially if the engine keeps cranking.
It probably isn't an immobilizer issue, since that probably wouldn't even let you crank the engine.
ECU failures are uncommon, but not impossible. Cam and crank sensors are very common issues related to no spark/fuel issues, but you already tested that. If it hasn't been tested already, make sure you're getting voltage at the connectors for the cam/crank sensors. Also get an ECU pinout and check for continuity between the ECU connector pins and the cam sensor/crank sensor connectors.
Have you tested for spark?

Just some ideas. Otherwise, it couldn't hurt to try a new ECU. Unfortunately you'll have to get a cloned ECU instead of just grabbing one from the junkyard since you have a '99.
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aahmes57
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Post by aahmes57 »

I had symptoms with my 1998 s70 exactly like you described, but it ended up being one of the cam/crank shaft position sensors and it was also mentioned on this site that when positioning the wires for these sensors they should be routed in the same place to avoid any electrical interference. The 99 and 2000 also had throttle body and software update issues I think. Good luck.
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abscate
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Post by abscate »

That two second stall is hallmark immobiliser - but VIDA would store that and tell you that in software. You need to find a garage or one of our friendly MVS people nearby with VIDA to troubleshoot a 99, you can't do it by guessing.
After that, my car just cranked and cranked but never started

Hmmmm....read this thread.... :D

(Searched but could not find, sorry) Short version - I documented my 1999 starting with a 'bad chip' key - it would start and run for two seconds, then quit. After this, it would crank and not fire. Your symptoms sound identical to a immobisier fault. A common part here is the ignition switch - that could be resetting the clock and the voltage drop confusing the immobilizers - but Im guessing here, not diagnosing.



Hold off on the ECU, thats just throwing more unknowns into the pile, which is reverse diagnosis. (I like that, just made it up)
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Cricket502
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Year and Model: 99 S70 GLT
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Post by Cricket502 »

Thanks for the feedback so far everyone. The car's still at the shop so I'm not in a position to check pins or individual wires yet (and don't want to pay them to go hunting wires until I have to... which could be soon).

I agree on holding off for a bit on the ECU, since I'm not sure I've found any cases online where the ECU was truly at fault on these cars. So it seems pretty unlikely. The new immobilizer is supposed to arrive in 2-3 days, so it'd be awfully nice if that fixes everything. The shop said they didn't think it was the immobilizer because they were getting keystrokes when starting... not sure if that terminology refers to it cranking or something else. But your post abscate still makes me hopeful, haha.

I tried all 3 keys I have (replaced my ignition lock cylinder a year or so ago), so I know it's not a bad key. If the immobilizer isn't the problem, then I might have to pay the shop to start checking wires... the ECU is easy to do myself if it finally came to that, but I'm not electrically inclined in the least.

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Post by bmdubya1198 »

I agree, VIDA would be very helpful here. I would try to see if there is a shop in your area that has VIDA/DICE to get any codes.
Like I said, ECU couldn't hurt, but it should be a last resort. Otherwise it's a waste of money, because it's usually not the problem.
00 V70R Venetian Red/Charcoal M56 Swapped 214k
07 XC90 V8 AWD Sport Titanium Grey/Black 220k
92 245 White/Beige 249k
91 944 Turbo 175k
…and a bunch of other stuff
Sold-
03 S60 2.4T
00 S70 GLT
98 V70 GLT
93 944
98 S90
95 850 GLT
01 S60 2.4T
05 S60R M66
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Post by abscate »

Cricket502 wrote: 18 Jul 2017, 15:24 Thanks for the feedback so far everyone. The car's still at the shop so I'm not in a position to check pins or individual wires yet (and don't want to pay them to go hunting wires until I have to... which could be soon).

I agree on holding off for a bit on the ECU, since I'm not sure I've found any cases online where the ECU was truly at fault on these cars. So it seems pretty unlikely. The new immobilizer is supposed to arrive in 2-3 days, so it'd be awfully nice if that fixes everything. The shop said they didn't think it was the immobilizer because they were getting keystrokes when starting... not sure if that terminology refers to it cranking or something else. But your post abscate still makes me hopeful, haha.

I tried all 3 keys I have (replaced my ignition lock cylinder a year or so ago), so I know it's not a bad key. If the immobilizer isn't the problem, then I might have to pay the shop to start checking wires... the ECU is easy to do myself if it finally came to that, but I'm not electrically inclined in the least.
On a 99 the ECU has to be married to the rest of the car in software or you need to have an online date with Yagger/double bug to program your ECU over the Internet for less.

Hmmm..when you replaced your lock cylinder you had three new keys cut and reprogrammed, I wonder if that's related to the immobilizer failure
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Cricket502
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Year and Model: 99 S70 GLT
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Post by Cricket502 »

Sorry, not 3 new keys. I ordered the lock cylinder from FCP Euro and it came coded to my VIN, with a new key in the cylinder. So I have the original 2 keys from 1999 and 1 new key that came with the lock cylinder. All 3 work for my door locks and starting the car. That repair job was early last year and involved some dremel work getting the stupid shear bolts out in pieces, so it's always possible a wire got pinched/pulled or something got damaged in the process. If that's the case then it sure took its sweet time to fail.

I'm not sure if I understand the work involved with the ECU, I was mainly talking about getting it in and out of the car. From my understanding I can send my current ECU to a tuning shop, they can clone it to a new ECU core (assuming the "unique to my car" portion is undamaged) and then I could plug the new cloned ECU back into my car. Is there additional programming that needs to be done?

It looks like there's a shop about 20 mins away from where my car is now that has access to VIDA, so that's an option too. Or I could look into getting a copy of it and the tool myself, which might not be much more expensive than a tow and diagnostic fee...
Last edited by Cricket502 on 19 Jul 2017, 09:25, edited 1 time in total.

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abscate
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Post by abscate »

That should work on your ECU...disclaimer - Im not an expert on the cloning/reprogramming but several regulars here are and will comment if Im missing something.

Do you have all three keys on the same ring, or are the two original keys nearby when the new third key is used successfully? We might be getting close here....

:-)
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Cricket502
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Year and Model: 99 S70 GLT
Location: USA

Post by Cricket502 »

abscate wrote: 19 Jul 2017, 09:22 Do you have all three keys on the same ring, or are the two original keys nearby when the new third key is used successfully? We might be getting close here....

:-)
Nope, 2 of the keys normally stay home.

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