Learning's from trying to buy an XC90

[scot850]

I was looking at a 2005 XC90 2.5T with only about 100000 miles on it. Belonged to a young guy who had owned it for about 2.5 years and bought it from the original owner.

I had a quick look over it and took it for a decent run with the owner and he admitted to a couple of issues which were fairly minor. My biggest concern was the lack of dealer history in the last 20,000+ miles. Only had had oil changes (synthetic) and recently had 4 new wheel bearings fitted and brake pads. Work was done by a small general repair shop and no receipts, non-Volvo parts used and no idea what brands were used.

The main obvious issue was it had now missed 2 large services and was due a timing belt and water pump next year. 2 tires were also an issue as he had had a puncture requiring the tire to be replaced. Tire supplier had warranty on tires and under pressure agreed to replace all 4, but only had 2 in stock. He needed the car so had the 2 fitted and when he came back a while later they refused to replace the other 2!

With all that, I decided to pay the local Volvo dealer to do what they call a 'long form' inspection, which is basically a pre-sale inspection, but does not include a software scan for errors or out of date.missed updates. Cost was approx. $200 CDN.

All I can say is it is the best money I have spent. The young mechanic who fixed my 00 'R' suspension was also the mechanic that did the inspection. He did a very careful and thorough check. And the results were horrifying! Major issues were it needs 4 tires as the variation is too large, weeping RMS, no PCV vacuum due to a hidden split pipe (strange no error message). Without the parts and labour for the service catch up (parts close to $1400 CDN) the dealer estimate was $10,000 for a vehicle worth about $6000 at best!

But there is another point here, many of you (sometimes with justification) slam the dealers. I know the dealer well, and although we have a love/hate relationship, they respect me and I did work to help out for a few months in parts when they had a couple of guys off for a while so most of the staff know who I am.

Because of this, all the service advisers know me and know I am particular. The service adviser, did a history check on the servicing without being asked and found that shortly before the current owner bought the vehicle it was in for a knocking noise in the bottom of the engine. They thought it may be a rod knock. Customer declined an oil pan drop and inspection, and then sold the vehicle without declaring the possible issue as the noise had abated. Only reason I found out about that was because of my relationship with the dealer over the last 15 years.

The whole process just goes to show it doesn't matter how much you think you know, a second set of experienced eyes taking the heart decision out of the equation is well worth the cost and trying to maintain a working relationship with the dealer can be worthwhile.

Unfortunately, it looks less and less like an XC90 is in my future and another brand of SUV may be in my future. Dealer seldom retails XC90's for this reason as the hidden repair costs are usually large. Most go to auction. They do have one for sale (2011 3.2 with R pack). Vehcils interior looks like a dumpster and has a ugly dent/scrape in the hood. Asking price with 150,000km? $22,000 CDN. Ouch! On condition alone I would not buy the vehicle.

Neil.

[thebull]

Liked your post. It is very educating. You are smart person. Did you go to Valentine dealer?

Here is the story with mine XC90 2006 2.5T5 AWD.
We had to move to our new place and second car was needed. I already bought one 2009 XC90 3.2 R-design 2.5 years ago (from Calgary btw). It had 120 000km. Good car, I am doing only maintenance for now. Anyway, back to 2.5T5. The car was bought initially in Ontario, driven there for not even an year and moved to BC. No collision evidence. Checked carefully for that one despite that the carfax report was clean. I am the 5th owner. Car cost 6000 and had 205 000km. Nothing wrong at first. Everything was working except the AC. PCV and the Timing belt were due.... and let the saga begin. FYI, I knew it will have issues but I can fix Volvos well so no labor cost involved.
First I will say it was very neglect car. Terribly neglected. What a Shame. They did not even bother replacing the cabin filter. Last owner had some dog (obviously) and hair was everywhere. There were few moments where I was thinking it was driven by actual dogs. Actually now i know these were slumdogs.
Big cleaning and washing - done.
1. The super-awesome mechanics did service the PCV by my judging about 50 000km ago. There is nipple just before the turbo where PCV hose goes in. The did not connect it properly and it was unplugged. Means no PCV for some time. There was some sludge accumulated too. Lower drain hole was completely plugged and the canister was full with sludge. Took me 2 hours to clean it. PCV replaced. Done.
2. Timing belt - the water pump had some play already, it was Aisin, not Volvo. I noticed the oil accumulated at the lower part of the cover. During this service a replaced all of the oil pump and camshaft seals. Unfortunately as i drove the car oil reappear at the lower timing belt cover and around the engine mount there. CVVT leaking - hooray. Exhaust actuator was the one. Replaced both - just in case. Further...
3. Turbo charger was spitting oil. It wasn't something crazy, but it was big enough. I found rebuild one in Ohio. This person did great service for 400 USD (core - 100 USD) plus another 100 for upgraded compressor wheel (Oooh yeah).
4. Passenger side axle boot was torn. Unfortunately it was perhaps cheapest of the cheapest aftermarket axles and it was made not to be taken apart. Means new axle from Volvo.
5. Lets not forget the angle gear. Big problem on these cars. Transmission was replaced before. It is working fine btw and have external cooler. The super- awesome mechanics when dealing with transmission did not torque the angle gear properly. It became loose a bit and eat the splines. Upper bolts were not tight when i took it off. This is where I got really lucky. Young fellow in local junkyard was able to source me angle gear which was practically new. I could not believe when I pay 550 CAD for it. It is 3000 in the dealer.
6. AC condenser was leaking. Small pin hole. Replaced with Behr from FCP.
7. Replaced all brakes at last. Passenger side rear suspension link was bend. Replaced and the part was cheap.

It cost me only for parts - 3,000 Canadian and all the labor came from me.
The result is great. Car runs like crazy (no joke here). It goes very fast. Love it. It has 230 000km already. No sludge - oil is clear.

Conclusion - Be careful. 6000 dollars XC 90 are full with surprises. Perhaps spending 20-25,000 dollars is much better option unless you can do all the work yourself.

Greetings

[scot850]

I have wrenched on my Volvos for over 40 years. Newer ones like P2's (first gen S60, 2nd gen V70, 2nd gen XC70 and first gen XC90) I have not worked on so much. They are more complex but not so different to the older P80 models from 2000 and older I have worked on and currently have 2 of.

Working on an XC90 does not scare me, but finding and buying a good one without too much work and further cost investment is the challenge as XC90's develop more issues than the other P2 models. Theory is the XC90 was an after thought and the P2 chassis struggles with the extra weight causing more items to fail earlier. Good maintenance is the best if you can one with a full dealer history then you have a better chance, but always get the history checked. Many owners suddenly get a big quote for necessary repairs and decide to forgo them, and sell the vehicle instead and suddenly become unaware of the issue and telling the prospective new owner.

An example is an owner is selling a 08 XC90 3.2 AWD with about 120,000km on it and wants close to $15000 CDN for it. That price is way too high for the year, but what it has going for it is it has a dealer history, a full long form dealer inspection about 5-6 months ago and a claim it has any issues highlighted on the form repaired. Would I buy it without another inspection. NO!! Even in 6 months stuff can happen, and you have to wonder that unless the owner it as crazy as me, why would you do all that work and then sell a perfectly good vehicle?

Neil.

[oragex]

Valuable experiences. It's a great idea to look for a car serviced by the dealer and ask them kindly to read the servicing history on the computers.

[scot850]

It helps they know me very well and make 'allowances' around the rules sometimes to share info. Like I said, it helps to keep in a working relationship with your local dealer if you can.

Neil.

[scot850]

Went to look at another XC90 today, this time a 2007 XC90 V8. Pictures made the car look really clean, but asking price was a too high. Again this is where pictures of cars really lie on their condition. From the shot gun pellet appearance of the silver front under plate on the bumper, the multitude of stone chips on the front end around the grille and on the roof there were many untreated chips that have blown into blisters under the paint, to the 1" diameter dent in the roof between the top of the LH doors and the roof rails.

The small retailer selling it didn't think that the fact the front muffler had the bottom outer layer hanging off it or the engine check light on (some kind of emissions thing and not to worry about apparently). Brakes needed rotors and pads. Car was now worth less than $10000 with the work needed before it was inspected. Decided just to pass on it. Seller is delusional!

Neil.

[scot850]

Well it does not get any better. There was another 06 V8 for sale locally with 128,000km on it and full dealer and 1 owner history. Contacted the owner and he said he had had 3 offers on the vehicle including one for $1000 over the $11500 asking price. People up here are nuts! That was all from an advert with no pictures and no mention of a full dealer history. I still would not buy it without viewing the history as owner selling vehicles have poor memories of the faults the vehicle has.

Been speaking to another dealer with a low km 06 2.5T. Car has under 100,000km. I really don't understand the dealers here. They advertise a vehicle BEFORE inspecting it. They don't post pictures either. This vehicle turned out to have a crack in the block! I have never heard of that, and neither had Volvo so as the engine was trash, they have been asked to ship it back to Volvo. They are now fitting a higher mileage 2.5T motor from an 07 S60, presumably paid for by Volvo, and still have not inspected the vehicle?! I don't get the point of this process. I have been to look at 3 vehicles and none were inspected first and all 3 were sent to auction as the repairs were too high. Wasted a lot of my time and pissed me off. Clearly I am missing the business model which says screwing with prospective customers is a good idea! Also perhaps the dealers do have something in that they don't retail XC90's for good reason, mainly they can't sell them for a profit after all the repairs they need.

Neil.

[precopster]

I probably already shared this with you Neil but I purchased a 2006 XC90 2.5T with 175,000kms which was advertised as needing a transmission. It was bought at auction for around $1,950 plus shipping interstate (around $650) I thought it unlikely at these miles to have problems in the transmission area as many cars are rescued at this mileage by a full fluid change. Fluid was filthy black upon change.

It needed a LHS wheel bearing, some spring seats, a LHS ball joint, a driver's seat lower plastic trim, a rear RHS suspension arm, a PCV service (only the bottle and breather pipe in this case), a full transmission fluid change with synthetic (went from kicking to silky smooth overnight).

Lately things to fail are the rear tailgate lock (purchased used for $85 shipped), and in need of a exhaust side cam seal or CVVT hub or both due to a slow leak.

Can belt was done on time at 155K kilometres however the belt alone will be replaced when I do the CVVT due to contamination.
It owes me only around $4,000 including purchase.

I absolutely love driving the XC90. NO car is worth $10,000 plus but that's just my opinion (one of a severely afflicted cheapskate).

[cuhfs]

I bought mine off a private party for under 2K. Needed some work and tires for another 2K (and my labor). Seems to me like you'd be better off buying from a private party versus dealers and auctions. The dealers markup does not guarantee you wont have problems. Auctions you may not get to drive it enough to feel real problems.

[scot850]

The issue is not so much where to buy one, and the advice is appreciated, but even finding one worth buying from any source with a little wiggle room for the guaranteed work it will need. As those who have read my threads on my last 3 P80's will know they always need $2-3000 of work to get them back to servicing and repairs up to date to where I want them. Sure I could skimp on some stuff, but most of the cost is in parts but does not include all my time invested. One of those cars went to a family member so I did more than planned, the 2nd one I still have but had many bodged repairs (we would appear to have no truly competent honest mechanics around here) and the last is the ever wallet emptying 2000 'R'. I have no issue investing the time for repairs, but I would like a decent basis to start from. As I am not familiar with the XC90 but do know a fair amount on the P2 chassis, I would rather spend the $200 on a full pre-sale inspection at the dealer and hopefully catch the majority of large known issues. I can then work from there on whether the investment in time and money is worth it. Being retired helps as I am in no rush to find one, so hopefully a good one will turn up eventually and ideally a late low mileage 2.5T (so 06) with some service history, or caring owner.

Neil.