Is This a Blown Head - or Worse (if that's even possible)?

Post by **vjaneczko** » 23 Feb 2012, 19:53

So I installed fresh plugs and the knocking noise has been diminished, but still present. So my next guess is lifters - which means a bit of snake oil in the pan and a little crossing of the fingers

Post by **jblackburn** » 23 Feb 2012, 20:25

Add an Italian tune up to that list - go beat the snot out of it on some fun roads

Post by **vjaneczko** » 23 Feb 2012, 21:51

jblackburn wrote:Add an Italian tune up to that list - go beat the snot out of it on some fun roads

lol, that's how I got into this predicament in the first place. Me and the daughters were next to a big turbo diesel Ford - my oldest says; "Dad, race him for pinks!" Like I need encouragement . . .

Post by **MoVolvos** » 24 Feb 2012, 01:12

Hi vjaneczko,

The noise in the video had a foof-tick rather than clack noise so it could be lifters or exhaust leak. Buy some Swepco 306 15-40w some where and see if it goes away. If it does not than you got an oil change good for one year (for my own sanity). Swepcousa has an oil analysis program so Gov and Institutions can get 100,000 (CRAZY) change intervals. Below is an article on oil wars I found yesterday at a Nissan Titan Forum. Some people are discovering what the Porsche and Ferrari including Race Car guys have known forever. I've been using it for 14 years. When my mechanic replaced the head-gasket on my 3.0 Mitsubishi motor in our Grand Voyager with 50,000 on a rebuilt he saw hash marks in the cylinder walls. He is a second generation mechanic and have never seen it before. Read the entire article below.

Excerpt:
Swepco oil gains HP!!! We tested this theory!
http://www.clubtitan.org/forums/showthr ... 584&page=2

Brad had mentioned that the "oil wars" were raging over here so I thought I'd weigh in and let everyone take a shot at me too... I usually spend most of my time here in Performance and IRC-VK56 but I do want to take some time to back up his claim and clarify some points.

* My truck has just shy of 19K miles on it.
* My last 3 oil changes were RP 5W-30 with a new K&N filter each time. Before that all changes were at the dealership.
* I do not run oil more than 3 or 4K, even synthetic, and this last change was right at 3.5K miles.
*The new Swepco oil was also 5W-30 - their 306 Supreme Formula

We did 3 dyno pulls with the old RP and then the tech changed the oil and filter in-place on the dyno to keep from changing the setup and to let the truck cool back down. We did 3 more pulls and there was an immediate 10 HP increase with the Swepco and no other changes. Fact.

Although my truck usually feels like it's running better when I change the oil (or do almost any other maintenance) I can honestly say that I haven't felt a noticeable difference in power after the last 2 RP changes - there was a nice difference changing from the Nissan bulk oil to RP the first time but, not so much since then. Until now...

That said, I did not buy the Swepco to gain hp (although I'm not disappointed and won't give it back), Brad recommended it to me and then I spent a good deal of time on the phone with his buddy, the professional engine builder, discussing what's important to me - lubrication properties and the condition of internal components after extended use in various applications. The engines he has serviced after a life of Swepco lubrication have apparently been pristine internally and required much less attention than others. It's kind of a joke in their shop that they have to break in a freshly built engine with Kendal since it takes too long to get the rings to seat with the Swepco - they run the Kendal for a while, check things out, and then refill with Swepco before sending it out.

Another important thing to note is, Swepco is not primarily a performance or "racing" oil - it is intended for fleet vehicles and heavy/extended use applications to increase longevity and reduce operating costs by reducing maintenance costs (see the link above) - they don't advertise because they don't need to, they already have a huge commercial and government customer base. It apparently happens to work well in high performance applications too though so, it sounds like just what I'm looking for! Only time will tell and I will be getting my oil analyzed as close to 3k miles as possible when I change it. I'll post results if anybody is actually interested in facts.

I would recommend that everyone else continue to use their favorite "pet oil", particularly those I race here in Central Florida - I wouldn't want anyone else to take a chance on an unknown oil like this... (He is being facetious)

Blessings,

BKM

Post by **vjaneczko** » 19 Jul 2012, 18:06

Sorry about the time gap - been super busy. Last night, I and a buddy finished replacing all the valve stem seals (all were hard as a rock nasty!) and the lifters (six of the twenty were mushy toast). We also tackled a new turbo, water pump and timing belt, too! We thought it would be a grand moment when we fired it up and it would purr. Unfortunately, the noise has not gone away, as you'll hear in the video.

We were slap-happy tired when we finished the work and started it up so we just stared at it in disbelief, not knowing what to do next. As you can hear (and as I comment), the noise diminishes once the car returns to idle, but slowly comes back.

One thought was it could be a rod bearing, but the noise sounds like it's coming from the top corner, near the cam sensor. I’d think that problem would cause the noise to be lower, not at the top.

Another thought is the oil sump needs all new o-rings, but not sure if that would help with the noise. Maybe...

Someone mentioned exhaust leak, but not sure how that would cause a ticking sound – and would that mean the exhaust manifold is cracked, ‘just’ needs a gasket or something else?

Post by **rspi** » 19 Jul 2012, 18:29

After I put my head back together several of the lifters ticked. I did soak them in oil before I installed them. As the motor idled I could hear different lifters ticking and others being quiet. It ticked until I took the car down to the store 3.5 miles away. By the time I got to the store it was quite as a mouse. Try taking it for a drive. I don't think I drove over 55 mph.

byeboy · Post by **byeboy** » 19 Jul 2012, 18:40

Remove the distributor cap and rotor, and carefully check for any signs of "contact"., especially that funky inner rotor cover that is supposed to have an "O" ring to keep it from hitting the rotor,,,which would make this noise. This is when my nifty $2.99 Harbor Freight Stethoscope with the long extension on it really comes in handy.
I could also imagine an object in the Turbo inlet getting glancing taps form the impeller, but you say you replaced the turbo, and same noise as before...

I do not hear a rod at all, and would lean toward a bad bearing in the water pump, but you replaces that, an the same noise is there.

To me it sounds like a contact noise, like the old timing chains would give when they got slack and flew out against the cover when revving the motor.

Keep us posted about whatever it is!

Oddbob · Post by **Oddbob** » 19 Jul 2012, 18:50

My bet is the distributor and its affiliated parts.

That sounds nasty!

Post by **vjaneczko** » 19 Jul 2012, 19:10

The distributor is about a year old and went on clean with no struggles. When you say o-ring, do you mean the dust cover, the brown plastic cone-like thing that looks like an odd shield between the cap and the rotor? Besides the cam seal, there wasn't anything else in there. The noise sounds more metalic than plastic so I don't think that's causing it.

RSPI, the lifters were kept in their "sealed" containers which come in oil until it was time to install them. Just before we put the cover back on, we poured a little oil on each one, just to be sure. Maybe I'll put the bumper back on (pulled it to paint it) and give it a drive around town. Still nervous about putting it on the road with that noise.

And for the record; I used the excellent write-up from Whoa for the stem seal job - friggin' awesome, dude! I picked up the same spring compressor for the job and it worked quite well so if anyone needs to borrow it, just drop me a line.

Post by **MoVolvos** » 19 Jul 2012, 22:03

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A cheap test is to change to a thicker oil such as 10W-40 or 20W-50 and see if it quiets the noise. The weather is hot enough for the thicker oil and be sure to change the filter also. If the noise changes you know for sure it is in the valve train or engine.

Blessings,
BKM
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Is This a Blown Head - or Worse (if that's even possible)?

Re: Is This a Blown Head - or Worse (if that's even possible