850 engine replacement woes (& Updates)

[bigdaddylee82]

Replaced this:

Swapped these:

Since I had most of the work done already... so that's what was making the clunking sound. 250K+ miles is about time to change right?:

I guess it was time for new bumps, this is a cheaper alternative "experiment""

All new strut hardware:

No more clunk, clunk, rattle, rattle, and Julie is happy that the box of parts isn't in the living room anymore.

Also learned that my GLT doesn't have a cabin filter mount/adapter, what it did have was about 5 pounds of Pine needles stuffed around the fresh air intake.

We are moving to Ohio early Sept. and Lola is going to have to drive, so my current goal is to get everything up to snuff and ready for the trip.

Primary goals now are getting the cruise control operational again, rear shocks, and fuel filter. I've taken her on several ~300 mile round trip adventures since getting her running again, with out any issues (knock on wood) but not having cruise gets old after a while.


- Lee

[bigdaddylee82]

Hello MVS! It's been a while.

We've been in Ohio for a little over a month now, I wound up with so much to do, and plans changed, so Lola didn't make the drive. Originally a friend was going to caravan with us in one of our cars, help us unload and we were going to fly him back, but we couldn't make the schedule work; so Lola got trailered behind the Uhaul.

It was quite an expedition, I'd never driven anything that big in any kind of traffic, sure tractors, bob-trucks, and even a dump truck a few times but never for more than a few miles or in any kind of traffic. It was an experience, but not one I want to repeat anytime soon. Julie said several times that I was Snowman, and she was the Bandit, too bad we didn't have CBs, but she did a fine job of running interference/blocking for me.

Our convoy was the 26' Uhaul pulling Lola the Volvo on the trailer behind it, and Julie following in her TDI Jetta:

I was thankful that we got a cool truck with a Dinosaur on it, I saw a lot of ghey butterfly, dragonfly, and flower Uhauls:

The Uhaul full of all of our junk, pulling the Volvo behind it averaged 6.4 miles to the gallon the only time I figured it (I didn't want to know anymore after the first tank). Filling that 60 gallon tank will make you sick to your stomach. Julie followed behind, "drafted" me in her Jetta, we managed to stay between 60-65 mph on all but the worst of the hills. She had to take this picture to gloat, gotta love TDI:

Everyone we've met so far has been very friendly, and all of our neighbors seem nice. We venture a little further exploring every day. It's starting to get cold already (cold to us anyway) and I'm not looking forward to this winter.


Lola, has developed a few issues. I've had to replace a little bit of coolant every now and then every since the original engine swap, and I replaced the radiator not too long after the swap. I was originally contributing this to the system working the air out, but the problem has just gotten worse. I'm refilling the reservoir about once a week now, some times a little longer depending on how much I drive. I can't find a leak for the life of me, and the oil needs changed, but it looks like oil, it's not milky, so I don't think it's the head-gasket. Further evidence of it not being the head-gasket is the sweet smell of antifreeze when stopped at a light after the engine is warm. So it's got to be an external leak somewhere for me to smell it right? I'm still using all original radiator hoses, maybe I need to just start replacing hoses.

Also I've got an exhaust leak, I haven't tried real hard to hunt it down yet, but the fumes sure makes you pray for a short stoplight. When I put the exhaust manifold on the new motor I used new gaskets between it and the block, and torqued to spec, then retorqued a week or so after I started daily driving it again, i.e. after a few good heat cycles. I did reuse the gasket between the manifold and the tailpipe but I coated it with exhaust sealer before sandwiching it back in; so I don't think it's leaking.

Anyway I've got some more investigating to do. I'm all ears for advice on the Mystery of the Vanishing Coolant.



- Lee

[C@lvin]

Further evidence of it not being the head-gasket is the sweet smell of antifreeze when stopped at a light after the engine is warm. So it's got to be an external leak somewhere for me to smell it right? I'm still using all original radiator hoses, maybe I need to just start replacing hoses.

While it is possible that you could be leaking under the hood and smelling it through the cabin air intake (especially after geting all the straw out!) it would seem more likely to me that you have a heater core leak. Try running the air on the coolest setting for a few minutes and then turning to the hottest setting. If you get the coolant smell at that point it is indicative of heater core leak(s). You can also check the carpet in the front footwells to see if they are damp or wet with coolant.

By the way, I enjoy your updates.....

[jblackburn]

That picture alone makes me want to spring for the TDI over the 2.0T if I end up getting a VW in the near future. And the nice thing about TDI drivers is they keep up with traffic/go the speed limit unlike those annoying hybrid drivers...while still getting awesome gas mileage

Calvin is right on with the heater core...check the bottom of the coolant expansion tank as well. I'd get some new radiator hoses for it too, though...you don't want to risk blowing those in the middle of nowhere. Mine were pretty squishy when I first got the car, so I changed them within months of getting it. Been there, done that.

Good luck in your new home!

[bigdaddylee82]

While it is possible that you could be leaking under the hood and smelling it through the cabin air intake (especially after geting all the straw out!) it would seem more likely to me that you have a heater core leak. Try running the air on the coolest setting for a few minutes and then turning to the hottest setting. If you get the coolant smell at that point it is indicative of heater core leak(s). You can also check the carpet in the front footwells to see if they are damp or wet with coolant.

By the way, I enjoy your updates.....

I had thought about the heater core, it is pretty ancient by now, but based on the amount of fluid I'm loosing I convinced myself that if it were the heater core I'd be able to go fishing in my floor boards by now. I typically don't smell coolant unless I'm stopped while idling or moving slow. I'll pull the carpets back and take a look anyway.

I'm glad you like the updates, I question myself about posting them sometime, since the swap is done, but it's kind of like a journal for me. Cathartic to look back on all that Lola and I have been through.

That picture alone makes me want to spring for the TDI over the 2.0T if I end up getting a VW in the near future. And the nice thing about TDI drivers is they keep up with traffic/go the speed limit unlike those annoying hybrid drivers...while still getting awesome gas mileage

Calvin is right on with the heater core...check the bottom of the coolant expansion tank as well. I'd get some new radiator hoses for it too, though...you don't want to risk blowing those in the middle of nowhere. Mine were pretty squishy when I first got the car, so I changed them within months of getting it. Been there, done that.

Good luck in your new home!

I can't recommend the newer TDIs enough ('09 +) I don't have much experience with the older versions. I try and drive it as often as I can, the off the line torque is awesome. It's fun to drive, you can drive it like a teenager, treat every stoplight like a drag Christmas tree, and still pull off high 30s, low 40s mpg. I wish we had gotten the 6 speed sometimes, but it's "Julie's car" and she couldn't drive a stick to save her life, so the DSG is the next best thing.

I checked the expansion tank already, it doesn't appear to be leaking, but it's the original hose too. I'll check on that heater core, not a job I look forward to if it is bad. I should have got new hoses to begin with... looks like FCP's going to get even more of my money.


- Lee

[Schmitty]

I was proud of myself for changing my fuel filter and spark plugs. I learned so much from your posts in this thread, bigdaddylee82. Seems as though I have a lot to learn and a lot of experience to gain still.

[bigdaddylee82]

I was proud of myself for changing my fuel filter and spark plugs. I learned so much from your posts in this thread, bigdaddylee82. Seems as though I have a lot to learn and a lot of experience to gain still.

Guess I should check up on this thread more often. I'm glad this headache was a learning experience for more than just me. I know I've said I was reluctant to make posts/updates since the initial "engine replacement" is done (been almost a year now, boy does time fly) but if there are still folks reading it I guess I'll keep updating it.



Lola has been doing well, her first Ohio winter was pretty tough. The Jetta resides in our 1 car garage, and the Volvo gets to stay out in the parking lot. Bring a sun-bleached Southern car up North for a Winter and you get this:

DSC04312.JPG (208.42 KiB) Viewed 3392 times

There were some spots that no longer had clear coat on them before we moved, but after having sat with a small glacier on it for about 3 weeks, those small spots became quite large. I think I'll try and do an O'Reilly's/NASON home paint job on at least the hood and trunk later this spring.

There have been other issues, as stated in previous posts, I still cannot find the coolant leak, but still smell it. I have inspected the heater core numerous times, but see no signs of a leak. It's been so cold in our little uninsulated garage, that it was hard to get motivated to do much, so I've just been collecting parts. Asked for Volvo parts for Christmas and my birthday

Now that it's warm, and the rain has finally stopped, I've just about ran out of excuses. I've got a pretty good collection for a weekend project or two:

DSC04317.JPG (223.35 KiB) Viewed 3392 times

So the plans are: new heater core and coupler thingy, all new coolant hoses, coolant level sensor, ignition coil, some engine mounts, subframe bushings, an antenna that will actually telescope, and I've got a new fuel filter hiding somewhere in the garage. I think once my car quits stinking like antifreeze, and vibrating like a magic fingers bed I might enjoy driving it again.

Wish me luck!


- Lee

[jrobles007]

Great Post, I too will be venturing into replacing my boat anchor (aka: blown engine). I just read all of your posts and enjoyed them. Is it easier to drop the engine with the engine support from the bottom of the car or using an engine hoist and to place the replacement engine from the top of the engine compartment?

Also, on your heater core replacement; If your 85 is similar to my 94 your have two aluminum heater core lines leading from the fire wall to the heater core. The lines can get corroded and leak into your floor board. When I repaired my broken heater lines I noticed that there is a catch pan that will direct coolant to the outside of car if you heater core leaks. Thus if you smell coolant but your carpets are dry it is likely to be the heater core. If you have wet carpets you may have broken/leaky heater lines, these are outside of the catch pan. I cut the aluminum lines and used 5/8" heater hose instead of spending $ on the Volvo type lines.

Long Story short, this was the demise of my engine. It appears that the previous owner overheated the engine twice and never discovered the reason for the overheating engine. Heater core was replaced without noticing the large hole on the backside of one of the heater core lines. I wanted a fixer upper and that is what I have. I will be doing the exact same work on my 850 as you have. Last engine I swapped was a 71 318 Dodge. The 850 don't look like my old Dodge.

[bigdaddylee82]

Great Post, I too will be venturing into replacing my boat anchor (aka: blown engine). I just read all of your posts and enjoyed them. Is it easier to drop the engine with the engine support from the bottom of the car or using an engine hoist and to place the replacement engine from the top of the engine compartment?

Also, on your heater core replacement; If your 85 is similar to my 94 your have two aluminum heater core lines leading from the fire wall to the heater core. The lines can get corroded and leak into your floor board. When I repaired my broken heater lines I noticed that there is a catch pan that will direct coolant to the outside of car if you heater core leaks. Thus if you smell coolant but your carpets are dry it is likely to be the heater core. If you have wet carpets you may have broken/leaky heater lines, these are outside of the catch pan. I cut the aluminum lines and used 5/8" heater hose instead of spending $ on the Volvo type lines.

Long Story short, this was the demise of my engine. It appears that the previous owner overheated the engine twice and never discovered the reason for the overheating engine. Heater core was replaced without noticing the large hole on the backside of one of the heater core lines. I wanted a fixer upper and that is what I have. I will be doing the exact same work on my 850 as you have. Last engine I swapped was a 71 318 Dodge. The 850 don't look like my old Dodge.

I've never pulled the engine out the top. This swap, is the one and only I've ever done on any Volvo. I looked at it long and hard, and read a lot on the internet before deciding to approach it the way I did. I fully believe that I would do it just the same were I to attempt to do it again. Brake Hoses, struts, steering linkage, and about eight bolts are all that's holding the engine/trans/subframe in place, and a bunch of hoses and wires too of course. I didn't have the equipment/celling height in my garage to get my car high enough in the air to pull the engine out from the front of the car, but with the inner fender well removed, I was able to raise the car high enough to drag the whole assembly out the passenger side wheel well. One other thing I did a little different from others I've seen, is I raised the car, detached as much as I could, then lowered the assembly with the cherry picker, as apposed to lifting the car off of the assembly. This let me initially lower the engine/trans/subframe just enough (maybe 8 to 10 inches) to gain easy access to a lot of wires and hoses that would have been a real pain to try and remove with the assembly still attached. Also replacing all the wear items, i.e. timing belt assembly, water pump, etc. is soooo much easier with the engine out of the car.

Clear as mud?

If you've swapped an engine before, it's really not significantly different. Just keep track of parts, label things, and take your time. Also there's an extra bolt on the transmission cooler lines (tab that's attached to the line in about the middle) be sure you get it, learned that one the hard way. Before this, I had helped swap a 5.7l Vortec in a later model Chevy truck, helped put a 4.3l/700R4/Atlas II in a Jeep YJ, and various and sundry repairs and replacements on all kinds of farm equipment and vehicles. I'd gladly swap engines in an 850 again before having to split an International 806 in two again.


I did all coolant hoses, coolant level sensor, heater core, and the heater core coupler on the fire wall a few weeks ago. That coupler is such a headache. After modifying the coupler to do the "Modified Lee 850 Heater Hose Coupler" It was a little easier, but it dawned on me wile I was about done and putting the torx screws back in on the engine side plate of the coupler, that I should have just bought some rubber hose and grommets. That would have been tons easier, and if I ever have to do this again, that is exactly what I will do. On the plus side I no longer smell coolant at every stop light.

I'm thinking about doing a write up on the heater hose coupler replacement, I had a hard time finding much on it, what I did find, I found to be lacking, but that's just my opinion.


- Lee

[bigdaddylee82]

Also did my upper fire wall engine torque arm mount. Old one was dry-rotted and cracked. I'm trying to fix my "Magic Fingers" vibrating car, I've got some other mounts yet to replace, but I'm hoping to have much better results with the other mounts than the one I replaced. The vibration actually got worse after replacing it.

You can see here how much bigger/beefier the new one is than the old, I'd guess the old one is the original one from '94.

850 Fire Wall Torque Arm Mount Comparison.JPG (195.09 KiB) Viewed 3132 times

Here you can see how worn out the old one was.

850 Fire Wall Torque Arm Mount Worn.JPG (230.37 KiB) Viewed 3132 times

I guess replacing it just moved the vibration to another mount/mounts and exasperated the problem. I have new subframe bushings, and both front mounts in my box 'o parts to replace. I need to get a torque arm bushing, rear mount, and transmission mount/busings so I can just do it all at once. Until then, I'll continue to slap it into neutral at every stop light, or start charging passengers for admission.

Put a new telescoping antenna in too, may sound silly, but seeing that thing actually disappear again when you shut the car off puts a smile on my face. There had been a kinked ugly antenna sticking up back there for years.


- Lee