Vida CEM swapping

[WhizzMan]

I only have experience with pre-facelift auto boxes, so please inform me what the difference is. Are you talking about the AW55 and TF80 both, or only the TF80?
In pre facelift geartronic is both a different programming of the TCM and a different GSM. You need both to get the functionality. I would not be surprised if you need to have the GSM send a "I am set to manual" signal before the TCM will accept shift commands. If you want to do this without the GSM I am assuming you will need something to tell the CEM/TCM that you want to change to manual and put the TCM in "drive" to achieve manual shifting.
Given the cost of scrapyard parts, I think it would be more practical to just get geartronic bits and concentrate on that, buy maybe you want to do this just because you can?

[dikidera]

It's for the facelift AW55 fwd. Before I buy anything I would ensure it works first.

I am basing my decisions on the programming and DHA



We can see here that DriverModeSwitchesKlink which is updated via CAN or LIN I can't tell as of yet, has several states. One is GSM on and the other is Increase Shift or Decrease shift, based on which QuickShift is enabled or not and the command executed.

The wiring diagrams I found online seem to indicate that there is indeed LIN communication between GSM and TCM and is not retranslated by CEM.

@vtl. I have a question. At around 10 ECM params using dynamic records I am seeing bus busy errors on the CAN bus and the ECM is pausing them.
Additionally, with just 5 TCM params at 200ms update interval, I only get 4, the 5th does not get sent at all.

send_can_message2([0xCC, 0x6E, 0xA5, 0xD7, 0x01, 0x00, 0x00, 0x00]) # Lockup CAN 1 byte

send_can_message2([0xCC, 0x6E, 0xA5, 0x90, 0x01, 0x00, 0x00, 0x00]) # ShiftSollInfo 1 byte
send_can_message2([0xCC, 0x6E, 0xA5, 0xD8, 0x01, 0x00, 0x00, 0x00]) # Pressure line 1 byte
send_can_message2([0xCC, 0x6E, 0xA5, 0xCC, 0x01, 0x00, 0x00, 0x00]) # Slip speed difference RPM 2 bytes
send_can_message2([0xCC, 0x6E, 0xA5, 0x13, 0x01, 0x00, 0x00, 0x00]) # Torque control/Torque limit 4 bytes

Have you observed such issues with DDD?

[dikidera]

I did some more digging recently as some things don't make sense and my bullshit meter is going off in conjunction with people smarter than I, but the file for increased horsepower for up to 188hp on the NA engines doesn't make sense, the degree of timing is increased by just 2 degrees advancement, this cannot produce 10% of power, at most 2% if that even. So I wonder if BSR ever did other changes perhaps to VVT maps to produce more than these 2%.
Yeah the file I have is not necessarily their file, but 2 degree of timing bump is peanuts. Additionally more fuel thus richer AFR=slower flame propagation which negates the timing advance or rather it requires more timing advance to get the same power.

Anyway, in my digging of the Denso Le.2 PCB board as I was tracing the signals. It turns out there is a knock sensing IC called Denso MT6630 on the board, I am guessing this processes/mixes signals to detect if a certain threshold is met, and then is output/signalled to the main SH7055 MCU. There are no schematics or information about it on the internet, but that is it's likely purpose as the knock sensor signal goes through an RC filter first and then into the IC. The reason I did this tracing is because I wanted to find where the knock signals are and the logic/maps behind knock retarding.

[prometey1982]

BSR is just marketing pease of shit. They declares 250 bhp for turbo 2.5 engine. But 14t turbo can't pump so much airflow to produce this number of HP.

[dikidera]

I am starting to see this, a guy from sweden gave me a tuned Hn.2 with purported 188hp, there is only 2 degrees of timing increases, but also AFR increase, more fuel means slower flame propagation which means more timing is required, which negates more or less the benefit of increasing timing.

So it is possible that BSR lied all these years about what was truly possible on the 2.4i and at best the dyno would show 172 173hp if that..

[WhizzMan]

The way these companies come up with "+10%" (or hp for that matter) is that they take one point in the graph, for instance 1800rpm and most certainly not the peak HP/torque point, where they have this +10% gain. Quite often, this is a specific point where the manufacturer had to tune back the engine quite severely to meet certain emissions or noise levels, so by just undoing that bit they get the power back that was there all along. In other words, they never claim 10% all over the curve but they cherrypick the most beneficial RPM level. People that don't know engine tuning tend to think that if they buy a bunch of bolt on parts and an off the shelf tune that they can just add all these claims and have "one meeelion" horsepower from a stage 1 chip, air filter and sports catback.

[dikidera]

Well..I do have some ideas. I already polished my head and did some very light porting(especially the valve bowl area), just to remove surface imperfections. Then I was thinking of removing the PS pump and replacing it with an electric one again from Volvo, but moved to the area of the air intake box. This should give me 3-5hp and also allow me perfect control of the handling feedback via CAN. But before that I did want to increase my power a bit such as with timing.

[WhizzMan]

Depending on how modern your car exacly is, you will gain exactly 0hp with your mods, without actually also changing parameters or values in the ECM. ME7 and above use a model and will limit intake air and fuel to the requested power. Older cars still have "load cells" but are easier to trick into giving more power without reprogramming. Power is requested via the throttle pedal. Making the engine capable of producing more power will not request this, so all you will gain is maybe a slightly better fuel economy. Not completely true because oversimilified, but for all intents and purposes accurate enough. Because of the model used in ME7 and above, ignition timing is already very optimized and you can't expect to gain anything significant there unless you change parameters like cam profile, ignition chamber volume, turbo compressor upgrades and such substantially, which will require an update to the models paramters.

[dikidera]

My ECM is Denso, I can't say for certain as I have no prior tuning experience and I just dived in deep, but the car is using I believe the load model, most tables are based on Load. And load changes based on the throttle plate and various other things. The calculations are complex and really beyond me as there are two or three different methods used, there is load based on both map and maf, or just the map. I haven't studied their relationship.

But either way, at some point you are WOT and can't possibly open it more, at this point it's up to the engines' ability to breathe that will determine if any more air could possibly enter(without the use of FI)


This here is just one of the timing maps of a file I have. RPMxLOAD or loadxRPM.

Throttle is controlled via Pedal position sensor(well through CAN), in reality my car has a pedal limiter, it has a physical limiter preventing more than 74% pressing, whilst the throttle request maps go all the way from 0 to 100 in the axis for pedal position.
Interestingly, the throttle module always reports 100% open throttle past 40% pressed pedal which I am unsure how to think of it.
The throttle maps that affect 170->140hp behavior are more like multipliers to be honest.

Furthermore the timing maps are different based on a few conditions including I believe how far advanced the vvt is. And there are two per each condition, and depending on the difference between the two, there is a small very small multiplication based on the difference of each.

[emericaz]

Hi! Someone can check my 2003 CEM dump for me? This is my first try on something like this and i dont want to brick it.