Wagon set up vs. Sedan set up

code-man850 · Post by **code-man850** » 31 Aug 2009, 16:04

I am taking this "New Business" class and I had to chose a "make believe" business. I chose to open a shop/website (like IPD) but "Wagons Only" would specialize in just that. I need some more info on how to set up a wagon diferently (i.e. suspension set up, weight dist., tire/wheel sizes). Thanks for anybody's input.

FCPEURO · Post by **FCPEURO** » 01 Sep 2009, 09:20

When it comes to performance, I don't believe you would set it up any differently then a sedan. Why don't you just include both wagons and sedans.

code-man850 · Post by **code-man850** » 01 Sep 2009, 09:34

Theres no advantage to setting up the suspension or wheels differently? Even though the wagons got a big a*s and lots of extra weight being thrown around back there. Now I could see engine performance not being any different than a sedan, but (ie stiffer springs, stiffer valved shocks, bigger wheels and tires to give a bigger footprint for the weight back there)

Post by **matthew1** » 01 Sep 2009, 11:32

When I read Car & Driver -- from what I remember -- modern wagons tend to have 200-300 pounds more weight. Make of that what you will.

Off topic: Volvo 850 wagons got banned from that 1990s Euro track racing league (name?) because they had a distinct aerodynamic advantage over BMV, Audi, etc, sedans.

[edit: changed "road course" to "track"]

GrumpyOldMan · Post by **GrumpyOldMan** » 04 Sep 2009, 22:52

why wagons only.

Post by **tjts1** » 05 Sep 2009, 22:56

matthew1 wrote:When I read Car & Driver -- from what I remember -- modern wagons tend to have 200-300 pounds more weight. Make of that what you will.

Off topic: Volvo 850 wagons got banned from that 1990s Euro road course racing league (name?) because they had a distinct aerodynamic advantage over BMV, Audi, etc, sedans.

The 850 wagon was never banned from the BTCC (british touring car championship). Volvo chose to use the wagon in the series because it posed NO disadvantage compared to the sedans under the rules at the time and was great for marketing. After 1995 the BTCC allowed spoilers for the first time so long as they didn't stick up above roof height or behind the rear bumper. This put the wagon at a distinct disadvantage to sedans so volvo switched to sedans.
Volvo didn't become truly successful in the series until 1998 when it switched to the smaller S40 body which had a much smaller frontal area. They retained the 2.0 five cylinder NA 850 engine in the S40. While the 850 suffered from a drag and handling disadvantage because of it's large size, it was well ahead of it's competitors in engine development. At one point the NA 5 cyl 2.0 engine was making 325hp when the other cars were around 280hp. The large 850 wagon often had the highest top speed on the straights because of it's HP advantage.
Check out the august issue of 'Racecar Engineering' for a very good article on the subject.

Post by **polskamafia mjl** » 06 Sep 2009, 03:19

How did they get a 5 cyl NA engine to make over 300HP?!

Post by **tjts1** » 06 Sep 2009, 12:36

polskamafia mjl wrote:How did they get a 5 cyl NA engine to make over 300HP?!

TWR (the company responsible for the BTCC volvos) used a liberal interpretation of the 'stock cyl head' rule to build a monster head with larger valves, 3 times the valve lift, larger ports and 9000rpm. The point of the article was how a rule meant to save money and keep the field competitive (stock cyl head rule) had the opposite effect of pushing one team to buld a $15000 cyl head that was techically legal but defeated the spirit of the rule. I have the article at home. I'll scan it and post it here soon.

Post by **matthew1** » 07 Sep 2009, 14:35

tjts1 wrote:The 850 wagon was never banned from the BTCC (british touring car championship). Volvo chose to use the wagon in the series because it posed NO disadvantage compared to the sedans under the rules at the time and was great for marketing.

Thanks for the clarification and details, tjts1.