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Problem after transmission fluid change

Help, Advice and DIY Tutorials on Volvo's P80 platform cars -- Volvo's 1990s "bread and butter" cars -- powered by the ubiquitous and durable Volvo inline 5-cylinder engine.

1992 - 1997 850, including 850 R, 850 T-5R, 850 T-5, 850 GLT
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misha
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Re: Problem after transmission fluid change

Post by misha »

erikv11 wrote:misha did you read the whole thread? The story changes back and forth, not so simple ...
Yes erikv11,i read the whole thread a few times trying to find a solution and nothing else is falling to my mind except a bad transmission or slipping cv joints.

The more i read the thread i'm pretty much sure that transmission fluid change is the only culprit,assuming that cv joints are in good shape and that they are not slipping.

The fact is that all of transmission problems begun with a fluid change.I don't think that Maf,o2 sensors,Sas system have something to do with that because i was personally experienced their symptoms of failure and they don't manifests like Francois850's problems.
'97 850 2.5 20v / fully equipped / Motronic 4.4 from the factory / upgraded with S,V,C,XC70 instrument cluster / polar white wagon
History of Volvos in the family:
'71 144 S
'73 144 De Luxe
'78 244 DL
'78 244 DL
'79 244 GLE
'85 340 GLS

Francois850
Posts: 64
Joined: 21 February 2013
Year and Model: 97 850 Non Turbo
Location: Fort Worth, TX

Post by Francois850 »

Well based on that test I did.... going full throttle less than 5 sec on D holding the brakes, I get 1600 RPM instead of 2600. According to Volvo, it points to a bad torque converter or a plugged catalytic converter. More than 2600 RPM would be a slipping transmission if I remember well. I did watch videos where the transmission slips and the RPM rev, my car does not do that...
I am running out of idea, except going to see a pro in a shop... Before I did the fluid change I did notice a fairly noticeable lack of power / performance and that was after I replaced both Oxygen sensor and the code triggered back then was P0422 Main catalyst below threshold... So, I am pretty sure my problem is a clogged cat. Initially my first acceleration is quite ok because the exhaust is not under pressure but quickly the pressure must build up, creating a backpressure and ruining the performance.
I still hope the transmission is not the issue, that would be bad news.
This is getting so frustrating!!!!! Thanks for all the inputs, ideas!

Francois850
Posts: 64
Joined: 21 February 2013
Year and Model: 97 850 Non Turbo
Location: Fort Worth, TX

Post by Francois850 »

erikv11 wrote:
Francois850 wrote:...I did not unplug the MAF because without it the car runs like hell...
This is quite unusual. The car should struggle just a bit then the ECU goes into a default mode and the car runs smoothly. Did you unplug it first, then start it up, then give it a minute for the idle to smooth out? If so, then I wonder if there is an ECU issue, or the main issue is an AFR problem that doesn't play nice with the default AFR's.

Sure there are no vacuum leaks? (I know, you've checked a hundred times ... :) )

misha, I thought OP later said the trans doesn't slip, that he was mistaken about that.

If there is a vaccum leak I can't find it. AFR? What is AFR?

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erikv11
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Post by erikv11 »

I hear ya on the ca leak, and I believe you looked carefully for vac leaks, I just still wonder if there is one hiding. A shop might go to a smoke test.

By AFR I mean Air:Fuel Ratios. They get thrown off if there is unmetered air in the system, e.g.by a bad MAF or a vac leak.
'95 854 T-5R, Motronic 4.4, 185k
'98 V70, T5 tune-injectors-turbo, LPT engine, 304k, daily driver
'06 S60 R, 197k
'07 XC70, black, 205k
'07 XC70, willow green, 212k
'99 Camry V6 :shock: 153k
gone: '96 NA 850 210k, '98 NA V70 182k, '98 S70 NA 225k, '96 855 NA 169k

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misha
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Post by misha »

erikv11 wrote:...misha, I thought OP later said the trans doesn't slip, that he was mistaken about that.
The only conclusion i could make on the fact when he said that he pushed the gas pedal and both rpm & speedometer are moving... and the car is not accelerating,is that transmission is not doing it's job.It is not transmitting the power on the wheels.

With bad o2,or maf it cannot have that power loss like he describes especially with both being brand new and oem.If they were aftermarket,it's possible...but with oem it can't be.
'97 850 2.5 20v / fully equipped / Motronic 4.4 from the factory / upgraded with S,V,C,XC70 instrument cluster / polar white wagon
History of Volvos in the family:
'71 144 S
'73 144 De Luxe
'78 244 DL
'78 244 DL
'79 244 GLE
'85 340 GLS

User avatar
misha
Posts: 5379
Joined: 7 December 2008
Year and Model: '97 850 2.5 20v
Location: Serbia
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Post by misha »

Francois850 wrote:... Before I did the fluid change I did notice a fairly noticeable lack of power / performance and that was after I replaced both Oxygen sensor and the code triggered back then was P0422..
Did you reset ecu when you replaced o2 sensors?A simple negative cable disconnection for a 10-15minutes,then push a brake pedal to empty all of the remaining power from the circuits and then reconnect the cable.
After that...you need to re-learn the ecu like this:
computer relearn procedures.pdf
(33.82 KiB) Downloaded 85 times
'97 850 2.5 20v / fully equipped / Motronic 4.4 from the factory / upgraded with S,V,C,XC70 instrument cluster / polar white wagon
History of Volvos in the family:
'71 144 S
'73 144 De Luxe
'78 244 DL
'78 244 DL
'79 244 GLE
'85 340 GLS

Francois850
Posts: 64
Joined: 21 February 2013
Year and Model: 97 850 Non Turbo
Location: Fort Worth, TX

Post by Francois850 »

Well based on that test I did.... going full throttle less than 5 sec on D holding the brakes, I get 1600 RPM instead of 2600. According to Volvo, it points to a bad torque converter or a plugged catalytic converter. More than 2600 RPM would be a slipping transmission if I remember well. I did watch videos where the transmission slips and the RPM rev, my car does not do that...
I am running out of idea, except going to see a pro in a shop... Before I did the fluid change I did notice a fairly noticeable lack of power / performance and that was after I replaced both Oxygen sensor and the code triggered back then was P0422 Main catalyst below threshold... So, I am pretty sure my problem is a clogged cat. Initially my first acceleration is quite ok because the exhaust is not under pressure but quickly the pressure must build up, creating a backpressure and ruining the performance.
I still hope the transmission is not the issue, that would be bad news.
This is getting so frustrating!!!!! Thanks for all the inputs, ideas!
Re-posting this as I don't know if you guys did read it... ;-)

Francois850
Posts: 64
Joined: 21 February 2013
Year and Model: 97 850 Non Turbo
Location: Fort Worth, TX

Post by Francois850 »

misha wrote:
Francois850 wrote:... Before I did the fluid change I did notice a fairly noticeable lack of power / performance and that was after I replaced both Oxygen sensor and the code triggered back then was P0422..
Did you reset ecu when you replaced o2 sensors?A simple negative cable disconnection for a 10-15minutes,then push a brake pedal to empty all of the remaining power from the circuits and then reconnect the cable.
After that...you need to re-learn the ecu like this:
computer relearn procedures.pdf
Yes I did reset the ECU and passed inspection 2 days after with only 1 non readiness... Had to reset / clear codes to have a chance to pass inspection. But, the day before I passed inspection I wrote a note stating : car lacks "punch" and I said earlier it was before the trans fluid change. Of course it got much worse days later.... going from lack of punch to terrible acceleration.

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misha
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Post by misha »

The only code stored is po422?Are there any pending codes?
'97 850 2.5 20v / fully equipped / Motronic 4.4 from the factory / upgraded with S,V,C,XC70 instrument cluster / polar white wagon
History of Volvos in the family:
'71 144 S
'73 144 De Luxe
'78 244 DL
'78 244 DL
'79 244 GLE
'85 340 GLS

Francois850
Posts: 64
Joined: 21 February 2013
Year and Model: 97 850 Non Turbo
Location: Fort Worth, TX

Post by Francois850 »

misha wrote:The only code stored is po422?Are there any pending codes?
Right now the only code I have is P0410, nothing else, nothing pending but please know that driving over 40 mph is nearly impossible so not all test were completed.

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