We trying to fix a 1983 volvo 244 model, prob fuel intake

sergitin32 · Post by **sergitin32** » 10 Apr 2007, 14:50

Let me say they are not super tight, but neither so loose you can eassily install them with your hands, you would need a ratchet and a hammer little by little, but then you can't see if they reached the right point... like the shoulders on the guide so it creates confussion about how longer should I try pussing, and even if is the seal even like all the lower edge is at the same hight.
what ever I can say just feel like messy not having just a tool to do so.

nop, not offense, I know that's a chance; but also know the admition valves are the only one with this seals, and when i put everything appart I put each valve with all the accesorries on a tagged bag with its number and tittle.

So I think I will put some oil next time and I don't think it would make them go off when the engine is running... isn't it?

OK Bill, have a good day, hopefully and with the help of the holly Lords: LordCo and God, ejejje i will ensamble everything tonight.
will keep you posted.
thanx again
sergitin.

sergitin32 · Post by **sergitin32** » 12 Apr 2007, 01:33

ok bill... seams the seals on the kit i ordered were a little narrower... i just got some other from the lordco store and they were pretty more similar to the old ones... i put them without any exfort, meanin just a very little, they looked like new there...

so, next thing was installing everything back and check for clearance in the valves... i have none!

so i am forced to get the shaft off again and the drums... but i find theres no way i can get those shims off the drums to meassure them with the micrometer... so i can order some new ones from the store...

do you know any method, any sugestions for this new microchallenge?

i think this would be the last step, then installing all back together... and chek if its working fine...

thanx alot for the help bill.
have a great time there!
sergitin

by the way do you know what thread is the one on the shaft bearings bolts??

Post by **billofdurham** » 12 Apr 2007, 15:58

Good to know you are making progress, even though it is slowly.

To adjust the tappets there is, of course, a special Volvo tool, or there is the mark 1 big screwdriver as shown in the photo in my old Haynes manual.

Sorry about the different sizes of print on the first picture but I can't judge the sizes properly.

I don't know the thread on the bolts you mention.

Bill.

sergitin32 · Post by **sergitin32** » 13 Apr 2007, 00:35

well , here I am with a new stage of problems.

with the gasket and seals kit i got these dampers (i think thats the name for those seals in between the drums and the valve stem and sheams, they go inside the spring holder in the end of the trapped valve, if you know what i mean) so, in this kit they are totally different to the old i had in this car... i didnt like it at the begining but l;ater i realized was really problem for the valve clearance.

http://img252.imageshack.us/my.php?image=damper3ku4.jpg
http://img252.imageshack.us/my.php?image=damper3ku4.jpg

http://img443.imageshack.us/my.php?image=damper1pv4.jpg
http://img443.imageshack.us/my.php?image=damper1pv4.jpg

http://img443.imageshack.us/my.php?image=damper2uy9.jpg
http://img443.imageshack.us/my.php?image=damper2uy9.jpg

following these images, the one in the left is the new one and the right is the old one... so... when i meassure them with the micrometer i realize the new one is almost twice hight than the old one, so it means some how when i put them, been sincere i did the wrong way and the clearance came up like hell... meaning there was not shim i could put to solve the prob... made my head a mess til i found this...

questions:

1- can i reuse the old ones or should i change them?

2- is it fine if i just measure the clearance from the top of the valve to the shaft and then make all the plus of the drums and the shims, as i could considere this piece of rubber as a virtual space, cuz it would disapear as the shaft force the drum in??

3- I already did the meassuring of the clearance for the old dampers and its great, so i've been thinking about getting some new old style ones?

but cant find it in the regular store, will go to the dealer next week since it closes same time i finish working.

what do you think about this??? could i make this new one shorter?
the old one are not rubber but like bakelite, so more stiff and of course more able to brake.. as a matter of fact one was broken... could i not use them at all?
sorry... allways too many questions but i would rather go little by little than risk getting any wrong initiative and skru the whole work...

thanx alot, bill man you've been so much help... i dunno how would i do this alone! crazy!!! hopefully next time i would be able to aford part of this hell of work.
have a nice day
sergitin32

Post by **billofdurham** » 13 Apr 2007, 12:30

Don't re-use them. As one has broken already the rest will follow. They may look like bakelite but they will be rubber (hardened by years of heat from the engine). I also think that the old ones would have been the same size and height as the new ones when they were fitted. The picture in my manual shows the rubber seal to be slightly higher than the end of the valve stem. As you say, it will compress when the tappet is on.

I don't understand what you mean in question 2. The only way to measure the clearance is with everything refitted and, starting with #1 cylinder, have both cams pointing obliquely upwards at equal angles, and the ignition mark on the crankshaft pulley at 0 degrees. Then move on to #3, #4 and finish with #2.

Bill.

sergitin32 · Post by **sergitin32** » 13 Apr 2007, 16:40

sorry bill... when you say refitted meaning all done, like the whole head cylinder in place and the pulleys on and everything engaged?

one thing i do not have are the tools for depressing the drums and get the shims off without removing the shaft...

so i don't have a reliable way to do it with the shaft on, is that really the only way, or maybe the most effective?

yes, i was making my mind to just put the new ones in the correct way and try measuring again... what happens is that i get zero!!!! clearance, so i don't really know how much thinner i should order the new shims.

uhm i will try some more of this these days and keep you posted about it.

thanks a'lot for the help and the patient.
take good care,
sergitin32

Post by **billofdurham** » 14 Apr 2007, 15:46

one thing i do not have are the tools for depressing the drums and get the shims off without removing the shaft...

That's where the Mark 1 big screwdriver comes in. Look closely at the second picture above. The screwdiver is actually pressing the drum down far enough to remove the shims. This does work but you need to be careful that you don't let the screwdiver slip and damage anything - a fairly faint possibility as the shaft will be harder than the screwdriver.

I don't think you will be able to adjust this without installing the shaft. At least I have never heard of it being done.

Bill.

sergitin32 · Post by **sergitin32** » 18 Apr 2007, 03:48

Hi Bill... here i come with some more questions in the middle of some frustration about my mechanical abilities...

I was just installing the had cylinder tonight, and folowing the torque tightening schedule... did the first two steps well, 15 foot/lbs>45 foot/lbs... in the correct order, and was pleased when things got messy, and of course all my fault since is me and the engine!

first the ratchet opened like a flower, low quality steel and sure as i was using my shitty hommie stuff... so got the good deep one but still keep the shitty extention from the torque wrench to the ratchet... and then the extention broke as a wax candel... in this moment i loose the order and been in number 4 i started trying to get the piece of extention outta the ratchet and didnt realized when restarted tighting number 7 in the right side of 4.. totally broke the order... once i realized i was already doing 8 and 7 was all the way tight...

in a rush of messy thoughts to avoid wraping jumped to 5 tighted fast a little more and 6, loose 8 and 7 to 45 again and tightned 4 to max... then 5 to max and 6.. and kept the order... and i made sure all the bolts were tight around 85 foot/lbs at the end.

i know... how could it happen??? i keep asking my self patience when i am working, but some times i loose it... so.. i wonder if this messy order and tightening only in the last step could be bad for the head cylinder? could it be wrapped cuz of this?

if so what should i follow close to see the first symptoms of wrong torque or wraping in the head cylinder?

if its wrong , what should i do, would need to change the gasket again? or just loose everything and retight in the right steping and order?

sorry man...
feeling totally an ass...le
sergei.

Post by **billofdurham** » 18 Apr 2007, 12:03

You certainly are having a rough time with this job.

As you had tightened the bolts in the correct order before your mishaps I don't think it will have caused warping to an extent that will be a problem, but really, nobody can be sure.

If you want to check then you will have to remove the head and use a straight edge and feeler gauge to check for warping. Then you will need a new gasket. There is no point in just loosening and retightening the bolts as that would not cure any warping.

I'm sorry I can't be more positive on what you should do as that is a decision only you can make. However, if it was my car I would put it all back together and see what happened when it was running. If the head has warped you will soon know. If that has happened then you will only have a little extra work dismantling. If it has not warped then you have won by not disturbing anything.

Again, my friend, good luck.

Bill.

Post by **billofdurham** » 18 Apr 2007, 12:04

You certainly are having a rough time with this job.

As you had tightened the bolts in the correct order before your mishaps I don't think it will have caused warping to an extent that will be a problem, but really, nobody can be sure.

If you want to check then you will have to remove the head and use a straight edge and feeler gauge to check for warping. Then you will need a new gasket. There is no point in just loosening and retightening the bolts as that would not cure any warping.

I'm sorry I can't be more positive on what you should do as that is a decision only you can make. However, if it was my car I would put it all back together and see what happened when it was running. If the head has warped you will soon know. If that has happened then you will only have a little extra work dismantling. If it has not warped then you have won by not disturbing anything.

Again, my friend, good luck.

Bill.

We trying to fix a 1983 volvo 244 model, prob fuel intake

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