98 V70 Continuing front end wobble saga

[98v70dad]

Well if you have had all that done (and I recall your threads over time on the subject) there is only one more option and that is to replace the rack. You are on the same attempt to fix something that appears un-solvable and un-fixable just like the front suspension groaning on my 'R'. I really feel your frustration. I can't recall if you replaced both the inner and outer tie-rods. I think you did but now don't recall.

Oh, on the 81-ft/lb/110 Nm, wheel torque on Volvo alloys for P80's. I have been using that for years and so far no issues.

Neil.

I do 89 ft-lbs (10% more). Most shops do 100 ft-lbs on any car. I will try the spec torque and see if it makes a difference.

[mrbrian200]

I'm going to share a little trick I've devised that aids with tweaking the toe setting. The major problem with just adjusting it without a rig is making multiple tweaks and trial runs you lose reference to where you started and become unsure where to set it back if you don't like it. Simple 'method' devised in the pic below solves that. Get the ties good and tight so they don't move when you bump them while making an adjustment or loosen/tightening the lock nut.

I'm not willing to rule out a problem with the steering rack, but we need to try tweaking the toe setting before you go messing around with replacing the rack

If it is a toe alignment issue, and from your description of it being minor but noticeable I would guess you're about 1/16-3/16 turn on the inner tie rod away from your optimal toe setting. As the wobble is more pronounced while coasting I think you may be a little too far toe-in. Adjust one side/wheel and don't worry about the steering wheel being centered for now.
Install cable ties before loosening the lock nut, then turn the inner tie rod 1/16 turn CCW from your starting point, tighten the nut 35ft/lbs (no need to wrench hard on it), and take it for a spin. Then try 1/8 turn CW from your starting point and see if either of those settings make it better or worse. If one direction makes it better, but not completely gone, try 1/8 turn and so on.

I'm not sure what provision the P80s have as far as tracking fuel econ but if it has instant econ readout you can also watch to see if the econ goes up or down on a level stretch of road with the cruise set at a specific speed. Be aware varying head/tail winds from day to day will affect the observed econ. As little as 5mph steady wind can affect it measurably.

[98v70dad]

I appreciate your willingness to help me, but a little over my head. I just want to get it fixed and I'm thoroughly over screwing around with it. Its unfortunate that people will take your money when they actually have no idea what they are doing. You may be right and tomorrow I may be willing to mess around with it but today I'm just sick of working on it. That said I really appreciate your comments. If I get inspired I might try it!

[mrbrian200]

I was hesitant to mess with alignment settings for years, so I kind of understand. The last couple months in my last car (a Chrysler product) the underbody was rotting out in just the wrong couple places which was affecting the rear alignment so I dove in. I merely needed the car to handle passably at moderate highway speeds so that I could get to two nearest larger cities 100 miles away where there were more/lower mileage Volvos to look at. Since then I'm not afraid to mess with it. Front end toe settings are the easiest to tweak. Rear end toe is more difficult because you have to worry about thrust angle. Camber I still prefer to have adjusted by a tech on a rig/machine that can accurately measure it.

[98v70dad]

I moved to Atlanta from Chicago and prior to that lived near Erie, PA area. I am fully familiar with keeping an old rust bucket running. Southerners associate the word beater with a sleeveless T-shirt instead of a winter car. Anyhow, the more I think about it, I may try what you suggested. I could probably achieve the same thing by going to a competent alignment shop but I could try it and if it doesn't work then I'll go get it aligned - this time by someone who knows that the back is, in fact, part of a 4 wheel alignment.

Your comments triggered a memory that the last guy who checked my car for alignment told me "you don't really need an alignment. The toe is a little off but it probably won't cause you any issues." I also have an strange issue driving down a hill in my neighborhood that has a curve on it. When I apply the brakes I get a slight shudder from what seems like the passenger side front wheel. The toe adjustment could possibly cause that. Its not the brakes. This has been going on for awhile and I just replaced everything in the front brakes including the rotors and caliper - no change in the shudder.

The only question I have about the approach that you describe (I now understand what you suggested) is how to determine which wheel to start on and whether or not do both sides. This car is my drive to work car. Its not quite a beater yet, but I don't want to spend hundreds to mess around with the ride. The wobble bugs me since I'm driving nearly 75 miles a day at highway speeds - I'd like it gone.

[mrbrian200]

The only question I have about the approach that you describe (I now understand what you suggested) is how to determine which wheel to start on and whether or not do both sides. This car is my drive to work car. Its not quite a beater yet, but I don't want to spend hundreds to mess around with the ride. The wobble bugs me since I'm driving nearly 75 miles a day at highway speeds - I'd like it gone.

On the front end you initially just want to figure out your ideal toe setting. As the front wheels are not fixed in position like the rear you can adjust one side to find the best ride quality/econ where the wheels are rolling parallel to each other (I noted don't worry about the steering wheel being centered right away). Once you find that setting, then you adjust both sides by the same amount one direction or the other to center the steering wheel. This is also where the cable ties help: you can adjust both sides with some precision as the cable ties are like the hands on a clock. The one on the outer tie rod stays fixed, the one on the inner tie changes position as you make adjustments by turning the inner tie rod. Assuming the rear end is in good shape... Pulling to one side or another, if it can't be attributed to a dragging brake or wheel bearing, is a function of thrust angle, which is mainly influenced by the rear alignment. Regardless of toe in/toe out condition on the front front end you center them to the forward direction with the steering wheel while driving (to stay on the road). You stated that the car continues straight ahead if you take your hands off the wheel, with no wobble from back there I'm thinking the rear end is pretty good.

[abscate]

Sorry to rehash but have you looked at wheel bearings, or what is the history there?

Plenty of people get 200k+, I have had failures at 120k, 150k and 110k

[98v70dad]

Sorry to rehash but have you looked at wheel bearings, or what is the history there?

Plenty of people get 200k+, I have had failures at 120k, 150k and 110k

Brand new timken wheel bearings made by FAG - about 2 months ago.

[wizechatmgr]

Just thinking... Did that year have any form of traction control included?

[abscate]

I think the rack is all that is left...