Trying to decide which Volvo to buy

[June]

As usual blah blah blah GM transmission bad. GM, Aisin or whatever Volvo decided to use for the transmission is not the only potential expensive problem. Either transmission won't be cheap to replace and from my experience with the two hpt 5-cylinder 2.3 the Aisin transmission couldn't take hard driving without spitting the fluid out of the vent especially at speeds above 80 mph I chose standard shift for my second to avoid the automatic. Oh I did buy both hpt 5-cylinder and both T6 cars new. Neither GM equipped T6 as of yet has been bad and my current 2004 S80 T6 is at 140k and my in service date is 12/25/2003. I run it hard like every car I have owned all the way back to my first new car in 1986. Volvo used to advertise "Drive it like you hate it" and I do.

What I have had problems with and I can think of several other people who also had P2 cars who also had the same issues.

1. Control arm bushings
2. Bad drive axles, it seems the boots break in conjunction with a engine mount ruining the cv joints.
3. Broken engine mounts.
4. Seeping radiator tank (well after 10 years old)
5. Hardened vacuum lines to turbo causing boost issues.
6. Bad turbo control valve causing pulsing during hard acceleration.
7. Bad spring seats, struts, strut bearings, tie rods, oh and sagging front springs.

Those all failed on my 2004 P2, my sister's 2005 P2 and uncle's 5-cylinder P2 unsure of year of his car. I would definitely say those are weak points common to break with age.

Things not happened to mine but reading on here must be problematic among P2 cars as you will find loads of posts about fixing these problems and would be worth considering.

1. Electric motor failure in abs break system.
2. Leaking oil line fitting at turbo.
3. Clogged pcv causing major expenses.
4. Leaking cam seal, or worse rear main seal.
5. Bad O-ring in oil pan gasket causing low oil pressure causing all sorts of damage.
6. Failure of alarm module

Good luck on your used car shipping! June

[Gone Again]

As usual blah blah blah GM transmission bad. GM, Aisin or whatever Volvo decided to use for the transmission is not the only potential expensive problem. Either transmission won't be cheap to replace and from my experience with the two hpt 5-cylinder 2.3 the Aisin transmission couldn't take hard driving without spitting the fluid out of the vent especially at speeds above 80 mph I chose standard shift for my second to avoid the automatic. Oh I did buy both hpt 5-cylinder and both T6 cars new. Neither GM equipped T6 as of yet has been bad and my current 2004 S80 T6 is at 140k and my in service date is 12/25/2003. I run it hard like every car I have owned all the way back to my first new car in 1986. Volvo used to advertise "Drive it like you hate it" and I do.

What I have had problems with and I can think of several other people who also had P2 cars who also had the same issues.

1. Control arm bushings
2. Bad drive axles, it seems the boots break in conjunction with a engine mount ruining the cv joints.
3. Broken engine mounts.
4. Seeping radiator tank (well after 10 years old)
5. Hardened vacuum lines to turbo causing boost issues.
6. Bad turbo control valve causing pulsing during hard acceleration.
7. Bad spring seats, struts, strut bearings, tie rods, oh and sagging front springs.

Those all failed on my 2004 P2, my sister's 2005 P2 and uncle's 5-cylinder P2 unsure of year of his car. I would definitely say those are weak points common to break with age.

Things not happened to mine but reading on here must be problematic among P2 cars as you will find loads of posts about fixing these problems and would be worth considering.

1. Electric motor failure in abs break system.
2. Leaking oil line fitting at turbo.
3. Clogged pcv causing major expenses.
4. Leaking cam seal, or worse rear main seal.
5. Bad O-ring in oil pan gasket causing low oil pressure causing all sorts of damage.
6. Failure of alarm module

Good luck on your used car shipping! June

So if I understand you correctly, anything P2 is going to more problematic than non-P2 Volvos? P2 models are better off avoided? That pretty much kills all the Volvos I'm looking at, unless I misunderstand what you're saying and what I have read here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volvo_P2_platform

The only thing I've found that isn't a P2 would be the S40, which is fine, but I find a wagon extremely useful. If I take all of this at face value, it's hard to not conclude that Volvos aren't quite a sturdy as they were prior to 1998 or so.

[mrbrian200]

That one in Dallas-- I think they may be off on a couple details: Newer style headlamp assemblies started in '05, I didn't think they put a 6cyl in the V70s, I thought they're all 5cyl (??). That doesn't necessarily mean they are trying to pull something: it just may mean they don't know. A lot of people don't.
Sites like Autotrader/Carfax etc. force sellers to enter a VIN and the site figures it out for them. Craigslist doesn't work like that.

Email them and see if they'll give you the VIN.

Ok. I said they P2 Volvos are average. I have never owned a car over 10 years old/100,000 miles that didn't try to die once a year or so -- whether it a fuel pump, bad sensor, some electrical issue...
I've even seen a reference or two online (not here) from people driving some older car and complaining that they had to replace the brake pads/rotors, like they're supposed to last forever! I know text talk is frowned upon but that's some pretty serious facepalm OMG.
Forgive me Matt.
The breaking point for me is whether I can fix it in the driveway in a day or less and not need to rent an engine hoist. Majority of P2 Volvos will not need an engine hoist within their reasonable useable life. Except some of the T6 variants, especially if it's an XC90.

I think I saw one today on my way back from the bank just outside Valparaiso in northwest Indiana...Beautiful black XC90 T6 parked off the side of someone's driveway with tall grass growing around it. The ultimate green vehicle!

Now, if you want a car with zero issues to deal with (because anything that pops up is under warranty thus not your problem) you need to spend more money for a brand NEW car, or at least a CPO with a warranty and trade it in when the warranty expires. I know an awful lot of people that do exactly that.

[June]

As usual blah blah blah GM transmission bad. GM, Aisin or whatever Volvo decided to use for the transmission is not the only potential expensive problem. Either transmission won't be cheap to replace and from my experience with the two hpt 5-cylinder 2.3 the Aisin transmission couldn't take hard driving without spitting the fluid out of the vent especially at speeds above 80 mph I chose standard shift for my second to avoid the automatic. Oh I did buy both hpt 5-cylinder and both T6 cars new. Neither GM equipped T6 as of yet has been bad and my current 2004 S80 T6 is at 140k and my in service date is 12/25/2003. I run it hard like every car I have owned all the way back to my first new car in 1986. Volvo used to advertise "Drive it like you hate it" and I do.

What I have had problems with and I can think of several other people who also had P2 cars who also had the same issues.

1. Control arm bushings
2. Bad drive axles, it seems the boots break in conjunction with a engine mount ruining the cv joints.
3. Broken engine mounts.
4. Seeping radiator tank (well after 10 years old)
5. Hardened vacuum lines to turbo causing boost issues.
6. Bad turbo control valve causing pulsing during hard acceleration.
7. Bad spring seats, struts, strut bearings, tie rods, oh and sagging front springs.

Those all failed on my 2004 P2, my sister's 2005 P2 and uncle's 5-cylinder P2 unsure of year of his car. I would definitely say those are weak points common to break with age.

Things not happened to mine but reading on here must be problematic among P2 cars as you will find loads of posts about fixing these problems and would be worth considering.

1. Electric motor failure in abs break system.
2. Leaking oil line fitting at turbo.
3. Clogged pcv causing major expenses.
4. Leaking cam seal, or worse rear main seal.
5. Bad O-ring in oil pan gasket causing low oil pressure causing all sorts of damage.
6. Failure of alarm module

Good luck on your used car shipping! June

So if I understand you correctly, anything P2 is going to more problematic than non-P2 Volvos? P2 models are better off avoided? That pretty much kills all the Volvos I'm looking at, unless I misunderstand what you're saying and what I have read here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volvo_P2_platform

The only thing I've found that isn't a P2 would be the S40, which is fine, but I find a wagon extremely useful. If I take all of this at face value, it's hard to not conclude that Volvos aren't quite a sturdy as they were prior to 1998 or so.

What I an saying is with all the hype on here about potentially bad transmissions don't overlook the more common problems with a old car, in this case P2 Volvo. If the transmission is functioning properly and has clean not burnt fluid, weather it be Aisin or Hydromatic it likely will continue functioning. Meanwhile expensive repairs that are more common like control arms, engine mounts, weeping seal between core and tank of the radiator and others I listed may be overlooked causing you more grief.

I strictly mentioned those lists to give you a checklist of areas to look at when selecting a used P2. My 2004 S80 T6 drove 12 years and 109k before I had the first non wear item or normal scheduled service. You are not looking at even a nearly new car, but old cars so as a long term owner with family members who also have owned P2 cars I was hoping to give you real problem spots that have shown up with age and mileage on these models.

To date the engine 2.9 twin turbo, transmission 4t65gt, either turbo, or electrical system including computers alternator has had the first hint of trouble. Now the front suspension has been completely replaced, radiator and hoses, both axles, two engine mounts, and rack-and-pinion have cost a fortune since March of 2016 109k. I made the decision to keep my car at any cost as she drives better than the new drive e engine Volvo now offers.

My first Volvo I bought new was a 1989 740 GLT and it took quite a while for me to accept front wheel drive when I switched. Front Wheel Drive simply cost more to repair, and seems to be more prone to things like broken engine mounts and other expensive things with age from my experience. June

[Gone Again]

That one in Dallas-- I think they may be off on a couple details: Newer style headlamp assemblies started in '05, I didn't think they put a 6cyl in the V70s, I thought they're all 5cyl (??). That doesn't necessarily mean they are trying to pull something: it just may mean they don't know. A lot of people don't.
Sites like Autotrader/Carfax etc. force sellers to enter a VIN and the site figures it out for them. Craigslist doesn't work like that.

Email them and see if they'll give you the VIN.

Ok. I said they P2 Volvos are average. I have never owned a car over 10 years old/100,000 miles that didn't try to die once a year or so -- whether it a fuel pump, bad sensor, some electrical issue...
I've even seen a reference or two online (not here) from people driving some older car and complaining that they had to replace the brake pads/rotors, like they're supposed to last forever! I know text talk is frowned upon but that's some pretty serious facepalm OMG.
Forgive me Matt.
The breaking point for me is whether I can fix it in the driveway in a day or less and not need to rent an engine hoist. Majority of P2 Volvos will not need an engine hoist within their reasonable useable life. Except some of the T6 variants, especially if it's an XC90.

I think I saw one today on my way back from the bank just outside Valparaiso in northwest Indiana...Beautiful black XC90 T6 parked off the side of someone's driveway with tall grass growing around it. The ultimate green vehicle!

Now, if you want a car with zero issues to deal with (because anything that pops up is under warranty thus not your problem) you need to spend more money for a brand NEW car, or at least a CPO with a warranty and trade it in when the warranty expires. I know an awful lot of people that do exactly that.

I'm not looking for or expecting a car with zero issues. My 940 certainly wasn't that way. I'm just hoping for something close to my experience with my 940. The most expensive thing I've ever had to do was replace the front end workings (you can tell I'm mechanically inclined, huh) to the tune of around 1200.00. And that was in part because the guy was expensive. There was one other repair like that. Otherwise, once or twice a year we paid between 200.00 to 600.00 to get things sorted out. Usually this meant regular maintenance items, belts replaced, seals, gaskets, etc.

As I said before, the drive train is still rock solid. My 940 has 250,000 on it, and I expect it will double that. It was worth the repairs because it was extremely comfortable to ride in, and was nice to drive. I just want to avoid anything that will create an inordinate amount of repairs, relative to my previous experience. And I've been hearing all these bad things about newer Volvos.

There's no way I'll ever buy a new car again. The immediate drive off the lot depreciation, the three to five years of debt, and that I was badly burned by a very dishonest action by HSBC, nope, no new cars. I'll take repairs over payments, thank you.

[Gone Again]

As usual blah blah blah GM transmission bad. GM, Aisin or whatever Volvo decided to use for the transmission is not the only potential expensive problem. Either transmission won't be cheap to replace and from my experience with the two hpt 5-cylinder 2.3 the Aisin transmission couldn't take hard driving without spitting the fluid out of the vent especially at speeds above 80 mph I chose standard shift for my second to avoid the automatic. Oh I did buy both hpt 5-cylinder and both T6 cars new. Neither GM equipped T6 as of yet has been bad and my current 2004 S80 T6 is at 140k and my in service date is 12/25/2003. I run it hard like every car I have owned all the way back to my first new car in 1986. Volvo used to advertise "Drive it like you hate it" and I do.

What I have had problems with and I can think of several other people who also had P2 cars who also had the same issues.

1. Control arm bushings
2. Bad drive axles, it seems the boots break in conjunction with a engine mount ruining the cv joints.
3. Broken engine mounts.
4. Seeping radiator tank (well after 10 years old)
5. Hardened vacuum lines to turbo causing boost issues.
6. Bad turbo control valve causing pulsing during hard acceleration.
7. Bad spring seats, struts, strut bearings, tie rods, oh and sagging front springs.

Those all failed on my 2004 P2, my sister's 2005 P2 and uncle's 5-cylinder P2 unsure of year of his car. I would definitely say those are weak points common to break with age.

Things not happened to mine but reading on here must be problematic among P2 cars as you will find loads of posts about fixing these problems and would be worth considering.

1. Electric motor failure in abs break system.
2. Leaking oil line fitting at turbo.
3. Clogged pcv causing major expenses.
4. Leaking cam seal, or worse rear main seal.
5. Bad O-ring in oil pan gasket causing low oil pressure causing all sorts of damage.
6. Failure of alarm module

Good luck on your used car shipping! June

So if I understand you correctly, anything P2 is going to more problematic than non-P2 Volvos? P2 models are better off avoided? That pretty much kills all the Volvos I'm looking at, unless I misunderstand what you're saying and what I have read here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Volvo_P2_platform

The only thing I've found that isn't a P2 would be the S40, which is fine, but I find a wagon extremely useful. If I take all of this at face value, it's hard to not conclude that Volvos aren't quite a sturdy as they were prior to 1998 or so.

What I an saying is with all the hype on here about potentially bad transmissions don't overlook the more common problems with a old car, in this case P2 Volvo. If the transmission is functioning properly and has clean not burnt fluid, weather it be Aisin or Hydromatic it likely will continue functioning. Meanwhile expensive repairs that are more common like control arms, engine mounts, weeping seal between core and tank of the radiator and others I listed may be overlooked causing you more grief.

I strictly mentioned those lists to give you a checklist of areas to look at when selecting a used P2. My 2004 S80 T6 drove 12 years and 109k before I had the first non wear item or normal scheduled service. You are not looking at even a nearly new car, but old cars so as a long term owner with family members who also have owned P2 cars I was hoping to give you real problem spots that have shown up with age and mileage on these models.

To date the engine 2.9 twin turbo, transmission 4t65gt, either turbo, or electrical system including computers alternator has had the first hint of trouble. Now the front suspension has been completely replaced, radiator and hoses, both axles, two engine mounts, and rack-and-pinion have cost a fortune since March of 2016 109k. I made the decision to keep my car at any cost as she drives better than the new drive e engine Volvo now offers.

My first Volvo I bought new was a 1989 740 GLT and it took quite a while for me to accept front wheel drive when I switched. Front Wheel Drive simply cost more to repair, and seems to be more prone to things like broken engine mounts and other expensive things with age from my experience. June

Thanks for the clarification June. That helps. The things you list aren't too far removed from my experience with my 93 940.

[June]

A thought in general that occurred to me. If I was inclined to buy a used car I would look for a one owner if possible two maximum. If more than one owner the last would have to have owned the car for a long period of the cars life. A car that has had a several owners in several years I would be suspicious of why. Also I would rather have a car in need of service ie timing belt rather than a car that had Tire King do the belt as important services like that not performed properly is death to these engines if they jump. If Volvo or a Volvo specialist has preformed all major services backed by records provided by previous owner than fine otherwise the price should reflect the cost of bringing the car up to date properly. Also I would steer clear of a car that quote has rebuilt or used engine or transmission recently installed. Likely if a major repair has been preformed like that and suddenly the car is being dumped I would worry something was wrong and the PO is ready to pass on the nightmare they created by not having Volvo or a Volvo indie specialist preform the work. It is simple their is no cheap short cut to major repairs on these cars. The only exception would be if a Volvo technician currently employed by Volvo is the seller and has rehabilitated the car to sell i might consider that car.

Or buy one super cheap that runs good and simply run it until it quits investing in nothing more than normal or safety things like oil changes, tires, breaks, etc. Meanwhile save money up for a newer model. A beater that say looks bad ie bad paint, shredded leather, stains, etc, but runs great that is cheap is what I am talking about.

Anyway these are some guidelines I would use for buying a keeper or a beater. Do let us know what you buy. One really good thing upgrading a 940 to a P2 car is the safety features like WIPPS, SIPPS with side impact airbag, air curtains, launch protection built in the seat track and so on. My 2002 S80 T6 saved my life in a interstate frontal collision resulting in a launch and rollover accident that my 5 pound Chihuahua and I stepped out of without a scratch completely unhurt at 3:30 AM one fine morning. Had I been in my first Volvo the 740 or a non Volvo I imagine I would have been hurt or dead. The guys at the impound lot though my car was a death car. They had allready stolen the stereo and we're in process of removing the armrest with phone when I showed up. Safety features are nice to have when calamity occurs rather than a afterthought. June