Trying to decide which Volvo to buy

Gone Again · Post by **Gone Again** » 12 Jul 2017, 12:51

Greetings all,

I've just joined. I decided this would be a good placed to get well informed input on which Volvo to buy. I've been doing research for about six weeks and am seriously confused.

It seems that 2000 to 2003 are generally considered problematic. I've targeted 2004 to 2007, as those are within my price range, for the most part. So here are the models I'm looking at currently, all are 2004 at the moment:

XC70 cross country
V70
XC90

Some of those I've found are AWD, which I've read many reports of these having more problems than their front wheel drive counterparts.

I'm trying to find something reasonably solid, as I'm having to replace/retire my 93 940, unfortunately.

Thanks for your help and input in advance.

Post by **mrbrian200** » 12 Jul 2017, 14:45

AWD/4WD systems are a source of potential problems across virtually all makes and models. Volvos merely are not an exception to the rule.
My rule is, if you live in an area where roads are plowed, snow rarely falls, or mountains don't exist you don't really need it. You may think you do.

With the P2s generally the later the model year the more bugs got worked out. A bug or two, usually repairable in the driveway, persisted for the entire run. But with any specific make and model there will always be something. By 05-06 they had shaped up to be 'average' in this respect compared to just about any other mid price lux. Stay away from Volvos equipped with the GM 4T65E transmission. Which for the models you're looking at would apply to the '03-'04 XC90 T6. They are as rotten as the Honda/Acura B7WA transmissions from about the same time and CANNOT be trusted for reliable transportation.

I think that GM trans which was equipped on only one drivetrain variant on a couple models for a few years is a good part of the reason P2 resale values are depressed compared to other comparable makes. When I started looking I knew nothing of Volvo specific issues and it took me a bit of time to research/understand confidently which ones used that transmission, and of those that didn't, that the Asin trans used in the rest are pretty good. Most used car buyers who are not mechanically inclined if they catch wind of it would simply steer clear of the entire lot (of potentially affected Volvos from that generation). A lot of used car dealers don't really want to deal with it either. Dealer sales bad dream scenario would be when a customer on the lot sees a vehicle they really seem like. Gets 'stuck on it' then whips out a smart phone for a 10 second google research and sees a red flag that may or may not apply to the vehicle they are looking at. They don't understand and anything a used car salesman is by nature treated with a grain of salt.
Just like fast food franchising, brand consistency is extremely important.

Post by **matthew1** » 12 Jul 2017, 15:05

Gone Agian, welcome to MVS.

MrBrian makes good points above.

Barring April of this year until now, I've been driving in Colorado (metro 98%, snowy mountains 2%) since 1988, across perhaps eight different cars, some FWD some RWD. Only one of those eight had AWD. I was ok.

Gone Again · Post by **Gone Again** » 12 Jul 2017, 18:14

mrbrian200 wrote: ↑12 Jul 2017, 14:45 AWD/4WD systems are a source of potential problems across virtually all makes and models. Volvos merely are not an exception to the rule.
My rule is, if you live in an area where roads are plowed, snow rarely falls, or mountains don't exist you don't really need it. You may think you do.

With the P2s generally the later the model year the more bugs got worked out. A bug or two, usually repairable in the driveway, persisted for the entire run. But with any specific make and model there will always be something. By 05-06 they had shaped up to be 'average' in this respect compared to just about any other mid price lux. Stay away from Volvos equipped with the GM 4T65E transmission. Which for the models you're looking at would apply to the '03-'04 XC90 T6. They are as rotten as the Honda/Acura B7WA transmissions from about the same time and CANNOT be trusted for reliable transportation.

I think that GM trans which was equipped on only one drivetrain variant on a couple models for a few years is a good part of the reason P2 resale values are depressed compared to other comparable makes. When I started looking I knew nothing of Volvo specific issues and it took me a bit of time to research/understand confidently which ones used that transmission, and of those that didn't, that the Asin trans used in the rest are pretty good. Most used car buyers who are not mechanically inclined if they catch wind of it would simply steer clear of the entire lot (of potentially affected Volvos from that generation). A lot of used car dealers don't really want to deal with it either. Dealer sales bad dream scenario would be when a customer on the lot sees a vehicle they really seem like. Gets 'stuck on it' then whips out a smart phone for a 10 second google research and sees a red flag that may or may not apply to the vehicle they are looking at. They don't understand and anything a used car salesman is by nature treated with a grain of salt.
Just like fast food franchising, brand consistency is extremely important.

Mrbrian,

Thanks for the response. I actually don't have an interest or desire in an AWD vehicle. I only mention those because many are available in my area, but would prefer a vehicle without AWD.

How can a person distinguish a T6 from a non T6 XC90?

Thanks

Post by **matthew1** » 12 Jul 2017, 18:28

A T6 says "T6" on the back.

Post by **matthew1** » 12 Jul 2017, 18:30

Lots of good XC90 info here: https://www.matthewsvolvosite.com/tag/xc90

Gone Again · Post by **Gone Again** » 12 Jul 2017, 19:03

matthew1 wrote: ↑12 Jul 2017, 15:05 Gone Agian, welcome to MVS.

MrBrian makes good points above.

Barring April of this year until now, I've been driving in Colorado (metro 98%, snowy mountains 2%) since 1988, across perhaps eight different cars, some FWD some RWD. Only one of those eight had AWD. I was ok.

Hi Matthew,

Just to echo what I said to Mrbrian, I'm not looking for, or even interested in an AWD vehicle. Several have come up on my local Craigslist, so I considered them, but wasn't crazy about the idea. Really all I'm after is reliability. My 93 940 wagon, in spite of all the repairs over the eight years I've had it, hasn't had an issue with the drive train. Aesthetically, my car is a mess, but the engine is still strong as an ox. It's outlasted my wife's 97 Mercedes C280, which recently fell apart finally. So I'm hoping for another car like my 940, but wonder if those exist any longer, after Volvo getting other car manufacturers involved in their cars.

I do really like the looks and other features of the V70 and the XC70 cross country, but wonder how they'll hold up.

Post by **mrbrian200** » 12 Jul 2017, 21:16

T6 refers to the inline-6 (l6) turbocharged engine during those years. All other engines 4 cyl, 5cyl, V-6, V-8, turbo or non-turbo are all paired with a good automatic transmission made by Asin.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aisin_Seiki
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_A ... nsmissions

Later T6s switched to an Asin transmission too. It's just the early T6 drivetrains starting in '03 for a couple years used a transmission made by General Motors which you want to avoid. All manual transmissions are considered good.
Volvo makes their own engines.
If you see a car you might want to buy, it says "T6" on the back of the car or mentions L6/l6 as the engine type and you're not sure just ask.

: T6.JPG (20.05 KiB) Viewed 1079 times

Post by **mrbrian200** » 12 Jul 2017, 22:15

Gone Again wrote: ↑12 Jul 2017, 19:03 I do really like the looks and other features of the V70 and the XC70 cross country, but wonder how they'll hold up.

Drivetrain configurations mirror other Volvo full size sedans and SUVs. They're good so long as you don't neglect maintenance/oil changes etc. In Texas it'll probably never rust ever.

Also note: as your previous car(s) were likely older--Vehicle OEs have been getting away from using hydraulic lash adjusters/hydraulic valve lifters. This is to improve fuel economy I think, but the engines do make more mechanical noise. Volvo was an early adopter around Y2K. With the hood open running it will sound a little like the clatter you would associate with a diesel engine. This is normal and does not indicate a bad/severely worn engine unless you start to hear it inside the passenger cabin. Just mentioning this. It threw me when I first started shopping for my Volvo.

Gone Again · Post by **Gone Again** » 13 Jul 2017, 11:06

mrbrian200 wrote: ↑12 Jul 2017, 22:15
Gone Again wrote: ↑12 Jul 2017, 19:03 I do really like the looks and other features of the V70 and the XC70 cross country, but wonder how they'll hold up.
Drivetrain configurations mirror other Volvo full size sedans and SUVs. They're good so long as you don't neglect maintenance/oil changes etc. In Texas it'll probably never rust ever.

Also note: as your previous car(s) were likely older--Vehicle OEs have been getting away from using hydraulic lash adjusters/hydraulic valve lifters. This is to improve fuel economy I think, but the engines do make more mechanical noise. Volvo was an early adopter around Y2K. With the hood open running it will sound a little like the clatter you would associate with a diesel engine. This is normal and does not indicate a bad/severely worn engine unless you start to hear it inside the passenger cabin. Just mentioning this. It threw me when I first started shopping for my Volvo.

Thanks Mrbrian and Matthew, this information is all really helpful. The XC90 is a possibility, but am favoring the wagons, as the 940 wagon has worked out well for me. I found one from an individual that looks promising: https://dallas.craigslist.org/dal/cto/6178181245.html