Looking to replace transmission in 2001 S80 T6 and have a few questions;
Forgive me if these have been answered before.
There is a heavy duty version 4T65EV-HD, allegedly used in the XC90. I know it is not a direct swap but..
What makes it heavy duty?
Can the heavy duty internals be used in the 4T65EV?
In 2003 the 4T65EV was updated with ratcheting sprags and a hardened 4th gear shaft.
Is the 2003 tranny a direct swap into a 2001 S80 T6?
Are the 2003 internal parts usable in a 2001 case?
4T65EV transmissions
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SuperHerman
- Posts: 1798
- Joined: 1 December 2014
- Year and Model: 2004 & 2016 XC90
- Location: Minnesota
- Been thanked: 207 times
What is wrong with your current transmission?
I rebuilt the transmission in my 04 XC90 - all the steels and frictions are the same as all other 4T65Es - save for the fourth gear arrangement. The XC90 has AWD, but you do not need to play in that area most likely if you do the tranny in car. You can either buy just the frictions/steels or buy the kit for those parts.
I don't know about the ratcheting sprags or whether the 4th gear shaft is hardened for the 2001 S80 - my 2004 XC90 had both. Note that GM adopted many of Volvo's changes later on in their production so your 2001 S80 may have said items already. My sprags were fine, but my 4th gear shaft had some wear so I replaced it - something like $40.
Depending on what is wrong I would just rebuild what you have and update the sprag and 4th gear shaft if you find they are not the most current offering. Assuming your issue is just wear and high mileage I would do it in car and not remove the transmission. It is a bit tougher to assemble, but way easier overall. Look up VIDA on how to change the valve body on the Volvo, and then watch some YouTube videos on how to do the Impala. The internal assembly is almost identical - the main difference is the 4th gear clutches.
Depending on miles you may want to change various solenoids and do other modifications - look at Triple Edge Performance for parts and information.
I would call Dave there and talk to him on what you need - order everything from him - his prices are pretty good and the help he gives you is well worth it. You will also find instructions on Instructables - not for a Volvo but again almost identical. He gives good tips on pressing some items by flipping the bonded pistons.
It really is pretty easy - just pay attention, take pictures as you go and look at VIDA and the YouTube videos. If your tranny has low miles you most likely can get buy with just a rebuild kit and be in and out for under $400. I went wild and changed everything, but looking back my issue was wear and I should have just done a rebuild kit. Not a ton of sense throwing away an additional $500 for a car almost 20 years old.
I rebuilt the transmission in my 04 XC90 - all the steels and frictions are the same as all other 4T65Es - save for the fourth gear arrangement. The XC90 has AWD, but you do not need to play in that area most likely if you do the tranny in car. You can either buy just the frictions/steels or buy the kit for those parts.
I don't know about the ratcheting sprags or whether the 4th gear shaft is hardened for the 2001 S80 - my 2004 XC90 had both. Note that GM adopted many of Volvo's changes later on in their production so your 2001 S80 may have said items already. My sprags were fine, but my 4th gear shaft had some wear so I replaced it - something like $40.
Depending on what is wrong I would just rebuild what you have and update the sprag and 4th gear shaft if you find they are not the most current offering. Assuming your issue is just wear and high mileage I would do it in car and not remove the transmission. It is a bit tougher to assemble, but way easier overall. Look up VIDA on how to change the valve body on the Volvo, and then watch some YouTube videos on how to do the Impala. The internal assembly is almost identical - the main difference is the 4th gear clutches.
Depending on miles you may want to change various solenoids and do other modifications - look at Triple Edge Performance for parts and information.
I would call Dave there and talk to him on what you need - order everything from him - his prices are pretty good and the help he gives you is well worth it. You will also find instructions on Instructables - not for a Volvo but again almost identical. He gives good tips on pressing some items by flipping the bonded pistons.
It really is pretty easy - just pay attention, take pictures as you go and look at VIDA and the YouTube videos. If your tranny has low miles you most likely can get buy with just a rebuild kit and be in and out for under $400. I went wild and changed everything, but looking back my issue was wear and I should have just done a rebuild kit. Not a ton of sense throwing away an additional $500 for a car almost 20 years old.
Thanks SuperHerman
I have an email out to Triple Edge.
My 2001 is actually my 19 year old boy's car. We bought it 6 months ago ,2 owner, 131K miles.most recent owner deceased; Carfax maintanence records had no record of timing belt or water pump change so that was done right away,
Acceleration and shifting were excellent.
Transmission fluid getting darker lately; took it to our Volvo specialty shop for transmission fluid flush and filter change.
One day later CEL and" Transmission service URGENT' warning.
Service people checked codes, reset tranny fluid level sensor and still got codes that shift from 3 to 4th not happening
On my road test shift from 3 to 4 was intermittent. No codes or warnings currently though. The shop thinks that the 4th gear clutch shaft( not hardened until 2003 as you are aware) is failing.
I am hoping that the flush dislodged some debris and has clogged a solenoid; hoping that debris works out on its own.
Meantime , I am looking at a full rebuild. I want to use the heaviest duty materials that I can. From what I can tell
the hardened spline 4 th gear shaft is a drop in item. I suspect that the ratcheting sprags may not be?
I have an email out to Triple Edge.
My 2001 is actually my 19 year old boy's car. We bought it 6 months ago ,2 owner, 131K miles.most recent owner deceased; Carfax maintanence records had no record of timing belt or water pump change so that was done right away,
Acceleration and shifting were excellent.
Transmission fluid getting darker lately; took it to our Volvo specialty shop for transmission fluid flush and filter change.
One day later CEL and" Transmission service URGENT' warning.
Service people checked codes, reset tranny fluid level sensor and still got codes that shift from 3 to 4th not happening
On my road test shift from 3 to 4 was intermittent. No codes or warnings currently though. The shop thinks that the 4th gear clutch shaft( not hardened until 2003 as you are aware) is failing.
I am hoping that the flush dislodged some debris and has clogged a solenoid; hoping that debris works out on its own.
Meantime , I am looking at a full rebuild. I want to use the heaviest duty materials that I can. From what I can tell
the hardened spline 4 th gear shaft is a drop in item. I suspect that the ratcheting sprags may not be?
-
SuperHerman
- Posts: 1798
- Joined: 1 December 2014
- Year and Model: 2004 & 2016 XC90
- Location: Minnesota
- Been thanked: 207 times
Were it me I would do an in car tranny rebuild - test the solenoids, update the 4th gear shaft and install a full rebuild kit with bonded pistons. I wouldn't spend any more money. If the rebuild gets you another 100k - which is should without problem unless your son beats on the car - it will be money saved which can be used for freshening the suspension.
The main issue I have seen in the two XC90 transmissions I took apart is the clutch wear and steel burning as a result. The rest of the mechanicals were fine save for an accumulator spring which was broken in one of them. Fluid was black - as it wears it gets worse as the transmission apparently doesn't have a great way to adjust to the wear. On this point - all the clutch discs and steels are the same. But you can get thicker steels and a thicker disc or two to tighten tolerances.
If you have the time, do it in car, take it apart and inspect everything - then place your order. If you pull the transmission you have to drain/change all sorts of fluids and play with the power steering rack. Once you lower the transmission, tilt it, and get the valve body cover off - the rest is just like the Impala video on YouTube. Assuming you do it in car, you will see the work required if you have to go back in. As I don't think it is bad, you may elect to replace fewer items - that is the perspective I now have.
Dave at Triple Edge will talk you through what is optimal and sells the stuff you will need.
One thing of note - I screwed up by not properly torquing one long bolt to spec. This caused massive slippage and I had to go back in and replace a bunch of discs. Bolt was finger tight - and thinking back how I rebuilt it - I torqued it only to 10 NM. After I went in the second time I found my mistake right away and the replaced the discs and all is well going on 5k miles.
The main issue I have seen in the two XC90 transmissions I took apart is the clutch wear and steel burning as a result. The rest of the mechanicals were fine save for an accumulator spring which was broken in one of them. Fluid was black - as it wears it gets worse as the transmission apparently doesn't have a great way to adjust to the wear. On this point - all the clutch discs and steels are the same. But you can get thicker steels and a thicker disc or two to tighten tolerances.
If you have the time, do it in car, take it apart and inspect everything - then place your order. If you pull the transmission you have to drain/change all sorts of fluids and play with the power steering rack. Once you lower the transmission, tilt it, and get the valve body cover off - the rest is just like the Impala video on YouTube. Assuming you do it in car, you will see the work required if you have to go back in. As I don't think it is bad, you may elect to replace fewer items - that is the perspective I now have.
Dave at Triple Edge will talk you through what is optimal and sells the stuff you will need.
One thing of note - I screwed up by not properly torquing one long bolt to spec. This caused massive slippage and I had to go back in and replace a bunch of discs. Bolt was finger tight - and thinking back how I rebuilt it - I torqued it only to 10 NM. After I went in the second time I found my mistake right away and the replaced the discs and all is well going on 5k miles.
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