Non-Volvo car chat megathread

[Rattnalle]

I don't think BMW is in denial so much as they simply acknowledge the reality that until some sort of fuel cell technology is perfected, pure EVs will have a limited market. Lithium batteries really aren't a good solution, only good for city dwellers 'tooling about town/routine daily commute' if you will. My friend that lives in a high rise condo building in Chicago couldn't get one if he wanted: the building parking garage isn't 'wired' for EV charging, the building association looked into it a few years ago and concluded the venture (would be a special assessment to all unit owners) to be cost prohibitive. Unit owners aren't specifically prohibited from having a charging station installed at their owned parking spaces, but the number$ to do so on an individual basis were crazy, =/+ the price of the car. People with more freedom to to do this on a reasonable budget - homeowners in more rural areas - are also the ones who tend to drive longer distances where anything less than a 400-500 mile range would be problem as rural areas/small towns are the places you're least likely to find a charging station when and where you will find yourself needing it.

In a lot of the rest of the world where fuel isn't (almost) free the break even for installing a charging station is quite different. Here up north most places are already wired for electric engine heaters anyway. Sure it's no fast charger but 2-3kW for overnight charging will still work pretty well for a lot of people.

And statistically even in our very sparsely populated country with long distances between people most cars aren't driven further on a regular basis than that they could easily be replaced by BEVs. Especially everyone's second car that's only used for commuting and not going on holidays. The average distance travelled by each car every year is only 12-13000 km or so here based on yearly inspection data.

Batteries are for sure no perfect solution but neither is any other, ICEs included.

[93Regina]

Tesla's in hot water. They had better get ready for war. Everybody is coming at the electric market in 1-2 years...

Like the ending of the Tucker 48, so will Tesla's vehicles cease production, including semi-trucks.

Mom-n-Pop grocery stores couldn't compete with supermarkets, due to larger sales volume in supermarkets. Once the major OEMs ramp up production, their vehicles will be lower priced, and most likely, come with better warranties.

Tesla's vehicles are sold in larger cities mostly, and without support for them elsewhere. But, with future OEMs producing similar products to his, buyers will be considering these vehicles.

[mrbrian200]

Personally I think Musk might be headed toward crazytown. That business with the kids trapped in that cave and his submarine "proposal". Without even consulting boots on the ground as to whether something like that would even be suitable, sounding (somewhat condescending to the rescue personell/divers) like he could just swoop in to save the day and materialize a mini sub at a moments notice out of spare parts he's got floating around in his a__ really made me wonder.

[oragex]

lincoln.jpg

Who's the boss ??

[matthew1]

I think we're past the EV viability arguments, right? It's been hotly debated and tested in the real world for 20-ish years now, and the consensus is the future is EV. As for rural areas, as with anything under the sun, there will always be edge cases where the solution doesn't fit... but they don't/won't/can't/didn't change what's coming.

EV is the Next Big Thing and it's coming quickly and surely.

Will Tesla survive is the question (one of many questions). I don't know, but they'd better get ready for all kinds of competition.

[matthew1]

Personally I think Musk might be headed toward crazytown. That business with the kids trapped in that cave and his submarine "proposal". Without even consulting boots on the ground as to whether something like that would even be suitable, sounding (somewhat condescending to the rescue personell/divers) like he could just swoop in to save the day and materialize a mini sub at a moments notice out of spare parts he's got floating around in his a__ really made me wonder.

Yes, he's not doing himself any favors. His "420" taking Tesla private moment was talk coming from someone with too little sleep. And he paid for it. ($20 million)

[93Regina]

Will Tesla survive is the question (one of many questions).

Guess What? Everyone Was Wrong About Tesla

Pretty much everything has been said about Tesla: it was selling vehicles at a loss and would never be able to make them under the right conditions and fast enough, that its founder was crazy and would lead the company to ruin, while one industry veteran acclaimed the Model S, calling on car collectors to buy one “before the company goes belly up.” But this quarter, Tesla has not only made tons of money, boosting its share price and giving the NASDAQ its best day in months, but has also fulfilled its production and distribution objectives, showing every sign of staying in the black, at least until it has to pay interest on loans in the first quarter of next year.

For once, this third quarter does not seem to be the exception: everything indicates the company has found a stable way to generate profits. What’s more, Tesla is no longer an industry quirk: many have laughed at its production difficulties, grossly underestimating the achievement of moving from a standing start to mass producing 80,000 vehicles per quarter, but the company is now outselling Porsche, Mercedes Benz and BMW, making it the best-selling domestically-made car in the United States, and what’s more with a model that while expensive, is more advanced technologically, as well as cheaper and much safer to run that its internal combustion powered competitors.

[matthew1]

If they have the same great numbers in two years when everybody's selling EVs in these classes, then Tesla is safe. They're at the tail end of the era of their first-mover advantage*. They've passed all kinds of tests and exceeded expectations. The real test starts soon IMHO.

* you've got $80 grand and want an EV. Where do you go? Tesla. There's been nobody else.

[93Regina]

* you've got $80 grand and want an EV. Where do you go? Tesla. There's been nobody else.

2019 Chevrolet Volt
MSRP: From $33,520
Model years‎: ‎2011–present

2019 Chevrolet Bolt EV
MSRP: From $36,620
Model years‎: ‎2017–present

[93Regina]

The real test starts soon IMHO

VW, Ford mull wide-ranging partnership in e-mobility, autonomous driving

Longtime rivals Ford and VW are considering joining forces to stay on top of massive investments in future technologies.
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The carmakers’ goal is to pool their resources for the massive investments needed in this new era of the automobile. In doing so, they may stand a chance of catching up with new rivals like Apple, Google parent Alphabet, and Tesla, which are all well-advanced in new technologies.