brand-new owner of a 2002 V70 XC.. and I think I got screwed

[AEgg]

Hi,

I'm so glad to have found this site!!! I need advice desperately. I apologize that this is a long post-- please bear with me.

Hubby and I purchased a 2002 V70 XC with 94,500 miles on Feb 15th from a small lot. We had pulled CarFax report and liked that it had been with a single owner and always serviced at a local Volvo dealership. It drove great on test drive, looked good, CarFax maintenance looked good, so we bought it.

A few days later, I noticed that it was shifting rough sometimes, though sometimes it was perfectly fine. I also had to turn the key 2-3 times to start it, but only once or twice. Since this is the car I drive our two little kids around in, hubby wanted to get it checked out to make sure I wouldn't get stranded somewhere.

This past Monday (March 3), I dropped it off at the same local dealer who had always serviced it. The service guy was nice enough to print out a service history summary for the car, and said that the previous owners hadn't done a recommended software update which "solves the problem you're describing 80% of the time." I left the car there, feeling like we were in good hands.

The next day he called and said that they needed to order an RPM sensor (?) and that they would have to order the part in, and wouldn't get it until Wednesday. Ok, fine. Wednesday afternoon he called and said he had to ask me some questions-- apparently the ordering system kicked back some code that he had to get special approval to order that part based on my answers? I didn't really understand, but was trying to be a good sport. These questions were all about the starting issue, not the shifting issue. I answered them all, and he said he could now order the part. Fine.

Wednesday came and I was told that they'd done the software update, but at the RPM sensor hadn't come in yet. They'd get it installed ASAP, and I could plan to pick up my car Thursday late morning-- but they'd call when it was done.

Thursday afternoon I called to ask if I was ever going to see my car again -- I was kidding around, still trying to be nice, but really wanting an update. He was unavailable, but I was told he'd call me back.

5:50 pm on Thursday, he called and said that the mechanic had finished all the work and test drove it... and the problem remained. Therefore, I need a new transmission, which will cost $3,800.00-- on top of the $550.00 for the work they did this week.

WTF?!?!

I'm beginning to suspect that the dealership knew this problem existed back in January when they last serviced the car, but all they put on the CarFax report was "vehicle serviced; engine/powertrain computer/module checked; transmission fluid changed". The service history they printed for me says they did an "engine & transmission diagnosis". Those are very different things!!!

So, here are my questions for you all:
1. Is it normal that the transmission needs to be replaced at 95k miles?

2. Am I just completely screwed???

I have to say, my Volvo ownership experience s not off to a great start. I miss my Nissan.

TIA for advice and the chance to vent.

Allison

[JRL]

So, here are my questions for you all:
1. Is it normal that the transmission needs to be replaced at 95k miles?

2. Am I just completely screwed???

I have to say, my Volvo ownership experience s not off to a great start. I miss my Nissan.

TIA for advice and the chance to vent.

Allison

About 60% of all 2001 transmissons have been replaced.
I would guess that maybe 25% of 2002 transmissions have been replaced.
The quick answer is that Volvo recommends no fluid changes. If an owner folllows this, it's a good chance their tranny will eventually fail.
The owners that have changed their fluid starting at 30-50K miles, their cars have lasted.
has the fluid been changed or not?
This is important.
If you are showing no codes I would give it a shot, have it flushed, get all available upgrade software and see what happens. The worst thing is you waste $250 or so.
You can buy a guaranteed used tranny from www.erievovo.com for about 900-$1110, install should be about $1200 or so, saving you a grand.
You need to be precise on what was done, actual parts and codes as to what has or has not been done to this point.
Good luck, I can't help any more without SPECIFICS now...

ALL THIS:
The next day he called and said that they needed to order an RPM sensor (?) and that they would have to order the part in, and wouldn't get it until Wednesday. Ok, fine. Wednesday afternoon he called and said he had to ask me some questions-- apparently the ordering system kicked back some code that he had to get special approval to order that part based on my answers? I didn't really understand, but was trying to be a good sport. These questions were all about the starting issue, not the shifting issue. I answered them all, and he said he could now order the part. Fine.
is BS. no such a part as an "RPM sensor" that In know of and no need to get an "approval" for a non warranty part. EVER
Carfax only takes a couple of sentences off a service report, it's not what "they" give to Carfax.
Carfax is not good for anything except titles and ownership history.

After re-reading this:
"A few days later, I noticed that it was shifting rough sometimes, though sometimes it was perfectly fine. I also had to turn the key 2-3 times to start it, but only once or twice. Since this is the car I drive our two little kids around in, hubby wanted to get it checked out to make sure I wouldn't get stranded somewhere.".
Please try to EXACTLY describe what shifting rough sometimes means (to you).
This is important.
Personally the starting issue right now is the one to get fixed, then do what I said, have the transmission serviced, all the adaptors reset (they know what this menas) and software downloaded if the car has any to take. If software has already been done, they can't do it twice, the car won't accept it

[MadeInJapan]

Ask them to reset the "Adaptives," not the Adaptors.
JRL is spot-on. However it looks like they did a transmission flush in January, no?

[AEgg]

MIJ & JRL,

Thanks for your replies.

Yes, transmission flush was done in January and appears to have also been done in 2006,at 71k mi.

by "Shifting rough" I mean that the tach would jump a bit sometimes when shifting from 2nd to 3rd, or 3rd to 4th-- like it wasn't quite sure if it was supposed to shift up or down. Also, sometimes when coming to a stop it would feel like the car would "clunk" to the stop instead of gliding gently-- not a brakes issue, though. Does that make sense?

We're off to meet with the dealership's service manager now, as the paper trail certainly seems to indicate that they were aware of this issue back in January and knowingly released a car needing major repair onto the market. With any luck, they'll both admit it and care enough to help us out. I'll also try to get the specific codes & parts which were replaced in the past.

Thanks again,

Allison

[JRL]

MIJ & JRL,

Thanks for your replies.

Yes, transmission flush was done in January and appears to have also been done in 2006,at 71k mi.

by "Shifting rough" I mean that the tach would jump a bit sometimes when shifting from 2nd to 3rd, or 3rd to 4th-- like it wasn't quite sure if it was supposed to shift up or down. Also, sometimes when coming to a stop it would feel like the car would "clunk" to the stop instead of gliding gently-- not a brakes issue, though. Does that make sense?

We're off to meet with the dealership's service manager now, as the paper trail certainly seems to indicate that they were aware of this issue back in January and knowingly released a car needing major repair onto the market. With any luck, they'll both admit it and care enough to help us out. I'll also try to get the specific codes & parts which were replaced in the past.

Thanks again,

Allison

Good luck on they doing anything for you.
Now I understand what you mean.
The upshift is called shift flare and is common with AW-55 transmissions.
Most of the time software or a new valvebody will fix that.

The clunking is strange. This is an 2001 issue when software they called "stop neutral" was installed in all the new cars, (A HUGE failure and was the primary cause for tranny failure)!
They removed it at almost the beginning of 2002, (some cars had it but to my knowledge, no XC's.
Did you say that (new) software had been installed in this transmission in the past?
ALL newer software (since 2006) automatically removes the stop neutral feature.
However if it has no stop neutral installed, this does not sound good, sorry

[JRL]

So what the heck happened? You didn't let us know the outcome.......

[AEgg]

Sorry for the delay in reporting back...

The dealership was very nice, but not much help. At the end of a 1-hour meeting with the service manager, his best advice was that we go through Volvo and see if they will help us due to the established history of problems with the transmission in this model year.

We're going to contact them this week and see how it goes. If all else fails, we'll just have to bite the bullet.

I'll keep you posted!

Thanks again,

Allison

[JRL]

Sorry for the delay in reporting back...

The dealership was very nice, but not much help. At the end of a 1-hour meeting with the service manager, his best advice was that we go through Volvo and see if they will help us due to the established history of problems with the transmission in this model year.

We're going to contact them this week and see how it goes. If all else fails, we'll just have to bite the bullet.


Allison

They're not going to do anything unless you can prove that the dealer KNEW of the problem and didn't disclose. Then you have to go after the dealer in small claims. At 90K miles Volvo will be of no help. If it were 55-60k maybe but not 45K out of warranty AND two years.
Best you should do is CHANGE THE FLUID if you haven't already, reset all the tranny adaptors. If you do that I will send you a "drive procedure" that you do immediately after pick up and take a shot, it may get better or good enough to just drive it

[AEgg]

Thanks JRL,

The fluid was change in January, and I'm not sure about the other stuff. I've talked to a couple of other Volvo mechanic and they agree that it sounds like the tranny needs replacing. The good news is, the dealership is going to cut us a bit of a deal on the pricing, so at least we won't have to bear the full brunt of it.

Thanks again

Allison

[sony2000]

AEgg, Read again JRLs suggestion above and do it. The "dealer will cut you a bit of a deal on the pricing" is getting you to pay for their mistake. And it won't be cheap $$$. There may be other repairs down the road. Imagine their face, if you follow JRL's advice and it works. Come to think of it, I couldn't bring myself to continue doing any business at that dealership. The delays were too fishy.