Wheel/Tire balance problem 2013 C30 (Resolved) Topic is solved

4cvixt · Post by **4cvixt** » 19 Feb 2023, 07:54

I have been having problems with wheel/tire balance issues. Below is the order of events to make this clear:

1. Bought a set of Nitto Motivas and installed on original wheels. All seemed to be fine, possibly a slight imbalance at 70 mph, but hardly noticeable.

2. Tire were rotated at 5K miles and a the car started shaking at highway speeds.

3. Tire shop re-balanced twice and finally said the problem was due to a bend wheel. (The wheel was actually bent). They said I needed new wheels.

4. After another 8K miles, I finally bought new wheels. The wheels are MSW, same size as original. The offset is 45mm compared to the original 52.5. The new wheels made the vibration worse until hub centric rings were installed. The wheels/tires were balanced again, but now I had a low speed wobble in the steering and still had vibration at highway speeds. I jacked up the car and rotated each wheel to check for proper mounting and bearing/suspension/steering problems.

5. I have a 2011 C30 R-design also, so I swapped all the wheels between the cars. The problem followed the wheels/tires. I checked this car for problems as with my other car.

6. The tire shop gave me a credit on the Nittos, and installed a new set of Falken tires. The low speed wobble is gone, but the car vibrates above 55mph. AGAIN, I put all the wheels/tires on my 2011 C30 and got the same results - no wobble, but the balance seems off.

Since the problem appears to be the same on both cars, there must be a balancing issue. The shop is Discount Tire. The said they were using the correct adapters on the balance machine, but they must be doing something wrong. It would be much simpler if something were wrong with my cars, but I can't find a problem. Both cars have approximately 78K miles and have been driven carefully. I am a mechanical engineer and have been restoring/repairing cars as a hobby for many years. I certainly don't know everything, but I have some experience.

Any advice? Thanks!

Post by **Krons** » 19 Feb 2023, 08:04

CV shafts in ok shape? Moving your wheels to the other car should’ve isolated that. The P1s are apparently hard on CV shafts.

My C70 has some vibrations too, I plan to put new CV shafts in to help rule that out before I go with new tires.

4cvixt · Post by **4cvixt** » 19 Feb 2023, 08:34

I think the CV shafts are good. I do not hear any noises when turning or notice any difference between accelerating or coasting. There is a very slight clicking noise when rotating the wheels with the car jacked up (the suspension is fully extended). The axles are extended down quite a bit when jacked up. All the CV joint boots are in good condition. The tires on my 2011 C30 need to be replaced (down to treadwear indicators), so they have a slight imbalance also, but the vibration is worse with the new wheels/tires than the old ones. I guess it is possible to have worn CV joints on both cars, but it seems improbable. I am trying to keep an open mind about any possibilities.

Post by **Krons** » 19 Feb 2023, 08:59

My kids S60 at 180k miles had vibration while accelerating at 70mph. After some diagnosis was the CV shafts, silky smooth after that. No clicking or clanking while turning interestingly.

Years ago I had Goodyears on a car that must’ve had an internal belt break, vibrated like crazy only after 40k, new tires fixed it. Maybe a warranty deal on your tires if the rims are true.

Post by **volvolugnut** » 19 Feb 2023, 09:17

When the tire/wheel spins is there any side to side runout? This could be checked on the spin balance machine or carefully checked on the drive axle with the wheel off the ground and drive engaged.
Some tire shops used to have mounted tire balance machines that would balance the entire rotating assembly on the vehicle.
Since the problem transferred to the other car, I think the problem is only the wheel and tire. You could isolate the single wheel/tire by swapping a single tire and testing for vibration until one is identified.
A good engineering test problem.
volvolugnut

4cvixt · Post by **4cvixt** » 19 Feb 2023, 09:44

I checked the wheels when mounted on both cars and there is no runout (using hub centric rings for the aftermarket wheels). I did not try mounting individual wheels since my R-design car has 18" wheels and my other C30 has 17" wheels. Ride height seems similar, but I did not want to mix them on one end of the car. The vibration sometimes gets a little better, then worse at around 70mph - as though more than one wheel were imbalanced. At 58 to 60 mph the vibration is nearly constant. I feel the vibration in the steering a little and in the seat.

I would expect vibration when accelerating with CV problems more than when at speed on a flat road. It seems to make no difference in my case. Are there any problems that both cars are likely to have at 78K miles? I haven't seen anything obvious when inspecting the suspension. The rear sway bar link bushings are starting to look deteriorated, but not worn out yet.

Thanks for the replies!!

4cvixt · Post by **4cvixt** » 19 Feb 2023, 10:55

Is it possible the difference in offset could cause this problem?? There is only a 7.5mm difference. I can see how it would exacerbate an imbalance, but not create one. The CV joint carrier bearing might cause a problem, but on both cars at the same time?

At some point, I will go back to the tire store again to make sure they used the correct adapters on the balance machine.

4cvixt · Post by **4cvixt** » 19 Feb 2023, 14:03

A small update: I had not driven the 2013 C30 after putting the new wheels/tires back on yesterday. When I drove it today, it was a little better - the vibration around 60 mph was less and the vibration at higher speeds was a little better, but it still comes and goes. It feels as though a better balance MIGHT fix the problem. I have read that P1 Volvos are sensitive to imbalance but don't know if it is true. The wheels were all put back on the same location they started at. Can tires start out with minor vibrations and get better after a few miles? Is it worth the trouble of swapping the tires front to back?

Post by **BlackBart** » 20 Feb 2023, 09:53

The thing that caught my eye was 'hub centric rings." By whom, how accurate? Do we know that a generic aftermarket wheel bore is actually centered on the hub?

4cvixt · Post by **4cvixt** » 21 Feb 2023, 06:38

Very good question. The hub centric rings are aluminum, I got them off Ebay. They are surprisingly well made. The inner and outer dimensions are correct for the hub/wheel combination. I measured them before installation. The tire store first fitted the wheels with plastic hub centric rings, but I got the metal ones to make sure there wasn't a problem with centering. At this point, I am hoping a better balance will smooth things out. It should not be so difficult.