07 S60 AC Help - Hot air/cycling compressor

[firstv70volvo]

He kept getting odd amounts out of the system repeatedly, which is why they think it’s a blockage of some kind. Possibly the valve. He hasn’t had time to look into it further since they last vacuumed and filled the system. But for the cheap cost of the valve, it was easy to just get and replace just in case.

The original AC system, while working fine, was putting a huge load on the engine with the factory 176k mile system. I understand AC puts a load on engines, but you could feel the compressor engaging as it would cycle, far more than it should have been. I’d even lose and gain speed on the highway. So another reason we think there was an existing blockage or worn valve that worsened when vacuumed.

Again he’s not an AC expert, and doesn’t have much experience working with them. He’s only ever ran into issues with my car, and funny enough another Volvo. Which was taken to another shop specializing in AC, but they’re having issues still too apparently.

Even if there were blockage the recovery machine typically uses hoses attached to both the low and high side so all refrigerant will be pump out of the system. You can hook up a recovery machine to only one side using just one hose but it would take a complete blockage to leave something in the system, very unlikely. There's nothing unusual about a Volvo AC system, it's a typical expansion valve type system used by many other car manufacturers.

With the original AC system and putting a huge load on the system, did this just start naturally? No work done on it before you noticed this happening, Is this why you replace the compressor? Any change after the new compressor?

[soulvoid21]

He kept getting odd amounts out of the system repeatedly, which is why they think it’s a blockage of some kind. Possibly the valve. He hasn’t had time to look into it further since they last vacuumed and filled the system. But for the cheap cost of the valve, it was easy to just get and replace just in case.

The original AC system, while working fine, was putting a huge load on the engine with the factory 176k mile system. I understand AC puts a load on engines, but you could feel the compressor engaging as it would cycle, far more than it should have been. I’d even lose and gain speed on the highway. So another reason we think there was an existing blockage or worn valve that worsened when vacuumed.

Again he’s not an AC expert, and doesn’t have much experience working with them. He’s only ever ran into issues with my car, and funny enough another Volvo. Which was taken to another shop specializing in AC, but they’re having issues still too apparently.

Even if there were blockage the recovery machine typically uses hoses attached to both the low and high side so all refrigerant will be pump out of the system. You can hook up a recovery machine to only one side using just one hose but it would take a complete blockage to leave something in the system, very unlikely. There's nothing unusual about a Volvo AC system, it's a typical expansion valve type system used by many other car manufacturers.

With the original AC system and putting a huge load on the system, did this just start naturally? No work done on it before you noticed this happening, Is this why you replace the compressor? Any change after the new compressor?

Original high load issue was definitely a gradual thing I noticed over time. No work to the AC system at all to my knowledge, and certainly none during my time of ownership.

Condenser was originally changed due to fin damage. 100% of the lower half of the fins were smashed in, completely blocking airflow on the lower half. Concern was of possible overheating issues as this is going to be our road trip car. Compressor was then changed as a potential fix for the short cycling problem, plus the clutch was very worn and way out of spec. Mechanic said it was in very rough shape when they took it out, could barely turn it.

[firstv70volvo]

He kept getting odd amounts out of the system repeatedly, which is why they think it’s a blockage of some kind. Possibly the valve. He hasn’t had time to look into it further since they last vacuumed and filled the system. But for the cheap cost of the valve, it was easy to just get and replace just in case.

The original AC system, while working fine, was putting a huge load on the engine with the factory 176k mile system. I understand AC puts a load on engines, but you could feel the compressor engaging as it would cycle, far more than it should have been. I’d even lose and gain speed on the highway. So another reason we think there was an existing blockage or worn valve that worsened when vacuumed.

Again he’s not an AC expert, and doesn’t have much experience working with them. He’s only ever ran into issues with my car, and funny enough another Volvo. Which was taken to another shop specializing in AC, but they’re having issues still too apparently.

Even if there were blockage the recovery machine typically uses hoses attached to both the low and high side so all refrigerant will be pump out of the system. You can hook up a recovery machine to only one side using just one hose but it would take a complete blockage to leave something in the system, very unlikely. There's nothing unusual about a Volvo AC system, it's a typical expansion valve type system used by many other car manufacturers.

With the original AC system and putting a huge load on the system, did this just start naturally? No work done on it before you noticed this happening, Is this why you replace the compressor? Any change after the new compressor?

Original high load issue was definitely a gradual thing I noticed over time. No work to the AC system at all to my knowledge, and certainly none during my time of ownership.

Condenser was originally changed due to fin damage. 100% of the lower half of the fins were smashed in, completely blocking airflow on the lower half. Concern was of possible overheating issues as this is going to be our road trip car. Compressor was then changed as a potential fix for the short cycling problem, plus the clutch was very worn and way out of spec. Mechanic said it was in very rough shape when they took it out, could barely turn it.

After the compressor and condenser were change has the AC worked at all, any cool air? Has the noticeable huge load while driving been fixed with the new compressor?
With the condition of the old compressor there could be wear particles from the compressor in the system. Did your mechanic do any flushing or did he notice any crud in the system when the parts were changed? When the compressor fails they can really gunk up the whole system and it's difficult to clean, just depends on how bad the compressor failed. When the system was apart to replace the compressor and condenser it should have been noticeable if the old compressor had failed badly. If your mechanic is unsure if the system is contaminated he can flush one or both of the high/low side hoses to check things out. If there is crud detected in the system you have to flush the evaporator, hoses and the condenser. You can't flush the compressor, expansion valve or receiver/drier. The condenser can be very difficult to clean but your's is newer so it may be salvageable.
With the new parts and the history of the old compressor it's important to first verify the system is clean, if it's clean you can reuse recovered refrigerant but if contaminated you don't want to reuse any of the recovered refrigerant and the system must be flush thoroughly.
Where does everything stand now, is the refrigerant charge correct and if so are you getting cold, cool or warm air out of the vents?

[soulvoid21]

Quick reply, so sorry if it’s not very detailed.

No cold air at all with new system. Compressor is not cycling long enough to make it cold.

Flushing the system is what he’s trying next, with the expansion valve replacement. No obviously noticeable contaminates when changing the original parts.

[abscate]

Everything is pointing to a system blockage , the performance and the shortened piece of cold “ hard pipe”

1000g in a 700g system is a huge overcharge, get the specs right. My p2 takes a 700g charge. You can’t guess at this, it will damage the compressor if you overcharge by 50%. The P2 is really sophisticated at protecting the compressor from liquid, it actually engages the compressor briefly when cranking to kick out any liquid present thst might pool in it.

[firstv70volvo]

Quick reply, so sorry if it’s not very detailed.

No cold air at all with new system. Compressor is not cycling long enough to make it cold.

Flushing the system is what he’s trying next, with the expansion valve replacement. No obviously noticeable contaminates when changing the original parts.

From what I can tell you have had a refrigerant charge of 700kg, 1000kg and 1300kg in the system. The dealer said it needs 1000g based on your VIN. If the compressor is short cycling at both 700kg and 1000kg charge levels there's another problem other than the charge. If the system pressure is too low or too high the compressor will be commanded to shut off, the pressure switch is on the receiver/drier. What are the gauge readings saying?
If the pressure sensor is working correctly and there's is a blockage in the system, I would expect you to see have a very high pressure reading on the high side gauge and a lower than expected reading on the low side gauge. Another indication of a blockage is the gauge readings after the running the compressor and watching how long it take for the low and high gauges to equalize after shutting off the engine. It shouldn't take more than a few minutes for these gauges to equalize. When you replaced the condenser was the receiver/drier also replaced? When your mechanic has the system apart for flushing it should be easy to determine if there's any blockage in the condenser, evaporator or hoses. You can't flush the expansion valve or receiver/drier but you should check these for blockage with some compressed air with these components. Because you've replaced the condenser and will be replacing the expansion valve you should pay special attention to the receiver/drier if this has not been replaced, this will be a likely area for blockage. Check the old expansion valve with air too, at room temp air should flow freely through it.
Did the short cycling begin with the new compressor?

[soulvoid21]

Quick reply, so sorry if it’s not very detailed.

No cold air at all with new system. Compressor is not cycling long enough to make it cold.

Flushing the system is what he’s trying next, with the expansion valve replacement. No obviously noticeable contaminates when changing the original parts.

From what I can tell you have had a refrigerant charge of 700kg, 1000kg and 1300kg in the system. The dealer said it needs 1000g based on your VIN. If the compressor is short cycling at both 700kg and 1000kg charge levels there's another problem other than the charge. If the system pressure is too low or too high the compressor will be commanded to shut off, the pressure switch is on the receiver/drier. What are the gauge readings saying?
If the pressure sensor is working correctly and there's is a blockage in the system, I would expect you to see have a very high pressure reading on the high side gauge and a lower than expected reading on the low side gauge. Another indication of a blockage is the gauge readings after the running the compressor and watching how long it take for the low and high gauges to equalize after shutting off the engine. It shouldn't take more than a few minutes for these gauges to equalize. When you replaced the condenser was the receiver/drier also replaced? When your mechanic has the system apart for flushing it should be easy to determine if there's any blockage in the condenser, evaporator or hoses. You can't flush the expansion valve or receiver/drier but you should check these for blockage with some compressed air with these components. Because you've replaced the condenser and will be replacing the expansion valve you should pay special attention to the receiver/drier if this has not been replaced, this will be a likely area for blockage. Check the old expansion valve with air too, at room temp air should flow freely through it.
Did the short cycling begin with the new compressor?

Dryer was replaced as part of the condenser, it came with the replacement.

Short cycling started after changing the condenser first. Cycling continued with the new compressor.

Idea to check for blockage is exactly as you said. Tear it down and try with compressed air on the parts possible. Just changing the expansion valve regardless because it’s cheap/easy enough, and one less thing for me to worry about later on.

I don’t know the pressure readings yet. They vacuumed the system in preparation to tear it down to check for blockages. So I guess that’s our next step. If we don’t find any and continue to have issues, I’ll get exact pressure readings during multiple scenarios.

[abscate]

Not clear where a 2007 S60 fits in this chart..

[soulvoid21]

Everything is pointing to a system blockage , the performance and the shortened piece of cold “ hard pipe”

1000g in a 700g system is a huge overcharge, get the specs right. My p2 takes a 700g charge. You can’t guess at this, it will damage the compressor if you overcharge by 50%. The P2 is really sophisticated at protecting the compressor from liquid, it actually engages the compressor briefly when cranking to kick out any liquid present thst might pool in it.

I provided my VIN to two separate dealers and both told me 1kg.

The compressor engaging at startup makes sense when explained as you did. I figured it was something such as that. This might explain too why I’ve had to replace my starter twice. I get very hard cranks randomly with the jumping tachometer, even with a good battery, and stumbling up to idle RPMs. Once the engine is running, car is totally fine. This started too around the time I noticed the AC putting excessive load on the engine.

[firstv70volvo]

Quick reply, so sorry if it’s not very detailed.

No cold air at all with new system. Compressor is not cycling long enough to make it cold.

Flushing the system is what he’s trying next, with the expansion valve replacement. No obviously noticeable contaminates when changing the original parts.

From what I can tell you have had a refrigerant charge of 700kg, 1000kg and 1300kg in the system. The dealer said it needs 1000g based on your VIN. If the compressor is short cycling at both 700kg and 1000kg charge levels there's another problem other than the charge. If the system pressure is too low or too high the compressor will be commanded to shut off, the pressure switch is on the receiver/drier. What are the gauge readings saying?
If the pressure sensor is working correctly and there's is a blockage in the system, I would expect you to see have a very high pressure reading on the high side gauge and a lower than expected reading on the low side gauge. Another indication of a blockage is the gauge readings after the running the compressor and watching how long it take for the low and high gauges to equalize after shutting off the engine. It shouldn't take more than a few minutes for these gauges to equalize. When you replaced the condenser was the receiver/drier also replaced? When your mechanic has the system apart for flushing it should be easy to determine if there's any blockage in the condenser, evaporator or hoses. You can't flush the expansion valve or receiver/drier but you should check these for blockage with some compressed air with these components. Because you've replaced the condenser and will be replacing the expansion valve you should pay special attention to the receiver/drier if this has not been replaced, this will be a likely area for blockage. Check the old expansion valve with air too, at room temp air should flow freely through it.
Did the short cycling begin with the new compressor?

Dryer was replaced as part of the condenser, it came with the replacement.

Short cycling started after changing the condenser first. Cycling continued with the new compressor.

Idea to check for blockage is exactly as you said. Tear it down and try with compressed air on the parts possible. Just changing the expansion valve regardless because it’s cheap/easy enough, and one less thing for me to worry about later on.

I don’t know the pressure readings yet. They vacuumed the system in preparation to tear it down to check for blockages. So I guess that’s our next step. If we don’t find any and continue to have issues, I’ll get exact pressure readings during multiple scenarios.

So the short cycling of the compressor began when the condenser was replaced, the short cycling happened with both compressors? The receiver/drier was replaced at the same time too? Was the pressure switch from the old receiver/drier transferred to the new receiver/drier, was the wiring harness connector plugged in correctly to the sensor? I'm having a hard time thinking the new parts have a blockage so am questioning the installation of the new parts and something may have been done incorrectly. It's not out the question there could be something could be wrong with the condenser or receiver/drier but this seems less probable to me.