Login Register

00 V70 XC SE What's up with the security screws on the MAF?

Help, Advice and DIY Tutorials on Volvo's P80 platform cars -- Volvo's 1990s "bread and butter" cars -- powered by the ubiquitous and durable Volvo inline 5-cylinder engine.

1992 - 1997 850, including 850 R, 850 T-5R, 850 T-5, 850 GLT
1997 - 2000 S70, S70 AWD
1997 - 2000 V70, V70 AWD
1997 - 2000 V70-XC
1997 - 2004 C70

This topic is in the MVS Volvo Repair Database » What's Up With Volvo's Security Screws On MAF?
Post Reply
User avatar
instarx
Posts: 752
Joined: 20 April 2008
Year and Model: XC70 T6 2011
Location: North Carolina
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 1 time

Re: 00 V70 XC SE What's up with the security screws on the

Post by instarx »

FLXC90 wrote:All the parts stores sell the bit sets also for around $10. OEMs /suppliers used tamper-proof on critical systems-critical being the ones the Governments required, like emissions control equipment.
Ahhh, now that makes a lot of sense. The MAF directly effects emissions, so it may have to be tamper resistant by law.
2011 XC70 T6 - current
2017 Alfa Romeo Giulia Q2 - Totaled in 2022. Not my fault.
2011 XC60 - sold
2000 V70XC - given to a friend, wish I still had it.

User avatar
dosbricks
Posts: 1116
Joined: 30 December 2004
Year and Model: '96 855, '98 S70
Location: South Texas
Been thanked: 2 times

Post by dosbricks »

instarx wrote:I went with an AIP Electronics MAF, which I chose for price.

I do recognize the importance of OEM when the parts are safety related, but a MAF is just no big deal....
MAF is telling your ECM the amount (quantity) of air being pulled into the manifold and using that info the ECM sets the fuel/air ratio and fine tunes it based on the feedback from the O2 sensors. Pretty critical device, especially considering the very tight parameters of a Volvo.

Good luck. I tried the aftermarket route once. It was money wasted in the long run.
'98 S70, 230k, purchased new in '98
'96 855 GLT, 163k, purchased lightly used in '99
Onceuponatime RIP '69 Shelby GT500 w/7.0 liter

User avatar
rspi
Posts: 7303
Joined: 5 November 2011
Year and Model: 850 T-5R Wagon
Location: Cincinnati OH
Has thanked: 34 times
Been thanked: 72 times
Contact:

Post by rspi »

The '94 - '97 cars have the T20 6 point security bit but the '98 has that funky 5 point bit. I got one from Pepboys for about $5.
'95 855 T-5R M, Panther - 22/28 mpg, 546,000 miles
'95 955 T-5R Yellow Wagon, Lemonade, 180,000 miles
--------------------
Volvo's of past: '87 740 GLE, '79 262C Bertone, '78 264, 960's, '98 S70 GLT, '95 850 T-5R YellowVolvo Repair Videos

Atis
Posts: 105
Joined: 20 April 2013
Year and Model: S70 GLT 1998
Location: Hungary
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 4 times

Post by Atis »

A MAF's sensor plate is a precisely fitted/designed device to the actual housing (i.e. plastic tube) as it is very sensitive to airflow. If the mechanic messes around with it, it can goes out from tolerance.
It could be that you will not notice it during driving, but the measured values will be off. In case of constant engine rpm, the O2 sensor will compensate it, but during non-steady state, your engine will run too much lean or rich.

User avatar
misha
Posts: 5379
Joined: 7 December 2008
Year and Model: '97 850 2.5 20v
Location: Serbia
Has thanked: 152 times
Been thanked: 402 times

Post by misha »

Atis....modern Maf sensors are actually electronic microchip which is fitted inside of the insert.

You can only fit it one way...you can't go wrong.

There are no settings and no tolerances which can be disturbed like on mechanical maf of previous generation.

I disassembled one of those few years ago and i precisely know what is inside of that insert.
'97 850 2.5 20v / fully equipped / Motronic 4.4 from the factory / upgraded with S,V,C,XC70 instrument cluster / polar white wagon
History of Volvos in the family:
'71 144 S
'73 144 De Luxe
'78 244 DL
'78 244 DL
'79 244 GLE
'85 340 GLS

Atis
Posts: 105
Joined: 20 April 2013
Year and Model: S70 GLT 1998
Location: Hungary
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 4 times

Post by Atis »

I know them well... :)
In our MAFs there is a ceramic plate for the sensor and the compensating resistors, (inside the airflow) and another ceramic plate with the circuits (inside the plastic part). What I was thinking is that it could be that an over tightening can damage the ceramic plate or result a non optimum placement of the resistor. I mean fractions of millimeter. They are REALLY sensitive for the correct placement inside the tube.
Beside these (as it was previously mentioned) the most likely reason for the safety screw is indeed not to mess up the emission.

User avatar
instarx
Posts: 752
Joined: 20 April 2008
Year and Model: XC70 T6 2011
Location: North Carolina
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 1 time

Post by instarx »

Atis wrote:A MAF's sensor plate is a precisely fitted/designed device to the actual housing (i.e. plastic tube) as it is very sensitive to airflow. If the mechanic messes around with it, it can goes out from tolerance.
It could be that you will not notice it during driving, but the measured values will be off. In case of constant engine rpm, the O2 sensor will compensate it, but during non-steady state, your engine will run too much lean or rich.
I see your logic in the need for security screws, but I think it is more a matter of a legal requirement than an actual need to secure it in a super critical position. In reality the sensor placement in the sleeve isn't that critical as long as it is the same sensor. I am an engineer by training and have many years experience in designing ducts and measuring airflow and mass airflow in duct work - and moving the sensor a millimeter or two in the collar isn't going to make a bit of difference.

Have you seen that square grid on the upstream side of the MAF assembly? The common explanation is that it protects the sensor and keeps it clean, but that is incorrect (really, how many BB-sized dirt particles need to be filtered out downstream of the air filter... none!) The grid is actually a device to straighten the airflow through the sensor-tube. By making the flow laminar the designers create a duct with a fairly large sweet spot in which the sensor unit can be positioned.

You may also notice that the exposed heated wire in the sensor unit is a long one that extends from near the center of the duct toward the edge. This orientation also reduces the need for critical placement of the sensor since it measures airflow in a cross-sectional area of the duct and not simply at a point (which would make positioning critical).
2011 XC70 T6 - current
2017 Alfa Romeo Giulia Q2 - Totaled in 2022. Not my fault.
2011 XC60 - sold
2000 V70XC - given to a friend, wish I still had it.

Atis
Posts: 105
Joined: 20 April 2013
Year and Model: S70 GLT 1998
Location: Hungary
Has thanked: 1 time
Been thanked: 4 times

Post by Atis »

I fully agree with you that the most likely reason for the screws is the legal requirements.

I know the design of the MAF (obviously not 100% depth). In the 850/S70 Volvos there is a hot film MAF and not a hot wire MAF. Although it does not matter in this case, as it works as you described, measure an "average" value. I was told by the responsible design engineers that it is really sensitive for placement, therefore I was thinking on that scenario. The grid was designed in a way to make the airflow laminar, just as you mention and I know that they worked a lot just on designing that grid.

User avatar
misha
Posts: 5379
Joined: 7 December 2008
Year and Model: '97 850 2.5 20v
Location: Serbia
Has thanked: 152 times
Been thanked: 402 times

Post by misha »

It's very sensitive and very fragile to the touch.

That's the reason why it's important not to touch the film when there is a need for cleaning it.Just spraying with a special maf cleaner and drying before re-installation.
'97 850 2.5 20v / fully equipped / Motronic 4.4 from the factory / upgraded with S,V,C,XC70 instrument cluster / polar white wagon
History of Volvos in the family:
'71 144 S
'73 144 De Luxe
'78 244 DL
'78 244 DL
'79 244 GLE
'85 340 GLS

vjaneczko
Posts: 1550
Joined: 27 March 2006
Year and Model: 2006 S60R
Location: San Antonio, TX
Been thanked: 6 times

Post by vjaneczko »

You can always use a Dremel or a thin saw and cut a notch into the screw head so you can use a standard screwdriver whenever you wish.
"He attacked everything in life with a mix of extraordinary genius and naive incompetence, and it was often difficult to tell which was which." - Douglas Adams

1997 855 GLT - R.I.P.
2006 S60R - For ME!

Post Reply
  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post