HEAT!! (for your feet...and hands...in the garage) Topic is solved

[abscate]

Actually every house is fed 220 just like EU in North America

We just use each phase separately to drive our high current, 120 vac appliances referenced to ground

That makes our wiring a bit more complicated as you have hot neutral and ground and have to balance the phases as you add in your electric bed massager, 50 kW heat system to maintain 23C +- 0.2C

[RickHaleParker]

I thought you had 120 over there?

That is correct. European households get one phase of a three phase generator, delivered as 220V. North America households gets two phases of a three phase generator delivered as 110/120V.

In North America, the two phases are combined to get 220/240V for energy hungry gadgets such as Electric clothes dryers, Electric cook stoves, some Electric motors, Arc welders ... etc. That keeps the current from burning up the wiring.

110/120V gadgets are loaded on just one of the phases, each 120V phase feeds different 120V circuits in the house.

Another way to do it is take a 220/240V single phase and center tap the secondary of the last transformer to get 240 single phase split into 120V/120V. Each 120V used 1/2 of the secondary winding. To get 240 you use the whole secondary winding.

[BlackBart]

Over here it's simply illegal for us idiots to make any fixed electrical installation but the certified electrician can go ahead and just do anything that's generally allowed.

If a licensed electrician here does any sub-standard work and an inspector finds it later, he/she can lose their license. He's cautious about me saying I'll wire up part of it, thinking it won't be quite right and he'll have to tear it out and re-do it all on my dime. It's his license and reputation.

I asked once about adding an outlet in a small bathroom with only a light. There's a rule that won't allow lights and outlets on the same circuit in a bathroom and he said nope, we can't do that. I have a very modern 40s house with no attic of basement to run wires, and in those days a bedroom had only one outlet in it - no alarm clocks and gadgets then. So we're limited in what we can do without cutting up the slab.

[xiami]

Any one installed this overhead natural gas heaters:

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00006L7UZ/?c ... _lig_dp_it

[cn90]

If you really want a simple solution w/o messing with the house 220V system or natural gas line, then buy the LP thingy.
All you need is the propane tank (same tank for the BBQ grill).
Just make sure you have BOTH smoke detector and Carbon Monoxide detector in the garage and use it appropriately (turn it off when not in garage, avoid tipping it over etc.), then this will serve your need.

This unit is similar idea to some restaurants that heat the patio in the Fall:

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Dyna-Glo-40 ... /203534107

[cn90]

Alternatively, if you have a BBQ grill, you can use it indoor (just do not cook any food in it).
Basically, you are using the propane tank and the burners as heater.
Again, use caution (smoke detector and Carbon Monoxide detector in the garage)...

[volvolugnut]

I overhead radiant heaters are common around here in commercial work shops. They can heat an area or can heat in the radiant zone below the heater. If you install them, consider where you will be working mostly.
volvolugnut

[Allgonquin]

You can figure out roughly how much it costs per hour to run. Take your all-in cost per kWh from your electric bill, let's say it's $0.14/kWh, and multiply by 5, assuming your 5000W heater actually uses 5 kW. So it's costing you $0.70/hour. Or multiply by whatever the kW ratings are at the lower settings. Of course it's probably a little unlikely that the heater will run continuously at full blast for a solid hour at a time, but maybe it will when it's heating up the garage. And the fan on the heater probably uses some watts also, figure maybe 100 or 200W (0.1 or 0.2 kW) or so. The heater specs may give the fan motor size.

[BlackBart]

....BEEP.....BEEP......THIS JUST IN.........

HEATER IS RUNNING STOP
FACTORY OIL BURNING OFF ELEMENTS STOP
SETTING OFF GARAGE SMOKE DETECTORS STOP


My Very Good Electrician is very picky, but things don't burn down. All of the metal outlet boxes I put up are too small - out they came. None of the brand new receptacles I brought with me from Seattle meet new codes - can't use them. All outlets and overhead light runs need to be in conduit - no Romex on this job! Heater 240 is in flex armor cable all the way to the panel. GFI outlet on each outlet circuit.

Installed fixtures and tested last night. Shopped until I was purple.....$150 fixtures, $80 fixtures, all made in China; it's hard to avoid. I settled on the $28 Costco 42W LED with good color and many good reviews. A builder friend has them in his shop with no issues.

These are with just two on them on with an extension cord. It will be bright, and they have pull chains so I can shut off the un-needed ones, and above the doors when they're open. Lights located around perimeter of cars for working. Double-checked overhead door clearance!! Insulation next.

[matthew1]

You can figure out roughly how much it costs per hour to run. Take your all-in cost per kWh from your electric bill, let's say it's $0.14/kWh, and multiply by 5, assuming your 5000W heater actually uses 5 kW. So it's costing you $0.70/hour. Or multiply by whatever the kW ratings are at the lower settings. Of course it's probably a little unlikely that the heater will run continuously at full blast for a solid hour at a time, but maybe it will when it's heating up the garage. And the fan on the heater probably uses some watts also, figure maybe 100 or 200W (0.1 or 0.2 kW) or so. The heater specs may give the fan motor size.

Whoa. This is cheaper to run than the 5000W rating had me believe. Simple math set me straight. Thanks for parsing it out. Electricity here in Denver is $0.11/kWh.

(I could heat the outdoors.)