1997 850 2.4 Non Turbo BIG PROBLEMS

Post by **Ozark Lee** » 05 Mar 2008, 17:56

It very well could be an injector that is not sealing thus allowing fuel to flow continuously. With your symptoms I would pull the fuel rail out of the intake manifold. Crank the car and observe the fuel spray out if each injector.

Purchase a new set of injector O rings and caps for the injectors before you even start since you will likely need them.

Beyond that I would next look at the fuel pressure regulator. The manual pinned at the top of the 850 page as a good test procedure but you will need a fuel pressure gauge.

...Lee

sony2000 · Post by **sony2000** » 05 Mar 2008, 18:29

If that injector is wide open, wouldn't removing the wire to it, be ineffective? That seems to be where raw gas is getting into, and out of the system, without being burned.

Post by **Ozark Lee** » 05 Mar 2008, 18:54

It occurs to me that the procedure I described will likely not work due to the metal fuel lines to the rail. It worked like a champ when I had an injector problem on my daughter's Porsche but it has rubber lines to the fuel rail.

Let me modify the procedure to suggest that you add short (2 or 3 inches or so) pieces of rubber fuel lines to the inlet and outlet lines to the fuel rail. As memory serves they are both flare fittings so a slightly large fuel line that would fit the fuel rail side would work with the appropriate hose clamps.

To be clear, I wasn't suggesting unplugging the wires but I was suggesting removing the rail itself to observe the spray. If there is a problem with an injector it will be very obvious.

...Lee

motodude4 · Post by **motodude4** » 07 Mar 2008, 16:49

Ozark, Thank you for your suggestion. However I have tried what you suggested and all the fuel injectors are spraying a mist of fuel just as they should.

Honestly I have no idea what is wrong.

Any Ideas anyone?

Post by **lewismug** » 07 Mar 2008, 17:03

Have you checked to see that all cylinders are getting fire to them? If one plug was wet when you pulled it out, then that tells me that that particular cylinder is either being flooded with way too much fuel, or it isn't firing, therefore not burning the fuel being injected at all.

Post by **Ozark Lee** » 07 Mar 2008, 17:32

However I have tried what you suggested and all the fuel injectors are spraying a mist of fuel just as they should.

That more or less eliminates one problem. Well done.

Check your fuel pressure regulator. There have been failures with the FPR that results in sucking raw gas into the vacuum line and thus into the intake manifold.

...Lee

sony2000 · Post by **sony2000** » 08 Mar 2008, 06:58

If not the injector, then its the spark. The tick tick is the sound of the spark going somewhere other than to the plug. The coil tower, plug, etc. Tonight, in the dark, open the hood and look for an electrical arching in the ignition system (blue spark).

julesr_23 · Post by **julesr_23** » 14 Mar 2008, 14:39

What a pickle... Is the Tick tick tick rough enough to indicate a dead cylinder? In addition to the previous suggestion, take out the spark plug (of the cylinder with the wet plug), then put it back into the distributor line. Get someone to turn the car over (just for a second) and see if you're sparking. It seems to me that the distributor wire is burnt, therefore causing the dead cylinder. The gas that's getting injected is thus going straight out into the tail pipe, where the heat of the exhaust from the other four cylinders is smoldering it (not burning it completely, but just smoking it), causing the white smoke. So if its not sparking (and the plug looks in relative health), change the distributor wires, and maybe even the cap (i'd also change the other plugs because of the strain on them).
I hope this may have "sparked" a solution. (I know...barf)
Cheers,
good luck
-J

Post by **MadeInJapan** » 14 Mar 2008, 15:47

I'm for raising the hood in the dark with the car at idle and see if you see arcing (the source of the tic tic tic). Theoretical, yes....but also very practical. This will tell you which wire if any is bad too.

The other suggestions by julesr_23 are most excellent and shows some real expertise and insight in automotive trouble shooting.

motodude4 · Post by **motodude4** » 18 Mar 2008, 18:41

The Tick tick tick wasnt really effecting the engine. It just got louder with rpm. But on the bright side, After pulling the head, I believe I have found the problem.

I took out each hydraulic lifter out of the engine, all 20 of them. As I checked them, they all seemed fine. As I would pull out and push in the oil would very slowly creep out, or creep back in to the lifter. However, Both of the exhaust lifters on the second cylinder from the passengers side, moved back and forth with ease. And a great distance I might add. I would estimate they moved back and forth around .100-.200 inch. easily.

However thats just an estimate.

So I believe that I have found the cause of my tick tick tick. None of the other lifters behaved this way.

Any thoughts of the consequences that this would cause with my engine? is there any way that this could have caused the white smoke?

At my local parts store the manager there told me that it could even have been caused by brake fluid being sucked back into the engine from the vacume line. Is that possible on this engine?