Login Register

Is this a collapsed subframe bushing?

Help, Advice and DIY Tutorials on Volvo's P80 platform cars -- Volvo's 1990s "bread and butter" cars -- powered by the ubiquitous and durable Volvo inline 5-cylinder engine.

1992 - 1997 850, including 850 R, 850 T-5R, 850 T-5, 850 GLT
1997 - 2000 S70, S70 AWD
1997 - 2000 V70, V70 AWD
1997 - 2000 V70-XC
1997 - 2004 C70
Post Reply
xHeart
Posts: 3306
Joined: 3 December 2011
Year and Model: 2.0/3.2
Location: Great Lakes - USA
Has thanked: 113 times
Been thanked: 115 times

Volvo Repair Database Is this a collapsed subframe bushing?

Post by xHeart »

The suspension parts are looking degraded, worn out. The survey shows few AFTs.
Read through several post on MVS. From the cn90 posts and responses, i take it would be best to replace most of these parts at the same time, and get one complete wheel alignment afterward. I am asking again why not go with all Volvo, since the Volvo parts are not that far off Volvo/OEM/SACHS/Bilstein TC mix.

Meanwhile, I have railroad style clunk. Here are two photos of rear subframe bushing while it sat on two jack stand which I had placed under the subframe near each lower control arm. Wheels are off, it was raised just enough to remove the two front wheels for suspension check up.
passenger side - subframe bushing
passenger side - subframe bushing
MVS_0335.jpg (405.16 KiB) Viewed 8189 times
Driver side rear bushing appears collapsed, it is becoming metal to metal, is it? Also, notice a wider gap between lower part of bushing and subframe.
driver side - subframe bushing appears collapsed
driver side - subframe bushing appears collapsed
MVS_0334.jpg (425.63 KiB) Viewed 8189 times
Is it safe to replace the bushing with few jack stands, and wheels on? Does it need alignment of any kind afterward?
The post from Bill of Durham is bit short on detail for me, and it point to a special tool, where do you find one?
Is there write up with details, like cn90 style.

Many thanks!
--
Golden-German Shepherd | 2021 XC90 T6 INSCRIPTION (Nexa) | 2020 V60CC (Frska) | 2013A XC90 (Lktra)
Past: Golden Retriever | 2001 V70XC | 1997 Volvo 854 | 1989 Volvo 740 GL | 1979 Volvo 240
Top
xHeart
Posts: 3306
Joined: 3 December 2011
Year and Model: 2.0/3.2
Location: Great Lakes - USA
Has thanked: 113 times
Been thanked: 115 times

Post by xHeart »

Is this post applicable today for replacing subframe bushing on '97 850 NA viewtopic.php?t=9720?

Who would lend me the tool?
--
Golden-German Shepherd | 2021 XC90 T6 INSCRIPTION (Nexa) | 2020 V60CC (Frska) | 2013A XC90 (Lktra)
Past: Golden Retriever | 2001 V70XC | 1997 Volvo 854 | 1989 Volvo 740 GL | 1979 Volvo 240
Top
User avatar
rspi
Posts: 7303
Joined: 5 November 2011
Year and Model: 850 T-5R Wagon
Location: Cincinnati OH
Has thanked: 34 times
Been thanked: 72 times
Contact:
Contact rspi
..

Post by rspi »

That bushing looks good to me.
'95 855 T-5R M, Panther - 22/28 mpg, 546,000 miles
'95 955 T-5R Yellow Wagon, Lemonade, 180,000 miles
--------------------
Volvo's of past: '87 740 GLE, '79 262C Bertone, '78 264, 960's, '98 S70 GLT, '95 850 T-5R YellowVolvo Repair Videos
Top
Ben850
Posts: 1613
Joined: 8 September 2011
Year and Model: 1996 850 R Wagon
Location: Michigan
Been thanked: 7 times

Post by Ben850 »

You mentioned a "railroad" type of clunking noise. Have you replaced the lower right engine mount? It would be the one pictured in my avatar photo. That one has a tell tale metal to metal sound when it is collapsed.
1993 850 GLT , You wouldn't know it.
1996 850 Turbo Wagon White.
1995 T-5R Black. New work in progress.
1998 V70 XC Cross Country White.
1994 850 N/A Wagon Black.
1997 850 Sedan Black.
1996 850R Wagon White.
1997 850 Sedan Red ( not white or black!)
Top
User avatar
rspi
Posts: 7303
Joined: 5 November 2011
Year and Model: 850 T-5R Wagon
Location: Cincinnati OH
Has thanked: 34 times
Been thanked: 72 times
Contact:
Contact rspi
..

Post by rspi »

I've never head a metal sound when that mount is bad. All of mine has rubber under them and are still pretty quiet. You can tell that the one on the left was resting on the sub-frame.

Image
'95 855 T-5R M, Panther - 22/28 mpg, 546,000 miles
'95 955 T-5R Yellow Wagon, Lemonade, 180,000 miles
--------------------
Volvo's of past: '87 740 GLE, '79 262C Bertone, '78 264, 960's, '98 S70 GLT, '95 850 T-5R YellowVolvo Repair Videos
Top
Ben850
Posts: 1613
Joined: 8 September 2011
Year and Model: 1996 850 R Wagon
Location: Michigan
Been thanked: 7 times

Post by Ben850 »

Then yours wasn't totally collapsed. Mine was riding metal to metal on the subframe. There was no mistaking it. When I replaced it ( less than an hours work, while taking photos.) The noise, vibration, and hard metal bumping was completely gone.
In the high definition shot, you can click on it for a close look at the area that was making metal to metal contact.
Attachments
You can see the collapsed one clearly.
You can see the collapsed one clearly.
lower mount front.jpg (17.07 KiB) Viewed 8129 times
Frame rubbed on the bottom.
Frame rubbed on the bottom.
lower mount underside.jpg (17 KiB) Viewed 8129 times
This one is high definition.
This one is high definition.
IMG_1137.JPG (203.25 KiB) Viewed 8129 times
Last edited by Ben850 on 01 Oct 2012, 15:44, edited 1 time in total.
1993 850 GLT , You wouldn't know it.
1996 850 Turbo Wagon White.
1995 T-5R Black. New work in progress.
1998 V70 XC Cross Country White.
1994 850 N/A Wagon Black.
1997 850 Sedan Black.
1996 850R Wagon White.
1997 850 Sedan Red ( not white or black!)
Top
Ben850
Posts: 1613
Joined: 8 September 2011
Year and Model: 1996 850 R Wagon
Location: Michigan
Been thanked: 7 times

Post by Ben850 »

Just a few better shots to clarify. Note the differece in the distance between the crank pully, and the subframe, in the before and after shot. It had been rubbing so long, there is no indication of any rubber under the aluminum bracket that moves within the mount.
Attachments
IMG_1139.JPG
IMG_1139.JPG (137.56 KiB) Viewed 8128 times
IMG_1138.JPG
IMG_1138.JPG (213.64 KiB) Viewed 8128 times
IMG_1137.JPG
IMG_1137.JPG (203.25 KiB) Viewed 8128 times
IMG_1133.JPG
IMG_1133.JPG (149.86 KiB) Viewed 8128 times
1993 850 GLT , You wouldn't know it.
1996 850 Turbo Wagon White.
1995 T-5R Black. New work in progress.
1998 V70 XC Cross Country White.
1994 850 N/A Wagon Black.
1997 850 Sedan Black.
1996 850R Wagon White.
1997 850 Sedan Red ( not white or black!)
Top
User avatar
rspi
Posts: 7303
Joined: 5 November 2011
Year and Model: 850 T-5R Wagon
Location: Cincinnati OH
Has thanked: 34 times
Been thanked: 72 times
Contact:
Contact rspi
..

Post by rspi »

There is the difference between blown and destroyed.
'95 855 T-5R M, Panther - 22/28 mpg, 546,000 miles
'95 955 T-5R Yellow Wagon, Lemonade, 180,000 miles
--------------------
Volvo's of past: '87 740 GLE, '79 262C Bertone, '78 264, 960's, '98 S70 GLT, '95 850 T-5R YellowVolvo Repair Videos
Top
xHeart
Posts: 3306
Joined: 3 December 2011
Year and Model: 2.0/3.2
Location: Great Lakes - USA
Has thanked: 113 times
Been thanked: 115 times

Post by xHeart »

rspi wrote:There is the difference between blown and destroyed.
An attempt to make sense...
The rear subframe with bushing inserted, and bolted, it is a sandwich with plate at the bottom and the frame above. Lifting the frame with jack would lift the subframe with it since the plate at the bottom is bolted on to the frame.

Once the frame is raised on a jack, placing the jack-stand under the subframe, and then lowering the raised frame would leave the subframe fixed at the jack-stand height.

While the subframe is pushed upward against the frame, any gap or separation in sandwich layers, as the photo reveals, suggests erosion of sorts.

Is the bolt loose?
--
Golden-German Shepherd | 2021 XC90 T6 INSCRIPTION (Nexa) | 2020 V60CC (Frska) | 2013A XC90 (Lktra)
Past: Golden Retriever | 2001 V70XC | 1997 Volvo 854 | 1989 Volvo 740 GL | 1979 Volvo 240
Top
xHeart
Posts: 3306
Joined: 3 December 2011
Year and Model: 2.0/3.2
Location: Great Lakes - USA
Has thanked: 113 times
Been thanked: 115 times

Post by xHeart »

Should I replace rear subframe bushing before replacing suspension parts?
Is the gap normal?
Would it deteriorate further?
Would I find problem with bolt or where it treads?
Here are some photos...
passenger side appears OK - tucked in
passenger side appears OK - tucked in
MVS_0377.jpg (288.44 KiB) Viewed 8015 times
driver side
driver side
MVS_0369.jpg (347.2 KiB) Viewed 8015 times
driver side - tooth missing
driver side - tooth missing
MVS_0370.jpg (406.66 KiB) Viewed 8015 times
driver side
driver side
MVS_0374.jpg (277.9 KiB) Viewed 8015 times
--
Golden-German Shepherd | 2021 XC90 T6 INSCRIPTION (Nexa) | 2020 V60CC (Frska) | 2013A XC90 (Lktra)
Past: Golden Retriever | 2001 V70XC | 1997 Volvo 854 | 1989 Volvo 740 GL | 1979 Volvo 240
Top
Post Reply
  • Similar Topics
    Replies
    Views
    Last post

Return to “850, S70, V70, C70, V70-XC 1992-2000”